Can the Cowboys afford any 40M QB?

CATCH17 said:
He’s an elite QB.. We don’t discuss QBs like Dak with QBs like Brady. Brady is a difference maker.
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OK well this is an entirely different discussion..the OPs post is full of misinformation..
 
MarcusRock said:
Can we afford a rookie QB that doesn't pan out (and what are the odds of that?) while we build a stellar D, which is also no guarantee to be accomplished? In much less sentences, this is basically about having a known quantity (that will cost you) vs. a big unknown with bad odds. People slam Jerry & Son for taking risks on signing guys early that don't pan out but want to trust them on a bargain-hunting risk with the most important position on the field. Good luck with that. Maybe our new target will be 2 times the player our last target Paxton Lynch was and actually be 3rd string worthy.
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A miss on a rookie QB would cost Jerry Jones 100M in marketing and gate.
That's how damaging it is to miss on a QB.

This team has been far from elite for a very long time but they have been very respectable the last 15 years outside of seasons where they lost Romo or Dak as starting QB.
The Cowboys went 2-14 minus Tony Romo in the 5 years before BEFORE Dak Prescott arrived.
They have went 42-27 with Dak and 4-7 without him. And the 4-7 is misleading because they had a bottom 5 strength of schedule over that stretch and played back up QBs almost weekly.

Win 36% of their games the next 3 years and half of Texas will be KC Chiefs fan supporting Texas' own Pat Mahomes.
 
CATCH17 said:
I want to get rid of Dak and build the entire roster and yes I’m willing to draft new QBs all the time in this QB market.

Dak is proof that even a 4th round QB like him can have success if the foundation is solid.


He was at his best when Zeke and he OL were rolling.. The more we ask of Dak the more average we get as a team.
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Well, the risk is we become the Cleveland Browns pre-Mayfield. They tried many-a-QB while having decent defenses. We don't even have the decent defense part.
 
CouchCoach said:
This isn't about Prescott, it is about the team. It's not about establishing his worth. Or any QB's worth.

Do you think the Cowboys would be a championship caliber team with Mahomes or Watson? The two 40M QB's. Think Rodgers or Wilson at 35m and 33M would do it?

TB did what they did with a 25M QB considered the GOAT. KC got there with their QB still on his rookie deal. BAL and BUF got their with QB's on their rookie deals.

When NE was winning all those trophies, what were they paying their QB and why was that? Kraft even said Brady really has no choice meaning if he wanted to stay in NE and keep gathering jewelry, he had to be cooperative on the salary. Because Kraft as the owner understood Belichick the HC was all about the team.

The most successful HC in NFL history would not pay any QB 40M. He had the best and was willing to trade him if he didn't fit in the cap formula. He actually planned on doing that. There's a lesson to be learned there.

It doesn't matter what QB the Cowboys have, they cannot pay him that much of the cap because they are challenged in deciding what to pay other players. They are average team builders at best.

Because of how they distribute the cap, they have to be dead on in the draft, particularly on the D side. Are they? Are they even good in FA with the D? Paying any QB 40M only exacerbates what is already the problem along with being challenged with player evaluations.

The Dallas Cowboys are the prime example of what happens with a team paying too much to too many, it is feast and famine on the same team. And they will all stay hungry.

In the short run, the best thing they can do is get a rookie QB, keep Dalton and focus on the rest of the team. If they don't, the long run doesn't matter.
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Wasn't like the window wasn't wide open during his rookie deal.

They even nailed a one seed.

That was all of course squandered by Jerry's next Tom Landry experiment process.

Theres a way to win when paying 40m to one player
......you'd better nail every draft and have top notch coaching.

I don't think either is all that likely, but I promise you all that Mr. Ego is gonna try.
 
MarcusRock said:
Well, the risk is we become the Cleveland Browns pre-Mayfield. They tried many-a-QB while having decent defenses. We don't even have the decent defense part.
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Mayfield isn’t even that good..

Hunt and Chubb rolling has more to do with their success than Mayfield.

If they pay Mayfield 40 million then they are just as stupid as Dallas will be.
 
CouchCoach said:
This isn't about Prescott, it is about the team. It's not about establishing his worth. Or any QB's worth.

Do you think the Cowboys would be a championship caliber team with Mahomes or Watson? The two 40M QB's. Think Rodgers or Wilson at 35m and 33M would do it?

