Breakdown of Weeden's 108.8 season rating

[Idgit]

It's clear that late in the game, they load up the box and dare Weeden and these WRs to beat them deep. Delvin Breaux shut down Williams for the majority of the game Sunday.

Why do you suppose it's only happening late in games? ATL, for example, didn't really change much at the half. And teams know we want to come out and run the ball.

 

[Doomsay]

Why do you suppose it's only happening late in games? ATL, for example, didn't really change much at the half. And teams know we want to come out and run the ball.

Atlanta changed at the half - they started to cheat on the underneath routes to stop Dunbar. They also overloaded the box more to stop the run.

 

[percyhoward]

I am not trying to keep knocking on the guy ..but my point is enough with these numbers .. they look good..but during the game he (as did other players) was the problem for killing drives ..

I tried to show both sides of it. He's got great 3rd-down numbers, but less than half of his 3rd-down completions result in a first down. We need to find ways to stay out of 3rd-and-long, even if it involves taking more risks than we'd like.

 

[CyberB0b]

Why do you suppose it's only happening late in games? ATL, for example, didn't really change much at the half. And teams know we want to come out and run the ball.

Probably because there is limited tape on this group. Now that the cat is out of the bag, it will be much easier to beat them. NO was one of the worst teams in the league going into the game.

 

[camelboy]

The problem with your eyeball test method is that it doesn't necessarily match my eyeball test method. That's why attempting to measure what's really going on makes so much sense.

But both eyeball test can agree when they see a bad throw, and he did a number of times .. both eyeball tests can agree when seeing him holding on the ball too long and allowing the pocket to collapse w/o getting rid of it when there is nothing to throw to..and he did...

With all good looking numbers a guy like him....4th yr in NFL? and the one taking snaps on Wednesdays ..he should not be doing drive-killing mistakes like these....

 

[Super_Kazuya]

But both eyeball test can agree when they see a bad throw, and he did a number of times .. both eyeball tests can agree when seeing him holding on the ball too long and allowing the pocket to collapse w/o getting rid of it when there is nothing to throw to..and he did...

With all good looking numbers a guy like him....4th yr in NFL? and the one taking snaps on Wednesdays ..he should not be doing drive-killing mistakes like these....

You have a very skewed idea of what someone who is probably the 30th to 40th best QB in the league should be.

If he was mobile, could read defenses and always threw the ball away every time... in addition to having his arm and size... he wouldn't be Weeden he would be John Elway. Got any more insane requirements for a backup QB (which by the way no other backup QBs seem to have either)?

 

[chris1995]

OL don't block, can't run. Can't run, can't pass. Can't pass, can't run. Teams load the box, can't run. When the box is loaded, QB has less time to throw. Can't pass, can't run.

Simple.

 

[Beast_from_East]

In the first half of Weeden's starts, Dallas ranks 4th in 3rd-down conversion percentage (55.6%).

In the second half of those games, we rank 32nd (0 of 9).

It's called adjustments my friend

Other teams make them at halftime while Garrett spends halftime looking for his next pack of gum, he doesn't want to run out during the 4th quarter

 

[windward]

You have a very skewed idea of what someone who is probably the 30th to 40th best QB in the league should be.

If he was mobile, could read defenses and always threw the ball away every time... in addition to having his arm and size... he wouldn't be Weeden he would be John Elway. Got any more insane requirements for a backup QB (which by the way no other backup QBs seem to have either)?

Nope. What other teams do doesn't matter. The Cowboys need to have an elite starting and backup quarterback. Failure to do so is an indictment of the organization as a whole.

/Zonelogic

 

[NextGenBoys]

Wow. Seeing the tangible difference in 1st and 2nd half tells me the coaches are doing a terrible job for the 2nd half gameplan.

 

[Kaiser]

Delvin Breaux shut down Williams for the majority of the game Sunday.

You spelled "interfered with" wrong. If you look at what they called on Claiborne and what they let Breaux get away with, it was definitely one sided. I agree with you generally on Williams, but when the team only has 3 WRs and the other two are Beasley and Street, the guy in TWill's spot isn't going to do a lot. Especially with the backup QB throwing the ball.

