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bayeslife

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He's on a different team and is a poor system fit. He's not being utilized the same way he was with the Cowboys why can't some of you understand that? He looked a lot better with the Cowboys during the years when their OL was going through transition than he has in Philly.

Right I agree that Murray is a better fit here but not at the price Philly paid. We have slightly worse production with a hell of a lot less guaranteed money on the books. If playing hard ball with Murray means we can go out and get a Wilkerson or Irvin this year I will gladly make that trade
 

KJJ

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I don't have any saved articles or know of any of the top of my head to prove the frequency with with they called zone runs last year, all I have to go by is what they've said in regards to the deficiency or McFadden in the scheme this year, as well as what the offensive coaches said last year. We can agree to disagree there. I know I saw Murray running that zone stretch play probably 10 times a games.

I saw a segment on NFLN a few weeks ago with film study showing why Murray had great success with the Cowboys and was struggling in Philly and they pointed to the Cowboys power blocking scheme and Philly's zone blocking scheme. There were some tweaks by Callahan made to the power-O blocking scheme that fit Murray perfectly. He's been hit in the backfield a number of times in Philly including against the Cowboys in week 2 where he could barely get out of the backfield most of the day.

He's not getting the carries in Philly to get into any rhythm he's been a poor system fit and it appears he's being fazed out. He's clearly frustrated in Philly and they're frustrated with him. They were so bent on taking him from the Cowboys and replacing McCoy they just assumed he would fit in their offense.
 

KJJ

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Right I agree that Murray is a better fit here but not at the price Philly paid. We have slightly worse production with a hell of a lot less guaranteed money on the books. If playing hard ball with Murray means we can go out and get a Wilkerson or Irvin this year I will gladly make that trade

Would Murray have been worth the price if you knew for certain it would have led to him having just as productive a season this year as he did last year resulting in another NFC East title for the Cowboys? Not having a consistent running game led by a back who fit our system greatly contributed to the miserable season the Cowboys have had. Not having a consistent running game and being the worst team in the league on 3rd and one put a lot of pressure on our passing game contributing to Romo's injury and some terrible play from his backups. Getting Wilkerson or Irvin doesn't guarantee either will develop into the type of player that would help the Cowboys as much as Murray did. The draft is a crapshoot and regardless of how high a pick you have they can go bust just like Mo Claiborne.
 

texbumthelife

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I saw a segment on NFLN a few weeks ago with film study showing why Murray had great success with the Cowboys and was struggling in Philly and they pointed to the Cowboys power blocking scheme and Philly's zone blocking scheme. There were some tweaks by Callahan made to the power-O blocking scheme that fit Murray perfectly. He's been hit in the backfield a number of times in Philly including against the Cowboys in week 2 where he could barely get out of the backfield most of the day.

He's not getting the carries in Philly to get into any rhythm he's been a poor system fit and it appears he's being fazed out. He's clearly frustrated in Philly and they're frustrated with him. They were so bent on taking him from the Cowboys and replacing McCoy they just assumed he would fit in their offense.

Let be clear, there are different ways to run behind zone blocking and there is more than one way to run a zone scheme. First and foremost, Chip Kelly's offense runs pistol almost exclusively where one DE is usually left unblocked and they run the play away from him. Murray failing in Kelly's scheme isn't an indictment of the zone blocking as much as it is the play designs. He is definitely a poor system fit, just not solely due to that.

In the zone scheme we use, most zone runs start as a double team from two of our linemen, then one of those linemen pulls or goes to the second level. That is very similar to a power blocking scheme and is where Murray had a great deal of his success. Remember all those highlights of Freebeard and Martin being downfield and how much hype they got for it? Those were zone runs where one of them left the double team and pulled or went to the next level.

