Cowboys struggle to draft good DBs

[Galian Beast]

At first I was thinking the cowboys struggle because they draft too many small school kids with lack of experience and don't pick them high enough, but that doesn't tell the whole story, we missed big on Claiborne and that can't be ignored.

One could argue that we had very degrees of success with Mike Jenkins and Terence Newman, but both seemed to lose their confidence.

Ironically, I don't think the issues with the secondary have simply been due to poor drafting there, though we do have our fair share of misses. I think ultimately we've seen players in our secondary lose a lot of confidence because we've put them out on an island with no consistent pass rush help. The best years where we had pass rushes we've also had pretty good results from our secondary.

So, my conclusion is that it has been a combination of poor drafting but also ignoring our pass rush for too long relying so much on one player to be the savior of the defense.


2003
1st round - Terence Newman, 2 pro bowls, 11 years starting
6th round - BJ Tucker, 0 years starting

2004
4th round - Bruce Thornton, 1 year starting (49ers)
7th round - Nate Jones, 0 years starting
7th round - Jacques Reeves - 1 year starting

2005
6th round - Justin Beriault, 0 years starting

2006
5th round - Pat Watkins, 0 years starting

2007
7th round - Courtney Brown, 0 years starting
7th round - Alan ball, 2 years starting

2008
1st round - Mike Jenkins, 1 pro bowl, 4 years starting
5th round - Orlando Scandrick, 2 years starting

2009
5th round - DeAngelo Smith, 0 years starting
5th round - Michael Hamlin, 0 years starting
6th round - Stephen Hodge, 0 years starting
7th round - Mike Mickens, 0 years starting

Let me just say how absolutely terrible this draft was. 12 draft picks, not a single starter (for our team)

2010
4th round - Akwasi Owusu Ansah, 0 years starting
6th round - Jamar Wall, 0 years starting

2011
5th round - Josh Thomas, 0 years starting

2012
1st round - Morris Claiborne, 1 year starting
4th round - Matt Johnson, 0 years starting

2013
3rd round - JJ Wilcox, 1 year starting
4th round - BW Webb, 0 years starting

2014
7th round draft pick - Ahmad Dixon, 0 years starting
7th round draft pick - Terrance Mitchell, 0 years starting

11 years of drafting
1st rounders - 3
2nd rounders - 0
3rd rounders - 1
4th rounders - 4
5th rounders - 4
6th rounders - 4
7th rounders - 7

I would say that we can at least get starters out of the first round, even 3 pro bowl appearances, but clearly we have neglected this position group.

 

[Zekeats]

It is the same for 98% of teams.......all of the pics are 4th round or later besides Newman, Jenkins, Claiborne and Wilcox. Anything after the 2nd round is a crap shoot and for every Richard Sherman there are 1,000 DeAngelo Smiths. This could be said for any team for any position and I think you may have just wasted your time.

 

[Galian Beast]

It is the same for 98% of teams.......all of the pics are 4th round or later besides Newman, Jenkins, Claiborne and Wilcox. Anything after the 2nd round is a crap shoot and for every Richard Sherman there are 1,000 DeAngelo Smiths. This could be said for any team for any position and I think you may have just wasted your time.

Let's take a look at the Patriots then

2003
2nd round - Wilson, 4 years starting
4th round - Samuel, 4 pro bowls, 8 years starting

2004
3rd round - Scott, 0 years starting
4th round - Reid, 0 years starting
7th round - Morton, 0 years starting

2005
3rd round - Hobbs, 2 years starting
4th round - Sanders, 1 year starting

2006
7th round - Andrews, 0 years starting

2007
1st round - Meriweather, 2 pro bowls, 4 years starting
6th round - Richardson, 0 years starting

2008
2nd round - Wheatley, 0 years starting
4th round - Wilhite, 0 years starting

2009
2nd round - Chung, 3 years starting
2nd round - Butler, 0 years starting

2010
1st round - McCourty, 1 pro bowl, 3 years starting

2011
2nd round - Dowling, 0 years starting
7th round - Williams, 0 years starting

2012
2nd round - Wilson, 0 years starting
6th round - Ebner, 0 years starting
7th round - Dennard, 1 year starting

2013
3rd round - Ryan, 0 years starting
3rd round - Harmon, 0 years starting

2014
6th round - Thomas, 0 years starting

1st round - 2
2nd round - 6
3rd round - 4
4th round - 4
5th round - 0
6th round - 2
7th round - 4

26 years starting and 7 pro bowls with 24 players selected

vs our

23 years starting and 3 pro bowls with 23 player selected.

