Climate Change

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DFWJC

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Well to say well we don't know what the temp should be that it always changes etc implies there really is no need to do anything since we will never know.

There is no way to gauge what the temp should be, but it is getting warmer. If people want to ignore that, fine, just don't cry when your house is destroyed in a wildfire, category 5 Hurricane etc. Weather is getting more severe. That is beyond dispute. It doesn't matter what it did 70 million years ago. All that matters is what is going on now.

I think everyone here is in with reducing emissions. It's the other thousand things that go along with that give some pause.

I'll let you babble all you want about cat5 hurricanes, etc. I'm just saying nobody here likes pollution, so don't say they do.
 

jrumann59

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well since we will never know, might as well do nothing, keep sending as much into atmosphere as we feel like sending, who cares right?

Where did I say that. I never once said we should just pump crap into the air. But we should not blindly follow science down a rabbit hole and try and force change. Climatology abandons the scientific method, I actually believe many are unethical and bend things to suit their conclusion. I also believe the ardent opponents of climate change are guilty of the same thing. Me personally do not believe man has that significant of an impact on the worlds climate.
 

Doomsday101

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Well to say well we don't know what the temp should be that it always changes etc implies there really is no need to do anything since we will never know.

There is no way to gauge what the temp should be, but it is getting warmer. If people want to ignore that, fine, just don't cry when your house is destroyed in a wildfire, category 5 Hurricane etc. Weather is getting more severe. That is beyond dispute. It doesn't matter what it did 70 million years ago. All that matters is what is going on now.

Really they have been predicting super hurricans and that has not been happening. I don't see where weather is getting more severe. We have periods where we do have an active hurrican season and yet other years we don't but that is nothing new.
 

DFWJC

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Really they have been predicting super hurricans and that has not been happening. I don't see where weather is getting more severe. We have periods where we do have an active hurrican season and yet other years we don't but that is nothing new.

Come on now, he says this is indisputable so you need to take him for his word. Maybe even apologize.:D
 

Doomsday101

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I think everyone here is in with reducing emissions. It's the other thousand things that go along with that give some pause.

I'll let you babble all you want about cat5 hurricanes, etc. I'm just saying nobody here likes pollution, so don't say they do.

Of course not but as mentioned at the top without getting political people have to be able to live. You can't go up bit time on utilities and fuel prices and it not have a devastating effect on people who are barely able to survive. I'm all for more innovations to produce less emissions but you can't put the wagon before the horse.
 

jrumann59

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Well to say well we don't know what the temp should be that it always changes etc implies there really is no need to do anything since we will never know.

There is no way to gauge what the temp should be, but it is getting warmer. If people want to ignore that, fine, just don't cry when your house is destroyed in a wildfire, category 5 Hurricane etc. Weather is getting more severe. That is beyond dispute. It doesn't matter what it did 70 million years ago. All that matters is what is going on now.

At one point it was getting colder. This world has had period of extreme cold like the glacial ice age and periods of extreme warmth dinosaurs. Either way the climate has to either cool or warm the planet to get to one of those extreme settings. It is arrogant to think that the earth is here to be the optimal breeding ground for man and everything revolves around mankind. We may be the top of the food chani but ther is no guarantee that we will remain there. There is fossil proof that food chain is very liquid.
 

Doomsday101

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Come on now, he says this is indisputable so you need to take him for his word. Maybe even apologize.:D

I live on the Texas coast we get hurricans in the gulf and it has been no worse or better than any other year. The great storm of 1900 that wiped Galveston out I'm guessing somehow was global warming related. lol
 

BigStar

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I think some have less issue with straight measurements than they do with elaborate ways the dots are connected with certain data points. It's a 4 dimensional (at least) issue with so many variables and moving targets, it's impossible to currently draw "certain" conclusions.

To further mess up the issue, there have been many recent allegations of data tampering, as literally trillions of dollars can be "reallocated" by a central organization based on conclusions.

It may be the biggest power grap I modern history.
I just hope they get this right one way or the other.

That is true in any business/organization and why there are so many lobbyists in Washington...
 

DFWJC

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I live on the Texas coast we get hurricans in the gulf and it has been no worse or better than any other year. The great storm of 1900 that wiped Galveston out I'm guessing somehow was global warming related. lol

Well, you're not imagining things.
Because of the GW talk, people pay much closer attention.
However....
A recent study of hurricane numbers and strength worldwide shows an astonishing consistency over the last 40 years.
In fact, the average intensity was at a 30 year low just 3-4 years ago but is rising back the norm in the brief time since then.

But hey, if someone says there's more, it must be absolute truth, regardless of easy to calculate data (as in just counting the number of storms and measuring intensity).
 
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DFWJC

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That is true in any business/organization and why there are so many lobbyists in Washington...