I think you're right about Murray in Philadelphia. I think it was a huge mistake for them and like I said, they already regret that contract (which I'm pretty sure you argued with me about earlier in this thread...). I think it was a desperation move on multiple fronts. However, I don't think Murray was the key to this offenses success. I think he and Romo fed off of each other perfectly last year and it was symbiotic. I definitely wanted Murray back, if for no other reason then chemistry. I do not, however, think our running game, which hasn't been half bad, would be markedly better with him here given Romo has been gone.

I also won't attribute Romo's injury to Murray being in Philly. That is about as porous and egregious of an argument as can be made. Romo was injured while Murray was here as well.

Would be better for the team and Murray if he was here? Undoubtedly! Is he worth the money Philly threw at him to steal him? Absolutely not. In the end, Murray made his choice and it was a vindictive move to spurn the Cowboys. I don't fault him, but it was his decision.
 

JoeKing

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These 4 NFC teams havent made the super bowl, since Dallas made it in 1996. 20 YEARS. ALL of the rest of the teams in the NFC have made the SUPER BOWL.

Cowboys
Lions
Vikings
Commanders

1996 wouldve been the 1995 season, so I went with 1995. I am betting a good percentage of people posting here were under the age of 10 or not even born yet...............Here are the top 50 songs at that time. Left eye man....LEFT EYE!!! I think she passed away in an accident??

1. Gangsta's Paradise, Coolio
2. Waterfalls, TLC
3. Creep, TLC
4. Kiss from a Rose, Seal
5. On Bended Knee, Boyz II Men
6. Another Night, Real McCoy
7. Fantasy, Mariah Carey
8. Take a Bow, Madonna
9. Don't Take It Personal (Just One of Dem Days), Monica
10. This Is How We Do It, Montell Jordan
11. I Know, Dionne Farris
12. Water Runs Dry, Boyz II Men
13. Freak Like Me, Adina Howard
14. Run-Around, Blues Traveler
15. I Can Love You Like That, All-4-One
16. Have You Ever Really Loved a Woman?, Bryan Adams
17. Always, Bon Jovi
18. Boombastic / In the Summertime, Shaggy
19. Total Eclipse of the Heart, Nicki French
20. You Gotta Be, Des'ree
21. You Are Not Alone, Michael Jackson
22. Hold My Hand, Hootie and The Blowfish
23. One More Chance / Stay With Me, The Notorious B.I.G.
24. Here Comes the Hotstepper, Ini Kamoze
25. Candy Rain, Soul For Real
26. Let Her Cry, Hootie and The Blowfish
27. I Believe, Blessid Union Of Souls
28. Red Light Special, TLC
29. Runaway, Janet Jackson
30. Strong Enough, Sheryl Crow
31. Colors of the Wind, Vanessa Williams
32. Someone to Love, Jon B.
33. Only Wanna Be With You, Hootie and The Blowfish
34. If You Love Me, Brownstone
35. In The House of Stone and Light, Martin Page
36. I Got 5 on It, Luniz
37. Baby, Brandy
38. Run Away, Real McCoy
39. As I Lay Me Down, Sophie B. Hawkins
40. He's Mine, Mokenstef
41. December, Collective Soul
42. I'll Be There for You / You're All I Need to Get By, Mary J. Blige and Method Man
43. Shy Guy, Diana King
44. I'm the Only One, Melissa Etheridge
45. Every Little Thing I Do, Soul For Real
46. Before I Let You Go, BLACKstreet
47. Big Poppa / Warning, The Notorious B.I.G.
48. Sukiyaki, 4 P.M.
49. I Wanna Be Down, Brandy
50. I'll Make Love to You, Boyz II Men