 

[dogberry]

Someone on the Cowboys' sideline should spray that soccer ref white foam five yards in front of Williams every play.

 

[TonyRomo17]

I was honestly surprised looking at DVOA rankings, the Cowboys are ranked 9 in offense and the defense 22 , obviously if Romo was playing both rankings would be better, but my point is Weeden has done enough IMO, the team needs to step up when ur franchise QB goes down and the defense has let us down

 

[Idgit]

Atlanta changed at the half - they started to cheat on the underneath routes to stop Dunbar. They also overloaded the box more to stop the run.

They really didn't change much at all. They just tackled better. They got off blocks. We helped them with a drop and some offensive penalties. And then our defense collapsed.

Their own HC and several players said as much explicitly after the game.

 

[Idgit]

But both eyeball test can agree when they see a bad throw, and he did a number of times .. both eyeball tests can agree when seeing him holding on the ball too long and allowing the pocket to collapse w/o getting rid of it when there is nothing to throw to..and he did...

With all good looking numbers a guy like him....4th yr in NFL? and the one taking snaps on Wednesdays ..he should not be doing drive-killing mistakes like these....

My eyeball test says yours is wrong. And mine agrees more with what the data suggests actually happened, for what that's worth.

 

[Zman5]

Our issue on offense is that we run 67% of the time on 1st down. Other teams know this and can go all out to stop the run and they will be right 2/3 of the time.

Funny thing is Weeden does well on 1st down when a pass is called on 1st down. Here are his stats against ATL and NO on first down.

Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD Int Sk Yds Y/A Rate
Brandon Weeden 11 18 61.1 159 0 1 0 0 8.8 66.7

I think what teams have been doing is play us normal in the first half. Once they see we are following our typical tendencies in the first half, they adjust and go all out to stop the run in the 2nd half.

Atlanta had a same pre-snap look on first down through out the game but I have a feeling they were told by the coaches to play the run and not worry about the pass in the second hal.

We should start to pass more on 1st downs.

 

[Zman5]

They really didn't change much at all. They just tackled better. They got off blocks. We helped them with a drop and some offensive penalties. And then our defense collapsed.

Their own HC and several players said as much explicitly after the game.

They had the same presnap look through out the game but I have a feeling the coaches told them not to worry about the pass in the second half and just play the run. There was no element of surpise in our favor. It's easier to make plays on defense when you have to worry about only one type of play before the snap.

When we did pass on first down (one time) WeDone connected with Witt for 8 yards.

 

[jnday]

But both eyeball test can agree when they see a bad throw, and he did a number of times .. both eyeball tests can agree when seeing him holding on the ball too long and allowing the pocket to collapse w/o getting rid of it when there is nothing to throw to..and he did...

With all good looking numbers a guy like him....4th yr in NFL? and the one taking snaps on Wednesdays ..he should not be doing drive-killing mistakes like these....

I agree with your eyeball test methods. This is a classic example of stats not telling the whole story. I know these stat guys don't believe it, but numbers don't win games.

 

[Idgit]

They had the same presnap look through out the game but I have a feeling the coaches told them not to worry about the pass in the second half and just play the run. There was no element of surpise in our favor. It's easier to make plays on defense when you have to worry about only one type of play before the snap.

When we did pass on first down (one time) WeDone connected with Witt for 8 yards.

Not sure that's how it works.

We only had four drives in that second half. Two were derailed by our own penalties and negative runs. One by a fourth down drop.

 

[Idgit]

I agree with your eyeball test methods. This is a classic example of stats not telling the whole story. I know these stat guys don't believe it, but numbers don't win games.

Numbers clearly don't win games. They measure how games are won, so that people can better figure out what works and doesn't work.

And they do that, because the 'eyeball test' is clearly subjective, as this very thread shows. You guys can describe your eyeball tests, and I sit here wondering what games you were watching, because to me, the issues were much bigger on defense than they were on offense. Especially against ATL. Clearly, we can't both be right if we're seeing opposite things, which makes eyeballing it pointless unless you just want to group people into two groups without any support whatsoever for which group is right and which is wrong.

The support is where the stats come in. From there, it's a rational debate about whether or not the right things are being measure and if they're being measured accurately.