Commanders drafts

[AsthmaField]

We actually have decent depth on DL, it's the starting positions we need to upgrade. It seems like all we HAVE is depth on DL lol...Carter and Montgomery are solid starters, but Griffin and Daniels are getting up there to still be starters (well, if Griffin has a entire season without injury he might not be a concern yet).

You have very little depth, IMO, because the guys who should be providing depth are actually your starters. Montgomery would be a decent 3rd tackle in a rotation but isn't what most NFL teams would want as their starting DT. Griff is getting ancient and wasn't real durable 5 years ago... he's not what he used to be. Carter is OK but Daniels needs to be put out to pasture.

Golsten is only ok.

The Commanders need young blood on the DL in a big way and in 2008 all your old players there are just going to be another year older and that much more overmatched.

Frankly, with Gregg Williams gone... I'm stunned at the amount of ineptitude Snyder has shown by neglecting (yet again!) a position as critical as DL.

As for the OL, if Reinhart and Kerry Brown both pan out for us, we'll have three VERY young offensive linemen as depth with at least one or two being potential starters (Heyer was a rookie last season, and filled in rather nicely at RT when Jansen was out for the season). I think even Jason Taylor congratulated Joe Bugel on Heyer after the Miami game, basically saying something like "That kid you had playing at RT, he's good".

The second you start counting on later round and UDFA OL... you're in trouble.

Are you really expecting anything... particularly competent depth from Brown? Even if he had played in the SEC or Big 10 instead at App. state, you still would be begging for trouble counting on an UDFA OL to come in year 1 and make any difference at all. If Heyer did that for you guys last year then you were lucky. I certainly wouldn't look for that two years in a row.

Washington will be damn lucky if Reinhart makes the 53 man roster at all... much less actually does something. If he does, then that means you've had a catastrophic rash of injuries and didn't prepare for them.

Look... tell me this is year 1 of a 4 year rebuilding project and I'll say, fine, you did ok by shoring up the WR and TE position. I'll also tell you don't look to make too much of an impact in the NFC this year becuase you have too many holes at too many critical spots.

However, if you tell me this draft is going to do much of anything for you in 2008... then I'll say, don't expect much.

 

[AsthmaField]

LoL...I highly doubt the Skins drafted the waythey drafted because of the number of decent CBs you have on your squad.

The reason (or one of the reasons) the Skins stockpiled WRs is because in 2005 we had a grand total of ONE receiver catch a TD pass (Moss)...and during our playoff drive we were starting the likes of Jimmy Farris (practice squad wonder who wasn't even on the team) and Antonio Brown, our punt returner who had hands of stone and couldn't even line up correctly.

The reason (or one of the reasons) the Skins stockpiled WRs is because in 2007 we were literally pulling guys off the street in mid-season to see if they could come play wr for us, asking guys to quit their Walmart jobs or come out of semi-retirement to help boost our receiving unit.

If developing Jason Campbell to his fullest was of ANY importance to the Skins, they couldn't continue to do it with that half-assed approach in getting receivers (you KNOW how Romo does without T.O. lol). It would best serve our self interests to invest in giving JC the proper tools and weapons to succeed, which also included a (hopefully) solid OG as back up should the O-line have devastating injuries once again. If the OLine doesn't have any significant injuries, they could return to being one of the more dominant O-lines in the league...which is what they were a mere 2 years ago in 2006, when none of the starters went down for the year.

So, no...I don't think Dallas' CB situation dictated jack in terms of who the Skins drafted. Sorry.

I understand all of that and I do agree with you. However, it would be naive to think that NFL teams don't look at the best teams in their division and make personnel decisions based on who they have to beat and how they're going to try to do that.

Heck... every pep rally you guys have or every team function... the one chant that is guaranteed to start up is the "we want Dallas" chant. Don't act like DC isn't obsessed with the Cowboys, because y'all are.

 

[Bizwah]

LoL...I highly doubt the Skins drafted the waythey drafted because of the number of decent CBs you have on your squad.

The reason (or one of the reasons) the Skins stockpiled WRs is because in 2005 we had a grand total of ONE receiver catch a TD pass (Moss)...and during our playoff drive we were starting the likes of Jimmy Farris (practice squad wonder who wasn't even on the team) and Antonio Brown, our punt returner who had hands of stone and couldn't even line up correctly.