Top movies in 1995. -- Toy Story. The orrginial!! Wooddy, Buzz Light year!!!
1Toy StoryBV$191,796,2332,574$29,140,6172,45711/22
2Batman ForeverWB$184,031,1122,893$52,784,4332,8426/16
3Apollo 13Uni.$172,071,3122,347$25,353,3802,1976/30
4PocahontasBV$141,579,7732,757$2,689,71466/16
5Ace Ventura: When Nature CallsWB$108,385,5332,705$37,804,0762,65211/10
6GoldenEyeMGM$106,429,9412,667$26,205,0072,66711/17
7JumanjiSony$100,475,2492,530$11,084,3702,48712/15
8CasperUni.$100,328,1942,757$16,840,3852,7145/26
9SevenNL$100,125,6432,528$13,949,8072,4419/22
10Die Hard: With A VengeanceFox$100,012,4992,579$22,162,2452,5255/19
11Crimson TideBV$91,387,1952,514$18,612,1902,3825/12
12WaterworldUni.$88,246,2202,420$21,171,7802,2687/28
13Dangerous MindsBV$84,919,4011,783$14,931,5031,3488/11
14Mr. Holland's OpusBV$82,569,9711,659$14,466112/29
15While You Were SleepingBV$81,057,0162,086$9,288,9151,4214/21
16CongoPar.$81,022,1012,676$24,642,5392,6496/9
17Father of the Bride Part IIBV$76,594,1072,148$11,134,9781,94912/8
18BraveheartPar.$75,609,9452,037$9,938,2762,0355/24
19Get ShortyMGM$72,101,6222,103$12,700,0071,61210/20
20Grumpier Old MenWB$71,518,5032,037$7,797,1851,99512/22
21The Bridges of Madison CountyWB$71,516,6171,986$10,519,2571,8056/2
22Mortal KombatNL$70,454,0982,630$23,283,8872,4218/18
23Nine MonthsFox$69,684,5321,795$12,522,2401,4587/14
24OutbreakWB$67,659,5602,230$13,420,3872,2153/10
25HeatWB$67,436,8181,704$8,445,6561,32512/15



Think about what has occured since 1996. Thats how long ive been waiting. Ill just go ahead and not wait anymore. It is what it is.

Bye Felicia!
 

tyke1doe

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I'm on the Cards bandwagon. I wanna see Fitz get his ring. Even though I'll have to hear it from my Cardinals friends and family, it'll be worth it. I know the Cowboys will be on top again...some day.

In the sweet, by and by
We shall meet on that beautiful shore ... :)


:(
 

JoeKing

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I dont get it? Who is feleicia?

And, I love how other fans, think they can tell you NOT to be a fan. Like they are the "Gaurdians of fandom"....

Who's telling you not to be a fan? You said you wouldn't wait on the Cowboys anymore so it is only you removing yourself as a fan. So... bye.
 

JoeBoBBY

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Who's telling you not to be a fan? You said you wouldn't wait on the Cowboys anymore so it is only you removing yourself as a fan. So... bye.


ooohhhh. Well, for the record mrtxstar, I never said Hi.

And I really cant stop being a fan. Its a like a Marriage. And with the Cowboys , most of the time its a bad marriage, but there are a few marginally happy years. Been married so long, I wouldnt know what to do with myself without her.

But what I can do , is see it for what it is............................................and prepare for the nagging and miscommincation and arguments and................................................................ the 8-8, 4-9 seasons.

You see, you lower your expectations. Thats what Im doing.

Some day. Were going to be "the little franchise that could", until then...................................................................................................................
 

tyke1doe

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These 4 NFC teams havent made the super bowl, since Dallas made it in 1996. 20 YEARS. ALL of the rest of the teams in the NFC have made the SUPER BOWL.

Cowboys
Lions
Vikings
Commanders

1996 wouldve been the 1995 season, so I went with 1995. I am betting a good percentage of people posting here were under the age of 10 or not even born yet...............Here are the top 50 songs at that time. Left eye man....LEFT EYE!!! I think she passed away in an accident??

