Claiborne, Mathieu or Peterson?

[Nova]

I don't get this Peterson by a mile talk. What is the super impressive body of work from Peterson that just rockets him past everyone else? Peterson was excellent at returns, but his first year was less than impressive as a CB. His second year, he was better, but let's see how Mo does in his second year.

The Peterson by a mile talk is probably because the guy is basically the Dez Bryant of CBs-- he runs a legit 4.3 at 6'1" 215.

As I mentioned in another post, he's got some work to do, but the guy is the best athlete in the league at the position.

He's not as good as some think right now, but he's still somewhere in the 9th to 12th best in the league range.

 

[hornitosmonster]

Both of those articles are from his rookie season. His play improved in 2012, although he's got some work to do.

his play improved but he was far from being the top CB in the NFL...add in the fact that he had ZERO TD's last year. Some people have anointed him the new Neon Deion and that is far from the truth. Right now it is all hype and distorted reality. He is not the shutdown CB that some of you think he is

 

[Nova]

his play improved but he was far from being the top CB in the NFL...add in the fact that he had ZERO TD's last year. Some people have anointed him the new Neon Deion and that is far from the truth. Right now it is all hype and distorted reality. He is not the shutdown CB that some of you think he is

Yeah, if you read up a few posts you'll find that I mostly agree with you. He's not the greatest CB, but he's still pretty good. If he gets his game cleaned up, then he could easily be a shutdown corner kind of guy.

And I think he can certainly do that. I mean, he's just a young kid right now (he's only about 6 months older than Tyron), so he still has time to develop.

 

[Lonestar94]

I think he said "Haden?" because there are clearly better CBs than Haden in the league.

1. Revis
2. Sherman
3. Flowers
4. Webb
5. Joseph (although he had a bad year last year, I'll keep him here for now).

Honestly, I think being in CLE has helped him. There's still a lot of buzz around him from his draft status, but the guy gets quite a bit of help and when he doesn't he's less than stellar. But nobody really watches him because he plays for CLE so his reputation is largely unscathed.

If Revis comes back the same after the injury, my list goes as

1. Revis
2. Sherman
3. Tillman
4. Haden
5. Chris Harris (watch out for this guy)

 

[CyberB0b]

Teams pick on Peterson and do not avoid throwing to his side. Good thing some of you guys are not offensive coordinators. You guys would be avoiding a guy who gets beat more than he picks off passes

here are the "real" numbers

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/01/12/cornerbacks-a-glance-at-the-2011-numbers/

http://www.revengeofthebirds.com/20...coverage-stats-shocking-and-not-in-a-good-way.

Good job. Those are from his rookie year, in which he doubled the interceptions of Claiborne in his rookie year and had 1 INT on defense to go along with his 4 return TDs his rookie year. Peterson had 13 PD in his rookie year and Claiborne only had 8. Of course teams are going to pick on a rookie.

Do you honestly think teams purposely avoided Claiborne last year?

 

[dallasfan4lizife]

If Revis comes back the same after the injury, my list goes as

1. Revis
2. Sherman
3. Tillman
4. Haden
5. Chris Harris (watch out for this guy)

I just don't believe the hype with Sherman. I think Seattle in general had a lucky year.

That might be my haterism talking though. I can't stand how much mess this guy talks.

 

[Lonestar94]

I just don't believe the hype with Sherman. I think Seattle in general had a lucky year.

That might be my haterism talking though. I can't stand how much mess this guy talks.

Well i pondered putting him at #3 because Tillman had the better year, but I think Sherman will be the better player from now on.

 

[Nova]

If Revis comes back the same after the injury, my list goes as

1. Revis
2. Sherman
3. Tillman
4. Haden
5. Chris Harris (watch out for this guy)

Right, yeah. I'm giving Revis the benefit of the doubt. But honestly, even if he does if Sherman keeps playing the way he did, then could see myself placing him above Revis.