The reason (or one of the reasons) the Skins stockpiled WRs is because in 2007 we were literally pulling guys off the street in mid-season to see if they could come play wr for us, asking guys to quit their Walmart jobs or come out of semi-retirement to help boost our receiving unit.

The reason (or one of the reasons) the Skins stockpiled WRs is because in 2007, no receiver had a TD pass until something like week 10...and it was our 4th string wr who had the first one (actually the first two), and our almost-retired street free agent who had the next one. Not our starters.

If developing Jason Campbell to his fullest was of ANY importance to the Skins, they couldn't continue to do it with that half-assed approach in getting receivers (you KNOW how Romo does without T.O. lol). It would best serve our self interests to invest in giving JC the proper tools and weapons to succeed, which also included a (hopefully) solid OG as back up should the O-line have devastating injuries once again. If the OLine doesn't have any significant injuries, they could return to being one of the more dominant O-lines in the league...which is what they were a mere 2 years ago in 2006, when none of the starters went down for the year.

So, no...I don't think Dallas' CB situation dictated jack in terms of who the Skins drafted. Sorry.

Not really.

He passed for 250 yards in 2+ quarters he played vs the Panthers without TO. I worded that poorly...

The game vs the Commanders was a joke....you know that wasn't a true indicator of anything.


I don't care why you drafted the way you did. It was said more tongue in cheek than anything else. I'm just glad you ignored some of your bigger holes.

I like Thomas and Davis....but that won't be enough.

 

[Califan007]

You have very little depth, IMO, because the guys who should be providing depth are actually your starters.

Ok, you just said what I said, did you know that? lol...I said it seems like all we HAVE is depth, and that we needed starters.

Montgomery would be a decent 3rd tackle in a rotation but isn't what most NFL teams would want as their starting DT.

You really didn't watch too many Skins games closely, I see...

Griff is getting ancient and wasn't real durable 5 years ago... he's not what he used to be. Carter is OK but Daniels needs to be put out to pasture.

Ancient? He's 31! LoL...And in 2004 Griffin was both durable AND a beast on the line. He was a huge reason the Skins' defense was ranked #3 overall that season. Daniels is still very effective against the run, but at his age it's too much of a risk in my mind.

Golsten is only ok.

That's why he's not starting.

Frankly, with Gregg Williams gone... I'm stunned at the amount of ineptitude Snyder has shown by neglecting (yet again!) a position as critical as DL.

This doesn't even make sense...unless you're saying that Williams is the reason we never drafted DL high, and Snyder is continuing Williams' "ineptitude" by not drafting a DL high this year, either.

The second you start counting on later round and UDFA OL... you're in trouble.

Some of the Hogs' best players were later round picks and UDFAs...and the Colts' center went undrafted. You know, that guy who went to three Pro Bowls and was on the Associated Press' NFL All-Pro First Team.

Seriously...statements like yours are overly simplistic and ignore the very reality of late round OL picks in the NFL.

Are you really expecting anything... particularly competent depth from Brown? Even if he had played in the SEC or Big 10 instead at App. state, you still would be begging for trouble counting on an UDFA OL to come in year 1 and make any difference at all.

You mean like Heyer did for us last season? We didn't "beg for trouble", we got a VERY promising RT back up who filled in rather well for pretty much the entire season.

If Heyer did that for you guys last year then you were lucky. I certainly wouldn't look for that two years in a row.

We'll see...but there were numerous other teams and numerous other fans of other teams who thought highly of Kerry Brown, and were hoping he'd be drafted.

These guys like him, too:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRYOLd1PLC0

Again, gotta wait and see what happens...but dismissing Brown for no other reason than he was undrafted is asinine.

Washington will be damn lucky if Reinhart makes the 53 man roster at all... much less actually does something. If he does, then that means you've had a catastrophic rash of injuries and didn't prepare for them.

And your logic behind this is....???

Look... tell me this is year 1 of a 4 year rebuilding project and I'll say, fine, you did ok by shoring up the WR and TE position. I'll also tell you don't look to make too much of an impact in the NFC this year becuase you have too many holes at too many critical spots.

However, if you tell me this draft is going to do much of anything for you in 2008... then I'll say, don't expect much.

Again, we'll see...

 

[TellerMorrow34]

I liked the WR picks. I would LOVE it if Colt wound up on the field starting cause he'll get crushed in the pros and so I'll be thrilled to see that happening, specially if it happens against Dallas.

I'd give it a C+ to a B- depending on just how much Thomas and Kelly are able to get on the field and contribute this year.