1. Gangsta's Paradise, Coolio
2. Waterfalls, TLC
3. Creep, TLC
4. Kiss from a Rose, Seal
5. On Bended Knee, Boyz II Men
6. Another Night, Real McCoy
7. Fantasy, Mariah Carey
8. Take a Bow, Madonna
9. Don't Take It Personal (Just One of Dem Days), Monica
10. This Is How We Do It, Montell Jordan
11. I Know, Dionne Farris
12. Water Runs Dry, Boyz II Men
13. Freak Like Me, Adina Howard
14. Run-Around, Blues Traveler
15. I Can Love You Like That, All-4-One
16. Have You Ever Really Loved a Woman?, Bryan Adams
17. Always, Bon Jovi
18. Boombastic / In the Summertime, Shaggy
19. Total Eclipse of the Heart, Nicki French
20. You Gotta Be, Des'ree
21. You Are Not Alone, Michael Jackson
22. Hold My Hand, Hootie and The Blowfish
23. One More Chance / Stay With Me, The Notorious B.I.G.
24. Here Comes the Hotstepper, Ini Kamoze
25. Candy Rain, Soul For Real
26. Let Her Cry, Hootie and The Blowfish
27. I Believe, Blessid Union Of Souls
28. Red Light Special, TLC
29. Runaway, Janet Jackson
30. Strong Enough, Sheryl Crow
31. Colors of the Wind, Vanessa Williams
32. Someone to Love, Jon B.
33. Only Wanna Be With You, Hootie and The Blowfish
34. If You Love Me, Brownstone
35. In The House of Stone and Light, Martin Page
36. I Got 5 on It, Luniz
37. Baby, Brandy
38. Run Away, Real McCoy
39. As I Lay Me Down, Sophie B. Hawkins
40. He's Mine, Mokenstef
41. December, Collective Soul
42. I'll Be There for You / You're All I Need to Get By, Mary J. Blige and Method Man
43. Shy Guy, Diana King
44. I'm the Only One, Melissa Etheridge
45. Every Little Thing I Do, Soul For Real
46. Before I Let You Go, BLACKstreet
47. Big Poppa / Warning, The Notorious B.I.G.
48. Sukiyaki, 4 P.M.
49. I Wanna Be Down, Brandy
50. I'll Make Love to You, Boyz II Men

Top movies in 1995. -- Toy Story. The orrginial!! Wooddy, Buzz Light year!!!
1Toy StoryBV$191,796,2332,574$29,140,6172,45711/22
2Batman ForeverWB$184,031,1122,893$52,784,4332,8426/16
3Apollo 13Uni.$172,071,3122,347$25,353,3802,1976/30
4PocahontasBV$141,579,7732,757$2,689,71466/16
5Ace Ventura: When Nature CallsWB$108,385,5332,705$37,804,0762,65211/10
6GoldenEyeMGM$106,429,9412,667$26,205,0072,66711/17
7JumanjiSony$100,475,2492,530$11,084,3702,48712/15
8CasperUni.$100,328,1942,757$16,840,3852,7145/26
9SevenNL$100,125,6432,528$13,949,8072,4419/22
10Die Hard: With A VengeanceFox$100,012,4992,579$22,162,2452,5255/19
11Crimson TideBV$91,387,1952,514$18,612,1902,3825/12
12WaterworldUni.$88,246,2202,420$21,171,7802,2687/28
13Dangerous MindsBV$84,919,4011,783$14,931,5031,3488/11
14Mr. Holland's OpusBV$82,569,9711,659$14,466112/29
15While You Were SleepingBV$81,057,0162,086$9,288,9151,4214/21
16CongoPar.$81,022,1012,676$24,642,5392,6496/9
17Father of the Bride Part IIBV$76,594,1072,148$11,134,9781,94912/8
18BraveheartPar.$75,609,9452,037$9,938,2762,0355/24
19Get ShortyMGM$72,101,6222,103$12,700,0071,61210/20
20Grumpier Old MenWB$71,518,5032,037$7,797,1851,99512/22
21The Bridges of Madison CountyWB$71,516,6171,986$10,519,2571,8056/2
22Mortal KombatNL$70,454,0982,630$23,283,8872,4218/18
23Nine MonthsFox$69,684,5321,795$12,522,2401,4587/14
24OutbreakWB$67,659,5602,230$13,420,3872,2153/10
25HeatWB$67,436,8181,704$8,445,6561,32512/15



Think about what has occured since 1996. Thats how long ive been waiting. Ill just go ahead and not wait anymore. It is what it is.