Tillman is a good one I overlooked. He's deservedly better than Joseph at this point.

I still think Haden isn't as good as most believe. He had that outstanding rookie season when he had half a dozen interceptions in just as many games, or something like that, but he just hasn't shown all that much since. Like I said, he's rarely asked to single up on a guy, and when he does he's usually in over his head when faced with good receivers.

 

[Frozen700]

I think he said "Haden?" because there are clearly better CBs than Haden in the league.

1. Revis
2. Sherman
3. Flowers
4. Webb
5. Joseph (although he had a bad year last year, I'll keep him here for now).

Honestly, I think being in CLE has helped him. There's still a lot of buzz around him from his draft status, but the guy gets quite a bit of help and when he doesn't he's less than stellar. But nobody really watches him because he plays for CLE so his reputation is largely unscathed.

Stop it, cut it out....Revis if he returns to old, Sherman yeah maybe possibly.

Stop it it though Flowers, Webb, or Joseph are not clearly better than Haden, just cut it out. Still not sure if I give it to Sherman over him, but I can let that slide.

I like flowers he is good, but he is not messing with Haden, especially those last 2 you named. Hell no.

 

[Frozen700]

If Revis comes back the same after the injury, my list goes as

1. Revis
2. Sherman
3. Tillman
4. Haden
5. Chris Harris (watch out for this guy)

See this guy knows his corners, all he would have to do is possibly switch Haden with Tillman(i'll at least go for that) and his list is perfect

 

[theogt]

Lol.....pass completed? What kind of weird angle is that?

There is no comparison at this point. Peterson is already the best young corner in the nfl and has deon like abilities on special teams. They are already comparing him to deon.

I love Claiborne, but yes that is a complete homer statement. But it's early for Claiborne. I expect great things.

It's funny, though also disappointing, that preventing pass completions is so foreign to you and many others as a way to judge cornerback play in the NFL.

 

[Frozen700]

Right, yeah. I'm giving Revis the benefit of the doubt. But honestly, even if he does if Sherman keeps playing the way he did, then could see myself placing him above Revis.

Tillman is a good one I overlooked. He's deservedly better than Joseph at this point.

I still think Haden isn't as good as most believe. He had that outstanding rookie season when he had half a dozen interceptions in just as many games, or something like that, but he just hasn't shown all that much since. Like I said, he's rarely asked to single up on a guy, and when he does he's usually in over his head when faced with good receivers.

He's a swat down machine though. Don't let the Int's fool you. He's usually on his guy tight like glue....

Type into youtube Ultimate Joe Haden Highlights

I would post the video, but it has a song to it. This video will hopefully chance your mind. His attitude the type of plays he makes in this video, you'll see if you watch, and he's singled up a lot. I watched a ton of games on this guy he's the real deal trust me.

 

[DOUBLE WING]

I agree with whoever said Patrick Peterson is being overrated.

He's not an elite corner yet.

Elite athlete? YES. Elite corner? Not yet.

Please give me some examples of him blanketing and shutting down #1's. Until he has a proven track record of doing that, you certainly can't put him in the class with a Sherman or Revis. Don't confuse him being an electrifying athlete/returner with his corner play.

 

[Cowboy Brian]

Peterson is already playing at an elite level, he's number one.

 

[Outlaw Heroes]

I am sure you can do a similar breakdown for Ed Reed, too. You just wasted a bunch of time typing that, as it is asinine.

You questioned his claim that Peterson's picks were lucky. He provided support for that claim. If you were prepared to concede that picks are generally a matter of luck -- which is, I take it, what is implied by your suggestion that a similar analysis can be applied to Ed Reed's (or, I suppose, any other player's) picks -- why question the original claim? Haven't you, in fact, conceded the point?

You appear to have lost the thread here. Let me help you: stop now. You've been owned.

 

[Nova]

Stop it, cut it out....Revis if he returns to old, Sherman yeah maybe possibly.