 

[Califan007]

I understand all of that and I do agree with you. However, it would be naive to think that NFL teams don't look at the best teams in their division and make personnel decisions based on who they have to beat and how they're going to try to do that.

Heck... every pep rally you guys have or every team function... the one chant that is guaranteed to start up is the "we want Dallas" chant. Don't act like DC isn't obsessed with the Cowboys, because y'all are.

Fans are...the FO is not. And I can guarantee you that neither Vinny nor Zorn looked at the Dallas roster and said "By jingo, we have to get better receivers to match up with those amazing Dallas corners!" lol...

Over the last 3 seasons, our #2 receiver has caught a grand total of 4 TD passes. Yeah, you read that right. So I'm more of the belief that this reality played a LOT more into this past draft than any Dallas corner did.

 

[Skinsmaniac]

Washington will be damn lucky if Reinhart makes the 53 man roster at all... much less actually does something. If he does, then that means you've had a catastrophic rash of injuries and didn't prepare for them.

That makes no sense. He's a third round pick that plenty of teams liked. Why would there have to be a "catastrophic rash of injuries" for him to make the team, unless you think we have incredible talent on the OLine already? I peg his chances of making the team at about 97%.

 

[Redskins2008]

I understand all of that and I do agree with you. However, it would be naive to think that NFL teams don't look at the best teams in their division and make personnel decisions based on who they have to beat and how they're going to try to do that.

Heck... every pep rally you guys have or every team function... the one chant that is guaranteed to start up is the "we want Dallas" chant. Don't act like DC isn't obsessed with the Cowboys, because y'all are.

lol, you a true cowboys fan. True of the matter Super bowl Champ is the best in our division. what the hell make you think cowboys are the best in the division? Yes yall win the division but true of the matter Commanders and cowboys dont have what it take last year to win it all.....



javascript:openWinStats('team_bios.cfm','75028530-EDEA-0559-EB4BC451E38D73C9')

 

[Califan007]

Not really.

He passed for 250 yards in 2+ quarters he played vs the Panthers without TO. I worded that poorly...

The game vs the Commanders was a joke....you know that wasn't a true indicator of anything.


I don't care why you drafted the way you did. It was said more tongue in cheek than anything else. I'm just glad you ignored some of your bigger holes.

I like Thomas and Davis....but that won't be enough.

A lot of it depends on JC's development. I think the O-line will be ok for this season, and if Reinhart pans out and Heyer continues to improve on last season's performance they'll have at least two young players to provide nice depth if any starters get nicked up. Heyer was already playing as well (possibly even better) than Jansen a lot of the time.

 

[Skinsmaniac]

A lot of it depends on JC's development. I think the O-line will be ok for this season, and if Reinhart pans out and Heyer continues to improve on last season's performance they'll have at least two young players to provide nice depth if any starters get nicked up. Heyer was already playing as well (possibly even better) than Jansen a lot of the time.

I really don't think Heyer will ever amount to anything. he cost us the Seahawks game.

 

[Califan007]

I really don't think Heyer will ever amount to anything. he cost us the Seahawks game.

I thought Suisham cost us the Seahawks game lol..and that Carlos Rogers cost us the Seahawks game in 2005.

And Heyer can improve, it's been known to happen lol ..I'm optimistic that he will. Look at Montgomery's improvement from his rookie season to last season.

 

[Skinsmaniac]

I thought Suisham cost us the Seahawks game lol..and that Carlos Rogers cost us the Seahawks game in 2005.

And Heyer can improve, it's been known to happen lol ..I'm optimistic that he will. Look at Montgomery's improvement from his rookie season to last season.

I suppose he could improve, but his problem seems to be that his feet aren't quick enough. I'm not sure there's a way to really improve that dramatically.

 

[Califan007]

I suppose he could improve, but his problem seems to be that his feet aren't quick enough. I'm not sure there's a way to really improve that dramatically.

He may only end up being depth, but in my eyes since he was undrafted that's a positive as well...he can hold his own for 3-4 games, especially if paired with Randy Thomas instead of Fabini.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I thought Suisham cost us the Seahawks game lol..and that Carlos Rogers cost us the Seahawks game in 2005.

And Heyer can improve, it's been known to happen lol ..I'm optimistic that he will. Look at Montgomery's improvement from his rookie season to last season.

Heyer got absolutely dominated by Pat Kearney, which is somewhat understandable, but he was getting dominated by a variety of players in December. He's questionable at right tackle and probably best suited for guard. Reminds me a lot of Torrin Tucker in that sense.