For what it's worth, I appreciate the trip down memory lane. :)
 

JoeKing

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ooohhhh. Well, for the record mrtxstar, I never said Hi.

And I really cant stop being a fan. Its a like a Marriage. And with the Cowboys , most of the time its a bad marriage, but there are a few marginally happy years. Been married so long, I wouldnt know what to do with myself without her.

But what I can do , is see it for what it is............................................and prepare for the nagging and miscommincation and arguments and................................................................ the 8-8, 4-9 seasons.

You see, you lower your expectations. Thats what Im doing.

Some day. Were going to be "the little franchise that could", until then...................................................................................................................

Okie dokie. Just keep in mind when times get better, I want a piece of her too.
 

Redball Express

All Aboard!!!
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Judging by the comments I've seen the last few weeks it seems like we have become Browns fans. Except just a year ago everything was looking right. Everyone was high on the Cowboys and talking Super Bowl. Now we go to this season. We got injuries, and suspensions and our whole season has turned into turmoil. I'm bummed. I really thought this was our year. Instead I'm disappointed again. The way this forum looks though reminds me of that film "Major League", except those were Indians fans, not Browns, but their fans seem to have the same sentiment. I'm not going to link "Sad Browns Fans", but our fans look in the same boat right now.

Cowboys are out. I'm hoping a KC Chiefs vs. AZ Cardinals Superbowl.

/They should bid on getting a clapper on the sideline.
//Will go sleep off my tears now

Hey brother..

We are the Browns.

And the old Aints.

Any day I expect to see fans with bags over their heads and eye slits.
 

robjay04

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I would like to see the Vikings, Panthers, Bengals, Cards or any team that hasn't won a ring win a ring.

In a perfect world, years from now...Philly will be the only remaining football team without a ring.
 

dfense

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Quite a few people were often disappointed last year too. They were usually told to quit whining since we were 12-4. For example, I was disappointed with our performance in quite a few of our big wins. I didn't think we should've needed to make a historic comeback to beat the Rams led by their backup QB. I didn't think we should've needed to go to overtime to beat a bad Texans team that we dominated the entire game. I didn't think the epic Seahawks battle should've been as epic as it was since we dominated them in every phase and still needed a minor miracle to win. A few other games where we left the other team in the game for far too long : both Giants games and the Eagles game we didn't lose. And those are our wins I'm talking about. And then I didn't think we needed to get lucky to beat the Lions in the first round of the playoffs. I also don't think we would've stopped Rodgers from beating us in the final minutes if the Dez catch did stand. Not to mention, we had a pretty pathetic start to this season before Romo got hurt. But people don't wanna hear criticism when we're winning. But then when we start to lose and people start to criticize, we get the classic "Where were you when we were winning?" argument... I'm not saying a lot of fans weren't on cloud nine last year. But I'm also saying quite a few of us have always been critical.

You're right. That was a crappy 12-4. Romo's comebacks, Murray running over people to a record setting season. The epically bad defense playing above anything anyone expected. Winning every road game. What a bunch of crap. Some of those close games made me sick.
:facepalm:
 

khiladi

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Provide an article showing where the Cowboys used a zone scheme almost exclusively with Murray last year. Not saying they didn't use a zone scheme at times but I question they used it almost exclusively because I saw an interview with Callahan last season where he said they used a power-O blocking scheme a lot where the backside guard pulls while the others pin/seal in the opposite direction. We'll never know if what Murray did last season with the Cowboys was the exception but what we do know when he was healthy he was a productive runner even during the seasons when the OL was in transition.

http://sportdfw.com/2013/09/09/understanding-dallas-cowboys-new-zone-blocking-scheme/

Callahan can mix it up. He's doing it in Washington and I know that, because I live in DC and I was watching the Jets game. It was mentioned specifically that the Jets were having trouble in man blocking, so he was going to implement some man-blocking with OL.