Stop it it though Flowers, Webb, or Joseph are not clearly better than Haden, just cut it out. Still not sure if I give it to Sherman over him, but I can let that slide.

I like flowers he is good, but he is not messing with Haden, especially those last 2 you named. Hell no.

Is that your justification... typing "stop it"? That's your defense? How about this...

Flowers wipes the floor with Haden. In fact, out side of Passes Defensed (the swats you love so much), Flowers has better stats across the board.

Flowers was...
-Targeted at a lower percentage.
-Less completions
-Less completions per target. (better completion percentage)
-Less yards per completion (and obviously target)
-Less TDs
-Less TDs per target
and so on and so forth all culminating into an 27.5 point better OPP Passer Rating.

And the real kicker is that he received considerably less help from his safeties than Haden, and STILL did a better job in his snaps against guys like AJ Green, Demaryius Thomas, Mike Wallace, Reggie Wayne, and Torrey Smith (just a few common opponents).

Fact of the matter is, Brandon Flowers is already a legit elite corner while Haden is still working out the kinks. He can be put out on an island with the big boys where Haden has proven to be decent, but inadequate.

 

[Nova]

Peterson is already playing at an elite level, he's number one.

No. He's really not. Not yet. He can make up for his deficiencies with his athleticism (which is remarkable, btw), but he's still losing the battle as often as he's winning it. The reason why he's feared is because he's able to make plays and ruin a QB's day. It's the threat that counts with him.

Compare him to guys like Sherman, Revis, Flowers, etc, and it's no contest... though he's got the tools to be better than them some day.

 

[Frozen700]

Is that your justification... typing "stop it"? That's your defense? How about this...

Flowers wipes the floor with Haden. In fact, out side of Passes Defensed (the swats you love so much), Flowers has better stats across the board.

Flowers was...
-Targeted at a lower percentage.
-Less completions
-Less completions per target. (better completion percentage)
-Less yards per completion (and obviously target)
-Less TDs
-Less TDs per target
and so on and so forth all culminating into an 27.5 point better OPP Passer Rating.

And the real kicker is that he received considerably less help from his safeties than Haden, and STILL did a better job in his snaps against guys like AJ Green, Demaryius Thomas, Mike Wallace, Reggie Wayne, and Torrey Smith (just a few common opponents).

Fact of the matter is, Brandon Flowers is already a legit elite corner while Haden is still working out the kinks. He can be put out on an island with the big boys where Haden has proven to be decent, but inadequate.

Watch the Games Son......stop stat feeding.

You keep talking about him needing Safety help, you probably have no idea what you are talking about. I mean you watch every game? You see that he needs safety help every play?

Fact is Haden is the better cover man. Deal with it

 

[acer941]

I think he said "Haden?" because there are clearly better CBs than Haden in the league.

1. Revis
2. Sherman
3. Haden
4. Webb
5. Flowers

Honestly, I think being in CLE has helped him. There's still a lot of buzz around him from his draft status, but the guy gets quite a bit of help and when he doesn't he's less than stellar. But nobody really watches him because he plays for CLE so his reputation is largely unscathed.

Corrected.

 

[Nova]

Watch the Games Son......stop stat feeding.

You keep talking about him needing Safety help, you probably have no idea what you are talking about. I mean you watch every game? You see that he needs safety help every play?

Fact is Haden is the better cover man. Deal with it

I played corner back through HS and a bit in college. I'm fascinated by corners around the league and I understand the things they do quite well. And yes, I have all 22 film just because of it.

I've watched his games. And Flowers'. and Sherman's. And Peterson's, Revis, Tillman, Leon Hall, etc. And yes, they rarely throw Haden out there on and island intentionally. And when he is out there, he's usually underwhelming with regard to his high billing.

And by the way... reporting stats that are congruent with what happens on the field is not 'stat feeding'. It's an assessment.

Deal with it.