I think the big difference is that Heyer went undrafted and Montgomery went in the 5th round and was considered a 4th round pick. There's always your Tony Romo's, your Mike Sellers, and your Stephen Bowen's, but usually if you're not drafted...particularly if you go to a known D-I school, there's a reason behind it and you're likely not to make the team much less be a quality starter.

I actually think the Skins had a decent draft, although I think the Kelly pick was an error because they already had Thomas and had bigger holes to address. Still, they got those guys in the second round so the cost is minimized.



YAKUZA

 

[Califan007]

Heyer got absolutely dominated by Pat Kearney, which is somewhat understandable, but he was getting dominated by a variety of players in December. He's questionable at right tackle and probably best suited for guard. Reminds me a lot of Torrin Tucker in that sense.

He wasn't ready for Kearney, definitely...especially in the pressure of a playoff game...on the road...with that insane Seattle crowd noise...and with Fabini starting next to him.

But again, players can and do improve...He's got a lot of upside and one of the best O-Line coaches in the league to help him get better. And if Heyer ends up only being depth I'd still see it as a success. An undrafted FA that can fill in nicely for a few games at a time? Yeah, I'll take it and smile.

I think the big difference is that Heyer went undrafted and Montgomery went in the 5th round and was considered a 4th round pick. There's always your Tony Romo's, your Mike Sellers, and your Stephen Bowen's, but usually if you're not drafted...particularly if you go to a known D-I school, there's a reason behind it and you're likely not to make the team much less be a quality starter.

True, but I'm not going to dismiss a low round/UDFA right out of the box for those reasons, either.

I actually think the Skins had a decent draft, although I think the Kelly pick was an error because they already had Thomas and had bigger holes to address. Still, they got those guys in the second round so the cost is minimized.

Agree there...I was hoping for a D-Lineman with one of those 2nd rounders, but overall I was happy with what they did.

 

[AsthmaField]

Ok, you just said what I said, did you know that? lol...I said it seems like all we HAVE is depth, and that we needed starters.

Yeah, I realized that. I was agreeing.

You really didn't watch too many Skins games closely, I see...

Wait... you just said that Montgomery was a reserve and you needed starters. I did watch him pretty closely last year and he wasn't much to write home about. Like you said... a backup being used as a starter.

Ancient? He's 31! LoL...

That's getting up there for DT and his play really started to decline in 2005 (when he was 29!) and even more in 2006 (when he was 30!). You really didn't watch too many Skins games closely, I see...

And in 2004 Griffin was both durable AND a beast on the line. He was a huge reason the Skins' defense was ranked #3 overall that season.

Oh, I see. He was pretty good in 2004.

:laugh2:

Daniels is still very effective against the run, but at his age it's too much of a risk in my mind.

As Jimmy Johnson once said... Run stoppers are a dime a dozen. Do you know how difficult it is to find a DE who can play the run well? Not very. Do you know how hard it is to find a DE who can play the run well and who can rush the passer? Extremely difficult.

Daniels was just a guy when he was 28... now he's about to draw social security.

This doesn't even make sense...unless you're saying that Williams is the reason we never drafted DL high, and Snyder is continuing Williams' "ineptitude" by not drafting a DL high this year, either.

What I was saying is that your defensive line played bad enough last year when you had a defensive coordinator who was excellent and could devise schemes to minimize the poor DL play. Now that Gregg is gone (and Danny knows he's not there to save his bad DL), it was pretty stupid for Snyder to not get some kind of legitimate DL help.

Some of the Hogs' best players were later round picks and UDFAs...and the Colts' center went undrafted. You know, that guy who went to three Pro Bowls and was on the Associated Press' NFL All-Pro First Team.

You're telling this to a Dallas fan who has seen our UDFA QB go to two straight pro bowls in his only two starting seasons... and seen your first round QB that you paid, what, three picks... two first rounders for, absolutely drag that team of yours down like a rusty anchor?

No, I get it. Some unhearalded players can still come in and do well. The disconnect is the part about the Colts front office being the one to find their UDFA center... and the expectation that Cerrato and little Danny could screw up and find any kind of late round/undrafted talent. One is understandable and the other is a borderline fairy tale.

Tell this to someone who hasn't watched your teams draft history the last ten years or so. Maybe they'll fall for your BS.

Seriously...statements like yours are overly simplistic and ignore the very reality of late round OL picks in the NFL.

