Can DJ Moore be an effective 1 WR in the NFL?

[Irvin88_4life]

WR's under 6 foot rarely rarely make good #1's. The only two #1's in the NFL who are under 6 that I can think of are Brown at 5-10 and OBJ at 5-11. Oh, Hilton, there's another.

Slot guys like Edelmann and Jarvis Landry catch a ton of passes out of the slot, and could be called #1 WR's.

Steve Smith was 5'9 and was an outside receiver before he retired

 

[DFWJC]

They said on the draft show their was talk in Indy that he could come in at 5’9”. Don’t see the humor in that

I just looked at every site leading up the combine and never saw him listed at 5'9"....not once. Out of maybe 20 sites, I saw one remote one have him at 5'10, all the rest at 5'11.

I just thought you were exaggerating to make a point...as in all in good fun. Hence, the laugh.

Personally, 1 inch never made a different one anyway. He seemed like he could play inside and out.

 

[RandyOh]

I just looked at every site leading up the combine and never saw him listed at 5'9"....not once. Out of maybe 20 sites, I saw one remote one have him at 5'10, all the rest at 5'11.

I just thought you were exaggerating to make a point...as in all in good fun. Hence, the laugh.

Those numbers come from the Schools and they always add a inch or inch and half to help their students. The fact that he came in taller was a surprise.

 

[DFWJC]

Those numbers come from the Schools and they always add a inch or inch and half to help their students. The fact that he came in taller was a surprise.

True

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

He's no Stepfret Williams, but I think DJ Moore has a chance.

 

[darthseinfeld]

Now that sounds like a friendly wager.

I think a TON of mocks will still have him outside round 1. I even think it'll be more than half..maybe even 70-80%

So if you want to make that bet that he will not be mocked--not even once--outside the 1st.
I'm in!

Terms: By St. Patricks Day you wont find a mock draft with DJ Moore outside the first round

 

[NolanRyan77]

Ross is a poor example, as he rose strictly due to speed, and has looked awful busty up to this point. Might be mostly injury related, but you often get that w/ little skinny guys.

I think Ross is a great example. Another would be our very own Byron Jones. The point I'm trying to make is when guys are clustered together in a tier the combine can separate players in the minds of gms coaches and scouts. People (not you), seem to think the combine doesn't matter when it comes to evaluating players. And it absolutely does

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

Ross is a poor example, as he rose strictly due to speed, and has looked awful busty up to this point. Might be mostly injury related, but you often get that w/ little skinny guys.

Lol, you don't know what the hell you're talking about and you clearly don't watch college football. You're grasping at convenient generalizations.

 

[buybuydandavis]

Ask around, I think it's general knowledge that the 40 is not a test of long speed.

Conceptually it's not a complicated thing. It's the difference in sprinters between guys who are fast out of the blocks, and guys who are fastest near the finish line. You see "come from behind" sprinters all the time.

Even with the 40 run, you probably get a good measure of long speed by subtracting the 10 or 20 time from the 40 time.

 

[DFWJC]

Terms: By St. Patricks Day you wont find a mock draft with DJ Moore outside the first round

Deal.
What's the bet?

 

[darthseinfeld]

Deal.
What's the bet?

Avatars until the draft is over

 

[DFWJC]

Avatars until the draft is over

Sounds good

 

[buybuydandavis]

Why did he run a 4.52 at the combine then? And he never looked like a 4.3 guy on the field. This is why I’m trying to understand what makes Williams an outside wr but not Moore.

Moore came in taller and faster than expected. He was expected to be 5-10 or 5-11, run a 4.5+. As fast as Williams, but 3-4 inches shorter.

His 4.42 is much better than expected, and getting to 6' even helps. He's still on the short side for an outside WR, but the jump in the 40 changes things a lot for him.

Receivers have been getting taller of late. This draft class seems to have a lot of 6-4 players at the top. Standards for WR height are going up. Players are getting bigger stronger faster.

One thing in Williams favor as an outside receiver is how well he tracks and catches the ball over his shoulder. I don't know how Moore compares in that regard.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

He isn't a prototypical #1 WR, but can be a very good #2 WR who is playing #1 which isn't a bad thing in todays NFL.
Lions have 2 #2 and they are both very good in Tate and Jones III.
Vikings have 2 #2 and they are also both very good in Diggs and Thielen.

With todays spread type offenses and with bigger CB's the prototypical big #1 WR is more great but is also a huge hindrance on salary cap space and takes away from having a truly diverse offensive scheme of playing the matchups.

Guys like DJ Moore and Anthony Miller aren't going to be Julio Jones and AJ Green type guys but if I can get guys who can create separation and make plays with the ball in there hands your offense will have consistency because you are reliant up 1 WR.

With that being said DJ Moore is exactly what I'm looking for in a WR, and if I can cut Dez add cap space to re-sign our own and maybe go out and sign someone like Emmanuel Sanders to a 2-3 year deal I think this offense is better off.