He uses the power-blocking to complement the zone blocking scheme of his.

http://m.Commanders.com/media-galle...-Schemes/bd070693-94aa-4ced-9896-b28f94402b25

That being said, he's a zone blocking coach and that's his bread and butter and he totally revamped Dallas with his zone-blocking.

Just as an aside, the implementation of the scheme happened when he got more control of the offense. It's clear Callahan's influence on offense is what turned the offense somewhat around. It wasn't just the loss of Murray.
 
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okstateCowboy

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I'm on the Cards bandwagon. I wanna see Fitz get his ring. Even though I'll have to hear it from my Cardinals friends and family, it'll be worth it. I know the Cowboys will be on top again...some day.

I used to live in Pheonix. There is more Cowboys fans in that state than Cardinal fans. I will return the favor and cheer for their team.
 

JoeyBoy718

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You're right. That was a crappy 12-4. Romo's comebacks, Murray running over people to a record setting season. The epically bad defense playing above anything anyone expected. Winning every road game. What a bunch of crap. Some of those close games made me sick.
:facepalm:

So you're okay with constantly going to overtime with teams that we dominated in every phase of the game. Okay. Good for you.
 

AzCowboysFan

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I used to live in Pheonix. There is more Cowboys fans in that state than Cardinal fans. I will return the favor and cheer for their team.

Maybe it's just my circle of friends and family, but we're split pretty evenly down the middle.
 

KJJ

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Let be clear, there are different ways to run behind zone blocking and there is more than one way to run a zone scheme. First and foremost, Chip Kelly's offense runs pistol almost exclusively where one DE is usually left unblocked and they run the play away from him. Murray failing in Kelly's scheme isn't an indictment of the zone blocking as much as it is the play designs. He is definitely a poor system fit, just not solely due to that.

In the zone scheme we use, most zone runs start as a double team from two of our linemen, then one of those linemen pulls or goes to the second level. That is very similar to a power blocking scheme and is where Murray had a great deal of his success. Remember all those highlights of Freebeard and Martin being downfield and how much hype they got for it? Those were zone runs where one of them left the double team and pulled or went to the next level.

I think you're right about Murray in Philadelphia. I think it was a huge mistake for them and like I said, they already regret that contract (which I'm pretty sure you argued with me about earlier in this thread...). I think it was a desperation move on multiple fronts. However, I don't think Murray was the key to this offenses success. I think he and Romo fed off of each other perfectly last year and it was symbiotic. I definitely wanted Murray back, if for no other reason then chemistry. I do not, however, think our running game, which hasn't been half bad, would be markedly better with him here given Romo has been gone.

I also won't attribute Romo's injury to Murray being in Philly. That is about as porous and egregious of an argument as can be made. Romo was injured while Murray was here as well.

Would be better for the team and Murray if he was here? Undoubtedly! Is he worth the money Philly threw at him to steal him? Absolutely not. In the end, Murray made his choice and it was a vindictive move to spurn the Cowboys. I don't fault him, but it was his decision.

One thing most will agree on is Murray was a much better fit with the Cowboys than he has been with Philly. A lot of big money free agents have flamed out with other teams due to chemistry issues or not being the right fit. I'm sure Emmitt wouldn't have been as good on some other teams and Dorsett likely wouldn't have had the career he did had he ended up with Tampa who had the first overall pick in 1977.

I'm not saying Murray ending up in Philly is what got Romo injured but the Cowboys went cheap at RB due to the confidence they had in their OL and it didn't pay off. They could have signed DeAngelo Williams who signed with the Steelers the same day McFadden signed with the Cowboys but Jerry made up his mind his OL had more to do with Murray's success than his talent.
 
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