TB did what they did with a 25M QB considered the GOAT. KC got there with their QB still on his rookie deal. BAL and BUF got their with QB's on their rookie deals.

When NE was winning all those trophies, what were they paying their QB and why was that? Kraft even said Brady really has no choice meaning if he wanted to stay in NE and keep gathering jewelry, he had to be cooperative on the salary. Because Kraft as the owner understood Belichick the HC was all about the team.

The most successful HC in NFL history would not pay any QB 40M. He had the best and was willing to trade him if he didn't fit in the cap formula. He actually planned on doing that. There's a lesson to be learned there.

It doesn't matter what QB the Cowboys have, they cannot pay him that much of the cap because they are challenged in deciding what to pay other players. They are average team builders at best.

Because of how they distribute the cap, they have to be dead on in the draft, particularly on the D side. Are they? Are they even good in FA with the D? Paying any QB 40M only exacerbates what is already the problem along with being challenged with player evaluations.

The Dallas Cowboys are the prime example of what happens with a team paying too much to too many, it is feast and famine on the same team. And they will all stay hungry.

In the short run, the best thing they can do is get a rookie QB, keep Dalton and focus on the rest of the team. If they don't, the long run doesn't matter.
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I completely agree with the statement it is not about Dak it's about the team. Dak is going to get old and retire, like Staubach, Aikman and Romo. The team goes on. The team will go on without Dak. If it has to be next year because Dak refused to sign a long term deal, then so be it. The Cowboys will find a replacement and attempt to build a team around him. Or he could sign a deal and get hurt again.

The team has to be balanced. Right now the Cowboys have committed about $113 million in CAP space to the offense (without Dak) and about $65 million to defense. And keep in mind $25 million of the defensive CAP spend is 1 player, Demarcus Lawrence who has not had double digit sacks since he signed his deal. Anyone want to predict how the defense does in 2021 if this stays as is?

Restating the obvious, building a team with the CAP is hard. It is hard to fit your own players under the CAP and then sign Free Agents. But this is why it is so important to get the deals you do right. If you pay someone like Lawrence he has to make an impact on the defense that is equal to his contract because paying him means another position gets a lesser talent. Lawrence is not making that impact. Neither is Zeke - and neither is Cooper. I will keep harping on Cooper's contract until he does something to change my mind. Add to that list Jaylon Smith, Tyrone Crawford, and all those FAs who were cut in 2020. Everyone makes mistakes, but when those mistakes add up it has to impact the teams won-loss record.

Which brings us to Dak. Let's be honest about Dak, if the Cowboys pay him $40 million, is he going to deliver $40 million performance? I say no, because he is not Mahomes, Brady, Rodgers, or even Brees. Dak is a step below those guys - a good step. Even if they pay Dak $35 million, the imbalance between the offense and defense gets worse. The ability to sign a top free agent DT is erased, or seriously hampered. The defense gets marginally better just because it can't get worse.

But back to your point. The question is not if they can win a Super Bowl with Dak. The question is can they win a Super Bowl with the roster they have with Dak on it. The answer is Dak is good enough to win if the team is good enough to win. But no QB is going to win a Super Bowl with the defense we had last year. Not even Brady and Mahomes.
 
CATCH17 said:
Mayfield isn’t even that good..

Hunt and Chubb rolling has more to do with their success than Mayfield.

If they pay Mayfield 40 million then they are just as stupid as Dallas will be.
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Chubb's been good every year he's been there but they break through in a year when Mayfield improved as a passer in almost every category. He was good this year, there's no way around it. Even without Beckham. Just have to see if he can follow it up but if he does, you pay him and don't gamble the future. But we trust our guys in charge to gamble the QB position they lucked into in the first place? Okay.
 
MarcusRock said:
Chubb's been good every year he's been there but they break through in a year when Mayfield improved as a passer in almost every category. He was good this year, there's no way around it. Even without Beckham. Just have to see if he can follow it up but if he does, you pay him and don't gamble the future. But we trust our guys in charge to gamble the QB position they lucked into in the first place? Okay.
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Mayfield is ok at best..

A lot of guys like him in the league that just go as their team goes.

The more they ask Mayfield to do the worse that team will be.

