Bucky Brooks: "It's a myth that elite QBs single-handedly carry their teams to wins"

thunderpimp91

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,595
Reaction score
18,336
Disagree, but Andy Reid said they couldn’t afford to pay him. No way did they want to move on from him. He’s the most dangerous, explosive WR in the entire league.
Andy Reid can say whatever he wants, coaches are rarely 100% truthful to the media and give political answers all the time. Ultimately with what they spent in free agency they could have signed Hill if they prioritized doing so, I'm not even sure how that is up for debate.

Sometimes teams walk away from really good players because they're getting value in return.
 

thunderpimp91

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,595
Reaction score
18,336
And I’ve discussed that with some….Chiefs choice other talent to keep over Tyreek….talent they could do without.
I think you're spot on about the actual money they spent. They missed as most of the free agency money they spent on RT Taylor. I honestly don't know that the Chiefs would trade Trent Mcduffie straight up for Hill at this point.
 

KJJ

You Have an Axe to Grind
Messages
60,179
Reaction score
37,652
I wont say that you're wrong, Hill is an unbelievable talent, but I think it's at very least up for debate that KC with Hill but minus those 5 draft picks (Including Trent McDuffie) and a couple of their 2022 FA signings are not as good of a team right now. That 2022 draft class they had was really....really good.
It’s up for debate, but KC didn’t look like they were going make the Super Bowl last season. In the opener at home against Detroit their WRs were terrible and without Kelce it cost them the game. In November they lost three of four games. I thought their WRs would be their undoing. However, they came on strong at the end of the season and were hot entering the playoffs. Any QB lesser than Mahomes and they’re not that great. They lost six games with him, but he’s money and postseason.
 

thunderpimp91

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,595
Reaction score
18,336
I disagree. You still have to actually find the talent. I see teams with two first rounders screw it up.
You do, but the teams that screw up that may high picks typically have very bad front offices and don't contend to begin with. Most teams will hit on at least a couple of those by chance.
 

KJJ

You Have an Axe to Grind
Messages
60,179
Reaction score
37,652
Andy Reid can say whatever he wants, coaches are rarely 100% truthful to the media and give political answers all the time. Ultimately with what they spent in free agency they could have signed Hill if they prioritized doing so, I'm not even sure how that is up for debate.

Sometimes teams walk away from really good players because they're getting value in return.
There were others that said it was about money. Tyreek Hill was looking for over $30M. We’ve exhausted this.
 

KJJ

You Have an Axe to Grind
Messages
60,179
Reaction score
37,652
Sometimes teams walk away from really good players because they're getting value in return.
You don’t walk away from a player like Tyreek Hill unless you can’t pay them. We walked away from Amari Cooper because Jerry said it was because of money and we certainly didn’t get any value for him. KC wouldn’t have traded Hill unless they got several draft picks including a first.
 

thunderpimp91

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,595
Reaction score
18,336
You don’t walk away from a player like Tyreek Hill unless you can’t pay them. We walked away from Amari Cooper because Jerry said it was because of money and we certainly didn’t get any value for him. KC wouldn’t have traded Hill unless they got several draft picks including a first.
I agree completely. They felt the draft compensation they received plus the cap space was a better way to build their team than just the one player. No argument there at all.
 

thunderpimp91

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,595
Reaction score
18,336
There were others that said it was about money. Tyreek Hill was looking for over $30M. We’ve exhausted this.
I get that money was a factor, but they turned around and gave Jawaan Taylor and Justin Reid a combine $30M AAV in free agency. This wasn't a situation where Mahomes contract had them up against the cap, they felt they could use that $30M plus the 5 draft picks more than they could use 1 Tyreek Hill. They had the resources to keep him if they wanted to, but had a very lucrative package to trade him for as well.
 

KJJ

You Have an Axe to Grind
Messages
60,179
Reaction score
37,652
I get that money was a factor, but they turned around and gave Jawaan Taylor and Justin Reid a combine $30M AAV in free agency. This wasn't a situation where Mahomes contract had them up against the cap, they felt they could use that $30M plus the 5 draft picks more than they could use 1 Tyreek Hill. They had the resources to keep him if they wanted to, but had a very lucrative package to trade him for as well.
That’s it, they were able to get two players for the price of one. Their thinking was that with Mahomes he can make it work with the WRs they have. You have to wonder if Tyreek Hill didn’t wish he gave KC a hometown discount and taken a little less so he could be winning those Super Bowls.
 

thunderpimp91

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,595
Reaction score
18,336
That’s it, they were able to get two players for the price of one. Their thinking was that with Mahomes he can make it work with the WRs they have. You have to wonder if Tyreek Hill didn’t wish he gave KC a hometown discount and taken a little less so he could be winning those Super Bowls.
Oddly the more back and forth we have the more it seems we actually agree on the subject just approach it from two very different angles lol.
 