I'd say they've drafted better, and they've also emphasized the position more.

 

[Galian Beast]

To generally get starters you have to invest in picks 1-3, when you relegate an entire group to picks 4-7, you aren't going to get much quality.

Unfortunately, we've been pretty reckless with our 1st, 2nd and 3rd round draft picks. It's only been recently that we've drafted well with these picks.

How many tight ends did we really need to draft in round 2? How many times did we have to address running back in the draft? Had we taken Steven Jackson when we had the chance, we never would have had to draft Felix Jones, Marion Barber, or Tashard Choice. That poor decision cost us a 1st round draft pick, and two 4th round draft choices.

We drafted Fasano, Bennett, and Escobar in the 2nd round and never really tried to utilize any of them. How much did that cost us in terms of other players who could have filled in.

The trade to get Roy Williams was pretty foolish as well.

One reason we have been drafting so well lately is because we have been going after the best players available, though I think we dropped the ball there a couple times this year.

Missing on Claiborne cost us quite a bit as well.

The shift from 4-3 to 3-4 and back to 4-3 set this team back as well.

 

[AzorAhai]

CB is inherently hard to draft for. I may be mistaken and I'm too lazy to look it up, but the previous 3-4 years it seems 80-90% of the 1st Rd CB picks have been busts. If it's that hard to draft them in the 1st, it has to be hard to evaluate. The team should just draft 1 every year fairly high and try to continually develop them.

 

[ccb04]

The Pats indeed emphasized the position more overall, and certainly in the first 3 rounds...with 12 selections in those rounds vs. just 3 for the Cowboys.

Dennard was a late round pick that was viewed as a early round talent prior to some issues. He started for them...but was just recently released...and the Pats drafted 2 more DB's.

No question a consistent pass rush helps the DB's. And good coverage can allow for the occasional coverage sack. Disrupting the QB is a huge piece of the pass D. Having some talented DB's doesn't hurt either.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

The Patriots drafted 4x the number of dbs in the first 3 rounds than we have.

We are also a better drafting team than the Patriotsin general.

 

[lostar2009]

Man I thought Mickens was going to do something. I always knew AOA was going to be a bust. He pad his stats on a couple of qbs.

 

[Idgit]

Let's take a look at the Patriots then

2003
2nd round - Wilson, 4 years starting
4th round - Samuel, 4 pro bowls, 8 years starting

2004
3rd round - Scott, 0 years starting
4th round - Reid, 0 years starting
7th round - Morton, 0 years starting

2005
3rd round - Hobbs, 2 years starting
4th round - Sanders, 1 year starting

2006
7th round - Andrews, 0 years starting

2007
1st round - Meriweather, 2 pro bowls, 4 years starting
6th round - Richardson, 0 years starting

2008
2nd round - Wheatley, 0 years starting
4th round - Wilhite, 0 years starting

2009
2nd round - Chung, 3 years starting
2nd round - Butler, 0 years starting

2010
1st round - McCourty, 1 pro bowl, 3 years starting

2011
2nd round - Dowling, 0 years starting
7th round - Williams, 0 years starting

2012
2nd round - Wilson, 0 years starting
6th round - Ebner, 0 years starting
7th round - Dennard, 1 year starting

2013
3rd round - Ryan, 0 years starting
3rd round - Harmon, 0 years starting

2014
6th round - Thomas, 0 years starting

1st round - 2
2nd round - 6
3rd round - 4
4th round - 4
5th round - 0
6th round - 2
7th round - 4

26 years starting and 7 pro bowls with 24 players selected

vs our

23 years starting and 3 pro bowls with 23 player selected.

I'd say they've drafted better, and they've also emphasized the position more.