All true.

But this is trillions vs millions or even billions. We are talking 100x anything else. But I realize you already know that.
 

Yakuza Rich

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I tend to agree with George Carlin...the earth will be just fine. It's the people that may be in trouble.

I think 'climate change' is a better term than 'global warming.' Back when global warming was the craze, there was too many instances of extreme cold for me to feel comfortable that the earth is warming up.

I do have other doubts as many scientists with legitimate credentials and no biases have made good points in disputing 'climate change.'

However, I am worried about the lower amounts of snow-pack, hurricanes hitting Long Island, and some of the ugly things I've seen on TV in terms of pollution in Africa and China.

I don't see it really affecting my generation and I'm not completely sold on it one way or the other. I tend to think it is a problem, but probably not the extent some alarmists are making it out to be.






YR
 

Doomsday101

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Well, you're not imagining things.
Because of the GW talk, people pay much closer attention.
However....
A recent study of hurricane numbers and strength worldwide shows an astonishing consistency over the last 40 years.
In fact, the average intensity was at a 30 year low just 3-4 years ago but are rising back the norm in the brief time since then.

But hey, if someone says there's more, it must be absolute truth, regardless of easy to calculate data (as in just counting the number of storms and measuring intensity).

Biggest issue I have with the global warming crowd is how they love to predict pending doomsday scenario based on false Data. Listening to a certain person a few years back he made claims we would be ice free in the artic by 2013 well that proved to be greatly exaggerated as is many of their arguments.
It is true in peer reviews that many agree with an increase in temps but where they start to differ greatly is what the outcome or consequences will be. Most are not predicting massive sea level rising
 

WV Cowboy

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Don't mind me, but I'm just going to trust the One that created all of this.

We'll be fine.
 

DallasCowpoke

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Artcle Link--> A double scorcher: June joins May with heat record
8:43 a.m. EDT July 22, 2014

Last month was the Earth's warmest June since records began in 1880, according to data released Monday by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA).

It marked the second-straight month the world set a warm-temperature record.

The average temperature over global surfaces for June 2014 was 1.3 degrees above the 20th-century average of 59.9 degrees. In May, the Earth's temperature was 1.33 degrees above the average of 58.6 degrees.

"The warmth was fueled by record warm ocean temperatures," said Jessica Blunden, a climate scientist with NOAA's National Climatic Data Center. Large parts of the Pacific Ocean and most of the Indian Ocean hit record-high temperatures or were much warmer than average for the month.

The developing El Niño — a warming of tropical Pacific Ocean water — was a main contributor to the heat in June, she said.

Most of the world's land areas saw warmer-than-average monthly temperatures, with record warmth measured across part of southeastern Greenland, parts of northern South America, areas in eastern and central Africa, and sections of southern and southeastern Asia.

Every continent except Antarctica set temperature records. Overall, the Earth's land areas in June were the seventh-warmest on record.

June marked the 352nd consecutive month that the global temperature was above average, NOAA reported.

~insert guy eating popcorn emoticon here~
 

Denim Chicken

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You think man can destroy the planet? What intoxicating vanity. Let me tell you about our planet. Earth is four-and-a-half-billion-years-old. There's been life on it for nearly that long, 3.8 billion years. Bacteria first; later the first multicellular life, then the first complex creatures in the sea, on the land. Then finally the great sweeping ages of animals, the amphibians, the dinosaurs, at last the mammals, each one enduring millions on millions of years, great dynasties of creatures rising, flourishing, dying away -- all this against a background of continuous and violent upheaval. Mountain ranges thrust up, eroded away, cometary impacts, volcano eruptions, oceans rising and falling, whole continents moving, an endless, constant, violent change, colliding, buckling to make mountains over millions of years. Earth has survived everything in its time. It will certainly survive us. If all the nuclear weapons in the world went off at once and all the plants, all the animals died and the earth was sizzling hot for a hundred thousand years, life would survive, somewhere: under the soil, frozen in Arctic ice. Sooner or later, when the planet was no longer inhospitable, life would spread again. The evolutionary process would begin again. It might take a few billion years for life to regain its present variety. Of course, it would be very different from what it is now, but the earth would survive our folly, only we would not. If the ozone layer gets thinner, ultraviolet radiation sears the earth, so what? Ultraviolet radiation is good for life. It's powerful energy. It promotes mutation, change. Many forms of life will thrive with more UV radiation. Many others will die out. Do you think this is the first time that's happened? Think about oxygen. Necessary for life now, but oxygen is actually a metabolic poison, a corrosive glass, like fluorine. When oxygen was first produced as a waste product by certain plant cells some three billion years ago, it created a crisis for all other life on earth. Those plants were polluting the environment, exhaling a lethal gas. Earth eventually had an atmosphere incompatible with life. Nevertheless, life on earth took care of itself. In the thinking of the human being a hundred years is a long time. A hundred years ago we didn't have cars, airplanes, computers or vaccines. It was a whole different world, but to the earth, a hundred years is nothing. A million years is nothing. This planet lives and breathes on a much vaster scale. We can't imagine its slow and powerful rhythms, and we haven't got the humility to try. We've been residents here for the blink of an eye. If we're gone tomorrow, the earth will not miss us.
 