KJJ

You Have an Axe to Grind
Messages
60,179
Reaction score
37,652
Oddly the more back and forth we have the more it seems we actually agree on the subject just approach it from two very different angles lol.
That is strange, because usually the more back-and-forth’s lead to a wider gap and all hell starts breaking loose. lol
 

TheMarathonContinues

Well-Known Member
Messages
81,473
Reaction score
74,691
I think you're spot on about the actual money they spent. They missed as most of the free agency money they spent on RT Taylor. I honestly don't know that the Chiefs would trade Trent Mcduffie straight up for Hill at this point.
I mean I would BUT a real GM wouldn't I think lol. Especially if he has Mahomes as his QB.
 

TheMarathonContinues

Well-Known Member
Messages
81,473
Reaction score
74,691
You do, but the teams that screw up that may high picks typically have very bad front offices and don't contend to begin with. Most teams will hit on at least a couple of those by chance.
I mean the draft is hard but you are right when I think of teams screwing up multiple first rounders the Raiders are who I had in mind.

Texans I believe hit it out the park but I mean two top 3 picks I believe is extremely hard to screw up lol.
 

Rockport

AmberBeer
Messages
46,473
Reaction score
45,875
CowboysZone LOYAL Fan
Why do those have to be directly correlated? Since Tyreek was traded KC has spent $255M (average contract $4.6M AAV) on new free agents contracts. In that same time period the Cowboys have spent $105M (average contract $2.6M AAV).

Despite moving on from Hill the Chiefs have continued to spend money to improve their roster. I think it's very likely they simply saw an opportunity to bring in a plethora of draft picks to offset some of the free agent spending, and simply didn't feel a $30+M receiver was the best way to build a team. They also emphasized spending on the Oline and Defense in recent years which looking at the bargain bin for WRs. Good chance Andy Reid believes he can work with buy low candidate WRs with a top tier QB and a good defense, similar to what the Patriots did for years under Brady.

It doesnt get talked about but that Tyreek Hill trade worked out very well for KC as they freed up money and landed a top young CB.
The biggest chunk of that is Mahomes and Jones.
 

kskboys

Well-Known Member
Messages
47,192
Reaction score
49,988
Mahomes’ deal isn’t that team friendly or they wouldn’t have had to trade Tyreek Hill. No way are you going to pay a QB $40+ million and not have to make some concessions.
They chose Chris Jones over Hill, not Tyreek.
 

kskboys

Well-Known Member
Messages
47,192
Reaction score
49,988
It’s connected because Hill is one of the top WR‘s in the league and they couldn’t afford to pay him. Andy Reid came right out and said it. Their WR position last season almost derailed them. They would’ve never reached the Super Bowl without Kelce. They lost their opener without him. They struggled all season at WR. They would be way better if they still had Hill.
No, they wouldn't because then they wouldn't Chris Jones. Who is a much bigger difference maker than Tyreek.

To sign Tyreek, they'd have had to tear apart their D. The D was a huge factor in back to back super bowls.
 

kskboys

Well-Known Member
Messages
47,192
Reaction score
49,988
Disagree, but Andy Reid said they couldn’t afford to pay him. No way did they want to move on from him. He’s the most dangerous, explosive WR in the entire league.
You just cannot discuss this w/o first acknowledging they just won 2 super bowls in a row. Tyreek was not as important at you're thinking.
 

RonnieT24

Well-Known Member
Messages
14,197
Reaction score
22,496
You just cannot discuss this w/o first acknowledging they just won 2 super bowls in a row. Tyreek was not as important at you're thinking.
Yeah they have the best QB in the league and the best of this generation .. That buys you flexibility to do thangs elsewhere. Dak is good.. really good.. but he aint Mahomes.. This aint rocket surgery.
 

FuzzyLumpkins

The Boognish
Messages
36,516
Reaction score
27,820
Oh...my you used "if"? Oh my....well that cements your argument then. Excuse me....you qualified it so it wouldn't matter what stand you took. Admirable.
You were wrong yet do not want to let go.

Do you have a point are just want to complain?
 
Top