They've drafted better because they've emphasized the position more. That's reasonable. They're also a team that's had more success than we have during that span, so you'd expect more prowlers and more success overall.

 

[Galian Beast]

They've drafted better because they've emphasized the position more. That's reasonable. They're also a team that's had more success than we have during that span, so you'd expect more prowlers and more success overall.

Right, but by putting proper emphasis on positions it saves you draft picks. It allows you to draft more based on BPA rather than need. A litany of mistakes have really cost this Cowboys team.

 

[dwreck27]

I think everyone can agree our DB position has been a glaring weakness for years....

...Im just hoping with the selection of Byron we are taking a step forward

 

[Zekeats]

12 picks for the pats in rounds 1-3 as opposed to 4 for the cowboys = no more than 4 pro bowl seasons. No big deal here, especially when your talking about a team that finishes 12-4 every season. You actually went against proving your own point, if that makes any sense.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

12 picks for the pats in rounds 1-3 as opposed to 4 for the cowboys = no more than 4 pro bowl seasons. No big deal here, especially when your talking about a team that finishes 12-4 every season. You actually went against proving your own point, if that makes any sense.

He absolutely did.

 

[Galian Beast]

I would say a successful draft has you getting 1 pro bowler and 3 starters.

The first big mistake this team made was not drafting Steven Jackson who was the obvious pick after he fell to us. Since then we have wasted a 1st and two 4th round draft picks while he has been actively getting 1000+ yards every year.

Then you have to look at the 1st, 2nd and 3rd round misses and busts.

I have to say for a good solid 3 years we were drafting like hot garbage, we had a good draft, and then the next year we traded away high picks for roy williams and had what had to be the worst draft in franchise history.

Notice in 2010 and on how we've drafted pretty well. We've let the draft come to us, taken some risks, but for the most part we've just been smart, but there are some glaring question marks still post 2010

1. Akwasi in the 4th round.... the guy was way too raw to be drafted that high.

Footnote, I want to say you should hit on your 4th round draft pick probably 50 percent of the time. And we weren't do a great job of that with Arkin next. Wilber and Johnson were also busts, not helped by the change in scheme or injuries.

2. Trading up for Claiborne.

3. Drafting yet another 2nd round tight end who we still refused to use properly.

4. Another miss on a 4th round draft pick in BW Webb

 

[Galian Beast]

12 picks for the pats in rounds 1-3 as opposed to 4 for the cowboys = no more than 4 pro bowl seasons. No big deal here, especially when your talking about a team that finishes 12-4 every season. You actually went against proving your own point, if that makes any sense.

No more than 4 pro bowl seasons? That's actually a huge difference. That is more than 2x the pro bowl seasons over the same duration of time...

 

[AdamJT13]

So, we've drafted four cornerbacks in the first three rounds since 2003. One is Byron Jones. Two of the other three made the Pro Bowl for us. I'd say that's a pretty good success rate.

 

[Galian Beast]

I think everyone can agree our DB position has been a glaring weakness for years....

...Im just hoping with the selection of Byron we are taking a step forward

Secondary should be a huge priority next year as well. If we can maintain and improve our pass rush and linebacker corps after this offseason, and just invest in the secondary, we should have a top 5 defense.

The problem is how many free agents we're looking at; mcclain, hardy, mincey...

 

[StarBoyz83]

I dont remember most of those guys on that list lol

 

[Galian Beast]

So, we've drafted four cornerbacks in the first three rounds since 2003. One is Byron Jones. Two of the other three made the Pro Bowl for us. I'd say that's a pretty good success rate.

Like I said, I think when we have made high investments it has worked out for the most part, especially considering how poorly we've done with getting pass rushers.

My point was that the secondary is garbage because we have not made consistent investments in the secondary. We haven't had a pro bowl safety drafted since Roy Williams.

 

[Galian Beast]

Man I thought Mickens was going to do something. I always knew AOA was going to be a bust. He pad his stats on a couple of qbs.

This is why I don't trust the secondary coaches. We've never had great secondary coaches, and they've really never surprised me. The only player I'd say they've successfully developed is Scandrick and it's not as if he were a richard sherman level corner.