Seriously, I couldn't be happier that you guys are counting on help from UDFA's in the trenches. Truly.

You mean like Heyer did for us last season? We didn't "beg for trouble", we got a VERY promising RT back up who filled in rather well for pretty much the entire season.

Honestly? A very promising RT? Seems to me like I saw the right side of your OL playing like hammered **** last year. Seems like I remember every Commander fan this side of everywhere saying that Campbell couldn't perform because the right side of the OL was so... very... crappy.

Very promising according to Skins fans, maybe.

Don't mistake talent for a team lacking the sense to have a decent backup at right tackle. Just because he played doesn't mean he's any good.

Let's see who starts this season. Heyer or the 32 year old Jansen who has seriously started to slip and is hurt every year it seems. Surely if Heyer is as good as you say, he'll start over that has been Jansen, right?

We'll see...but there were numerous other teams and numerous other fans of other teams who thought highly of Kerry Brown, and were hoping he'd be drafted.

Oh, so a few NFL fanbases got excited following the draft about the possibility of picking up a promising UDFA?

Uh-uh! Really? I haven't seen that before... except for the about 100 threads I've seen on here about every possible undrafted rookie. Except for the hundred's of threads I've seen on Extremeskins, CPND, Bigblue, etc. talking about nearly every player who wasn't drafted.

Fans wouldn't want their team to pick-up any player that isn't going to make the 53 man roster, would they?

Well... if the fans wanted the Commanders to pick Brown up... then I admit, he'll make your team and be a big help this year. Lucky Commanders!

These guys like him, too:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRYOLd1PLC0

Ohz Nohzz! Da Raider Fanz on Da U-Tubezz liked him!!!

How can I refute such proof? You have totally taken me to school on this one. You must be correct. There is no doubt that Brown is a pro bowler.

How could all of the other 31 teams have been so wrong? How could Snyder have been so brilliant?



You Tube scouting? That's what you turned to?

Couldn't you at least find somebody other than just fans to say they liked him? Maybe the Gameday College crew or something?

That's gotta be embarassing.

Again, gotta wait and see what happens...

Ya think?

but dismissing Brown for no other reason than he was undrafted is asinine.

Dude, if you can't figure out that hitting on an UDFA is fairly unlikely... then I don't think I can help you.

And your logic behind this is....???

The logic is that, IMO Rinehart isn't that good of a prospect and if he plays a good bit for you this year then it likely means that Thomas or Kendall is hurt and that the Commanders are scraping the bottom of the proverbial barrell by putting in their rookie G.

Could I be wrong about Rinehart? Of course, but I don't like him that much as a prospect.

Bottom line: If you're happy your team is counting on later round picks and UDFA's in the trenches, then that probably explains why you're still a Washington fan this long after Danny bought the club.

$0.02

 

[AsthmaField]

That makes no sense. He's a third round pick that plenty of teams liked. Why would there have to be a "catastrophic rash of injuries" for him to make the team, unless you think we have incredible talent on the OLine already? I peg his chances of making the team at about 97%.

I understand why you feel that way and many times I would agree with you. In this case, it's just a matter of me personally not liking Reinhart as a prospect and simply thinking the Skins missed on him.

I could be off on that, just like anyone can be on the draft.

I do agree that he's very likely to at least make the roster.

 

[Skinsmaniac]

Bottom line: If you're happy your team is counting on later round picks and UDFA's in the trenches, then that probably explains why you're still a Washington fan this long after Danny bought the club.

It is true that Commanders fans are notorious for sticking with their team during rough patches. How stupid of us. Much better to be a Cowboy fan who comes out of the woodwork only when the team is winning.

 

[AsthmaField]

lol, you a true cowboys fan. True of the matter Super bowl Champ is the best in our division. what the hell make you think cowboys are the best in the division? Yes yall win the division but true of the matter Commanders and cowboys dont have what it take last year to win it all.....

Look what I wrote again. I said "look at the best teams in their division"... plural. I didn't say Dallas was the best team in the division... singular.

Meaning that Washington would look at what they'd need to do to get past Dallas AND the Giants. Not one or the other.

:bang2:

Read the entire post well before you insult an entire fanbase, bro.

 

[AsthmaField]

It is true that Commanders fans are notorious for sticking with their team during rough patches. How stupid of us. Much better to be a Cowboy fan who comes out of the woodwork only when the team is winning.

Weak man. I expected better from you.