Claiborne, Mathieu or Peterson?

Frozen700

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All 22? yeah yeah

Played Corner is HS? So did I, so i judge the same way..... but anyways.... yeah yeah

Fact is Haden is better, ok?

Deal with it
 

Frozen700

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I played corner back through HS and a bit in college. I'm fascinated by corners around the league and I understand the things they do quite well. And yes, I have all 22 film just because of it.

I've watched his games. And Flowers'. and Sherman's. And Peterson's, Revis, Tillman, Leon Hall, etc. And yes, they rarely throw Haden out there on and island intentionally. And when he is out there, he's usually underwhelming with regard to his high billing.

And by the way... reporting stats that are congruent with what happens on the field is not 'stat feeding'. It's an assessment.

Deal with it.

Btw I'm not saying Flowers is trash....

Dude is Elite, but I feel as though Haden is a better cover corner
 

Nova

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Not much love for Joseph. I put him in my top 5 easily.

He just didn't have a year up to his normal standards. I've doubted him a bit in the past, but he's top 5 in the league when healthy. These lists just shift so easily year to year.
 

CyberB0b

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You questioned his claim that Peterson's picks were lucky. He provided support for that claim. If you were prepared to concede that picks are generally a matter of luck -- which is, I take it, what is implied by your suggestion that a similar analysis can be applied to Ed Reed's (or, I suppose, any other player's) picks -- why question the original claim? Haven't you, in fact, conceded the point?

You appear to have lost the thread here. Let me help you: stop now. You've been owned.

I posted a highlight video which already debunked his claim that it's all luck. I agree with his assertion that there aren't a ton of errant throws in the NFL, but PP isn't lucky. Look at the highlights.


Anyways, I see Mo's ceiling as being Terence Newman. Very solid, but not a playmaker.

PP has a much higher ceiling, IMO.
 

Nova

Ntegrase96
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Btw I'm not saying Flowers is trash....

Dude is Elite, but I feel as though Haden is a better cover corner

So this is how your exchanges have gone...

1. Stop it. Haden's better.
2. --showed a highlight video--
3. Watch the games/Do you watch the games? Haden's better
4. Haden's better, deal with it
5. Haden's better, deal with it

I mean that's fine if you feel that way, you just haven't actually supported your claim. You're entire thesis has been a highlight video (key word, highlight) and that "Haden's better".
 

JonJon

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I just hope Claiborne is able to do his part and gives a return on the investment the team put on him and lives up to our hopes and expectations.
 

BobGriffin3

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Patrick Peterson is the most overrated corner in the NFL. I can easily name 4 corners who are better. Cromartie, Flowers, Haden, Tillman are all better. If Sherman repeats, Revis stays to form, or Champ Bailey was only 30 then all 3 of them would be ahead of Peterson as well.
 

Frozen700

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So this is how your exchanges have gone...

1. Stop it. Haden's better.
2. --showed a highlight video--
3. Watch the games/Do you watch the games? Haden's better
4. Haden's better, deal with it
5. Haden's better, deal with it

I mean that's fine if you feel that way, you just haven't actually supported your claim. You're entire thesis has been a highlight video (key word, highlight) and that "Haden's better".

Yup and your entire claim has been

"oh i know so much, I have all 22 films, I use to play CB, and I pulled up these stats"

That does not make your opinion more valid, sorry bud. There are paid experts who still don't know what they are talking about. Let me listen to a guy "claiming" on a cowboys message board.

Deal with it. Hadens better.
 

gimmesix

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Out of Morris Clairborn, Tyrann Mathieu and Patrick Peterson, which one will have the best career. The worst career?

Tyrann Mathieu is projected to start against the cowboys, and is wowing people in camp supposedly.

I'm predicting Patrick Peterson has the best career from what I saw in college and NFL thus far, with Tyrann Mathieu close behind.

Honey Badger will smoke 'em ...
















then he'll be suspended.
 

Nova

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Yup and your entire claim has been

"oh i know so much, I have all 22 films, I use to play CB, and I pulled up these stats"

That does not make your opinion more valid, sorry bud. There are paid experts who still don't know what they are talking about. Let me listen to a guy "claiming" on a cowboys message board.

Deal with it. Hadens better.

Uh, yeah it does. I backed up my opinion with facts and an assesment. You just keep repeating an opinion without any basis. It's really not that difficult to see why one has more validity/credibility than the other.

Forums are about discussions, sharing and ultimately learning-- ya know... keeping an open mind? Not for criticizing other posters. But if you're going to go around bagging on other people's opinions and insulting them, at least bring something of substance to the table in retort. Otherwise you just come off as foolish, and you're better than that.

But if you want more validity? Here goes...

While Haden is the superior athlete who shows flashes of elite, shutdown potential, he just isn't as savvy of a player. He has ideal traits for a corner, but either doesn't trust his skills or trusts his skills too much and often ends up over committing, or overplays routes and surrenders enough field to where no amount of athleticism would allow him to recover. And he often wastes motions which negate his quickness and sometimes even completely lose sight of his receiver. This is where Flowers is truly elite. He just has superior balance and intellect that allow him to adjust more rapidly on the fly. He rarely loses his receiver or the QBs gaze because he keeps the field in front of him. He snaps his head around at the right times, and if he's in a bad position he uses his balance to whip his body back into position without wasted motions.

Most importantly, he's just more consistent with his coverage because he does things the right way. The guy moves like an elite corner on a large majority of his snaps, whereas with Haden does not-- at least not yet.

Overall Flowers has more success on a per snap percentage, and takes his man completely out of the equation more often than Haden resulting in better stats across the board that are relative to the success of a CB. This was against a lot of the same competition since the browns and chiefs had such similar schedules last year. And Flowers did better against every single common receiver that they played against. Every. Single. One.

And yes, I could elaborate and further articulate why I feel that Flowers is better.
.
 

hra8700

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Like any other position in the nfl, its not about the stats its about how the players change schemes. Peterson by the end of his rookie year was manning the opposing #1 often with the safety shading away from him.

Claiborne is not in that ballpark yet.
 
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