He’s not a difference making player and is very similar to Dak.

You pay these types like they are elite and you watch your team become mediocre at best.

In our case we are lucky because our division sucks.. The Browns on the other hand don’t have that luxury. The AFC North is a great division.

Burrow also looked like he was on his way to becoming an elite player.
 
CATCH17 said:
I want to get rid of Dak and build the entire roster and yes I’m willing to draft new QBs all the time in this QB market.

Dak is proof that even a 4th round QB like him can have success if the foundation is solid.


He was at his best when Zeke and he OL were rolling.. The more we ask of Dak the more average we get as a team.
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You are correct.. and Brady is proof that even a 6th round QB like him can have success if the foundation is solid. Notice how as soon as the foundation crumbled in New England he bailed and went to another team with a solid foundation. Even he knows he cannot carry a team bereft of talent.
 
RonnieT24 said:
You are correct.. and Brady is proof that even a 6th round QB like him can have success if the foundation is solid. Notice how as soon as the foundation crumbled in New England he bailed and went to another team with a solid foundation. Even he knows he cannot carry a team bereft of talent.
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lol as soon as it crumbled?

He won 6 titles there and he took some rosters to championships that were not that great.
 
CATCH17 said:
Mayfield is ok at best..

A lot of guys like him in the league that just go as their team goes.

The more they ask Mayfield to do the worse that team will be.

He’s not a difference making player and is very similar to Dak.

You pay these types like they are elite and you watch your team become mediocre at best.

In our case we are lucky because our division sucks.. The Browns on the other hand don’t have that luxury. The AFC North is a great division.

Burrow also looked like he was on his way to becoming an elite player.
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So you want to gamble on finding elite but how often does elite come around? The bigger question is, do we have people who can even gauge what elite is? We were rumored to want Wentz before his draft stock ran higher the year we took Dak.
 
MarcusRock said:
So you want to gamble on finding elite but how often does elite come around? The bigger question is, do we have people who can even gauge what elite is? We were rumored to want Wentz before his draft stock ran higher the year we took Dak.
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I want to gamble that we can find a QB for cheaper or in the draft that impacts the outcomes of games that is way below this inflated QB market.

I think we can do that just like we did with Andy Dalton this past season who was winning games at the same rate Dak was.

I think we can do a lot better then Dalton too.

If Teddy Bridgewater was our QB I think he gets us to the same place Dak does.. They have similar impacts on games imo. Dak is a lot hype and he’s living off of being in an offense that was incredibly well built.
 
CATCH17 said:
lol as soon as it crumbled?

He won 6 titles there and he took some rosters to championships that were not that great.
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Which ones? Which of the Pats teams he played on were without talent? Or perhaps more importantly without the best coach of the modern era? Do tell. Brady had the luxury of a top 10 scoring defense in 16 of his 20 years in New England. Including #1 two times and top 5 9 times. Make no mistake.. Brady has been a truly great player in his career, but rewriting some narrative that he somehow dragged a buncha stumblebums to Super Bowls is pure BS. Those teams were always loaded on defense and always got great o-line play. Not to mention great coaching. And I'm not even going to go into all the cheating techniques they employed.
 
Doesn't matter what we think of paying a QB or anyone else. Jerry will go with what sells. If he thinks paying Dak $40mil a year, will make $50mil a year in merchandise, and other kickbacks for that
QB being used in a Dallas uniform... he is paying him.

We just have to come to terms with the fact that this franchise is more about winning financially, than rings.
 
RonnieT24 said:
Which ones? Which of the Pats teams he played on were without talent? Or perhaps more importantly without the best coach of the modern era? Do tell. Brady had the luxury of a top 10 scoring defense in 16 of his 20 years in New England. Including #1 two times and top 5 9 times. Make no mistake.. Brady has been a truly great player in his career, but rewriting some narrative that he somehow dragged a buncha stumblebums to Super Bowls is pure BS. Those teams were always loaded on defense and always got great o-line play. Not to mention great coaching. And I'm not even going to go into all the cheating techniques they employed.
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He played on teams that were nothing special.


I think the majority of NFL teams share similar talent.

Coaching and QB play are what separates teams for the most part.

In recent years you’ll get the rare flash in the pan defense that can elevate a team as well but nobody consistently can play great defense with these rules.
 
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