20+ years ago when that prototype was first figured DBs could handcheck downfield, hold, and that sort of thing. You had to be big and tall to overcome coverage consistently as smaller quick guys could be impeded easily. Nowadays that is no longer the case. Guys like Antonio Brown and OBJ are new examples of an alternate WR1 prototype. They are fast and moreso lightning quick.

People are underestimating his shuttle score and what it means. Athletically he is similar to OBJ who ran a 4.01 shuttle. Golden Tate ran a 4.3 shuttle for example.

I put this insistence on the 6'3"+ receiver in the same place that I put the insistence that a running game solves all ills. It's obsolete thinking. It made sense when people learned the game 20+ years ago but it doesn't parse these days.

Quick, speedy guys can dominate just on those traits alone nowadays. For my money OBJ and Antonio Brown are the best WR in the league. Moore fits that mold and more because he is built like a RB. Moreso he fits Dak's skills better than what people consider the prototype. Dak doesn't throw a good jumpball and does best with clear separation given his inconsistent accuracy. Guys like Jones and Green would not be used fully here with this QB like OBJ types would be.

Moore is abetter fit.

 

[stilltheguru88]

Moore came in taller and faster than expected. He was expected to be 5-10 or 5-11, run a 4.5+. As fast as Williams, but 3-4 inches shorter.

His 4.42 is much better than expected, and getting to 6' even helps. He's still on the short side for an outside WR, but the jump in the 40 changes things a lot for him.

Receivers have been getting taller of late. This draft class seems to have a lot of 6-4 players at the top. Standards for WR height are going up. Players are getting bigger stronger faster.

One thing in Williams favor as an outside receiver is how well he tracks and catches the ball over his shoulder. I don't know how Moore compares in that regard.

When has Williams tracked balls over his shoulder? I don’t recall this. Only thing he catches are slants and deep in breaking routes

 

[cnuball21]

20+ years ago when that prototype was first figured DBs could handcheck downfield, hold, and that sort of thing. You had to be big and tall to overcome coverage consistently as smaller quick guys could be impeded easily. Nowadays that is no longer the case. Guys like Antonio Brown and OBJ are new examples of an alternate WR1 prototype. They are fast and moreso lightning quick.

People are underestimating his shuttle score and what it means. Athletically he is similar to OBJ who ran a 4.01 shuttle. Golden Tate ran a 4.3 shuttle for example.

I put this insistence on the 6'3"+ receiver in the same place that I put the insistence that a running game solves all ills. It's obsolete thinking. It made sense when people learned the game 20+ years ago but it doesn't parse these days.

Quick, speedy guys can dominate just on those traits alone nowadays. For my money OBJ and Antonio Brown are the best WR in the league. Moore fits that mold and more because he is built like a RB. Moreso he fits Dak's skills better than what people consider the prototype. Dak doesn't throw a good jumpball and does best with clear separation given his inconsistent accuracy. Guys like Jones and Green would not be used fully here with this QB like OBJ types would be.

Moore is abetter fit.

Ridley is a better route runner with better tape against better competition.

Im not going to argue the size piece for prototype 1s, but Ridley is the better prospect and better fit for a #2 in this team.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Ridley is a better route runner with better tape against better competition.

Im not going to argue the size piece for prototype 1s, but Ridley is the better prospect and better fit for a #2 in this team.

You won't argue it but you'll just blithely repeat the take that I was arguing against. Got it. Frankly. I think categorizations like WR1/2 to be extremely lazy thinking.

No one said Ridley wasn't a more polished route runner. Moore is a better size/speed athlete nonetheless who compares favorably in that regard to the best WR in the league.

If you like Ridley better then great. I'm ambivalent about it and ruminating. Speaking your opinion as a declaration like "Ridley is the better prospect" is a cheap tactic and unconvincing.

 

[cnuball21]

You won't argue it but you'll just blithely repeat the take that I was arguing against. Got it. Frankly. I think categorizations like WR1/2 to be extremely lazy thinking.

No one said Ridley wasn't a more polished route runner. Moore is a better size/speed athlete nonetheless who compares favorably in that regard to the best WR in the league.

If you like Ridley better then great. I'm ambivalent about it and ruminating. Speaking your opinion as a declaration like "Ridley is the better prospect" is a cheap tactic and unconvincing.

Moore "compares" to OBJ as an athlete...not a prospect.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Moore "compares" to OBJ as an athlete...not a prospect.

a) You need to read what I said about using declarations for opinions again. Do you not know what declarations are?
b) You need to learn the difference between a comparison and an equivalence.
c) yes both Moore and Ridley compare to OBJ as a prospect. Similar size, athletic ability, and production.
d) you can contrast them too, something you have failed hard at doing.

 

[kskboys]

Lol, you don't know what the hell you're talking about and you clearly don't watch college football. You're grasping at convenient generalizations.

Those little insults are cute!!! Feel better?

Guys who got nothing always resort to personal insults.