Doomsday101

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You think man can destroy the planet? What intoxicating vanity. Let me tell you about our planet. Earth is four-and-a-half-billion-years-old. There's been life on it for nearly that long, 3.8 billion years. Bacteria first; later the first multicellular life, then the first complex creatures in the sea, on the land. Then finally the great sweeping ages of animals, the amphibians, the dinosaurs, at last the mammals, each one enduring millions on millions of years, great dynasties of creatures rising, flourishing, dying away -- all this against a background of continuous and violent upheaval. Mountain ranges thrust up, eroded away, cometary impacts, volcano eruptions, oceans rising and falling, whole continents moving, an endless, constant, violent change, colliding, buckling to make mountains over millions of years. Earth has survived everything in its time. It will certainly survive us. If all the nuclear weapons in the world went off at once and all the plants, all the animals died and the earth was sizzling hot for a hundred thousand years, life would survive, somewhere: under the soil, frozen in Arctic ice. Sooner or later, when the planet was no longer inhospitable, life would spread again. The evolutionary process would begin again. It might take a few billion years for life to regain its present variety. Of course, it would be very different from what it is now, but the earth would survive our folly, only we would not. If the ozone layer gets thinner, ultraviolet radiation sears the earth, so what? Ultraviolet radiation is good for life. It's powerful energy. It promotes mutation, change. Many forms of life will thrive with more UV radiation. Many others will die out. Do you think this is the first time that's happened? Think about oxygen. Necessary for life now, but oxygen is actually a metabolic poison, a corrosive glass, like fluorine. When oxygen was first produced as a waste product by certain plant cells some three billion years ago, it created a crisis for all other life on earth. Those plants were polluting the environment, exhaling a lethal gas. Earth eventually had an atmosphere incompatible with life. Nevertheless, life on earth took care of itself. In the thinking of the human being a hundred years is a long time. A hundred years ago we didn't have cars, airplanes, computers or vaccines. It was a whole different world, but to the earth, a hundred years is nothing. A million years is nothing. This planet lives and breathes on a much vaster scale. We can't imagine its slow and powerful rhythms, and we haven't got the humility to try. We've been residents here for the blink of an eye. If we're gone tomorrow, the earth will not miss us.

well that is until the sun burns out
 

DFWJC

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Artcle Link--> A double scorcher: June joins May with heat record
8:43 a.m. EDT July 22, 2014

Last month was the Earth's warmest June since records began in 1880, according to data released Monday by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA).

It marked the second-straight month the world set a warm-temperature record.

The average temperature over global surfaces for June 2014 was 1.3 degrees above the 20th-century average of 59.9 degrees. In May, the Earth's temperature was 1.33 degrees above the average of 58.6 degrees.

"The warmth was fueled by record warm ocean temperatures," said Jessica Blunden, a climate scientist with NOAA's National Climatic Data Center. Large parts of the Pacific Ocean and most of the Indian Ocean hit record-high temperatures or were much warmer than average for the month.

The developing El Niño — a warming of tropical Pacific Ocean water — was a main contributor to the heat in June, she said.

Most of the world's land areas saw warmer-than-average monthly temperatures, with record warmth measured across part of southeastern Greenland, parts of northern South America, areas in eastern and central Africa, and sections of southern and southeastern Asia.

Every continent except Antarctica set temperature records. Overall, the Earth's land areas in June were the seventh-warmest on record.

June marked the 352nd consecutive month that the global temperature was above average, NOAA reported.

~insert guy eating popcorn emoticon here~

NOAA is the absolute poster child for accusations of falsifying data. I honestly don't know if it's on purpose or not. NASA also gets hammered at times.

But with Washington in full GW push mode, this government organization gets blasted regularly for lining their pockets, providing scued data, and keeping their jobs by making their bosses smile.

I'll let people here research that independently.
Just googling lies by NOAA should be entertaining
 
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CanadianCowboysFan

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A lot of people believe things for which there is no proof. There is something about climate change though that makes some virulently opposed to any measures to stop it and demanding proof of its existence.
 

Denim Chicken

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A lot of people believe things for which there is no proof. There is something about climate change though that makes some virulently opposed to any measures to stop it and demanding proof of its existence.

It's an easy mechanism for nefarious entities to gain control over the means of production, so trepidation is warranted.
 
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