Dak vs. Hurts

[rnr_honeybadger]

Why do so many dimiss the fumble for a TD?

Because no one really gives two figs about Jalen Hurts or the Eagles losing. But it is laughable to compare a guy who led his team to a SB actually had a good season, excoriate him for a fumble while giving a pass to another dude who led the league in interceptions.

 

[StarOfGlory]

It certainly helps when a QB is surrounded by a better team, talent and a much easier schedule. That won't be the case in 2023, especially if Hurts get paid a new contract. Half of their starters are due new contract extensions. Good luck keeping the same team intact. Everyone praising them, let's see if that will be the case by the end of the 2023 season.

Their offense will be fine. If Kelce retires, they already have Kelce 2.0 ready to step in. Seamalo is due more money, but he wants to stay. If he leaves, they will draft a guard. They won‘t overpay to keep Sanders, since Gainwell has come into his own this year. Johnson will get surgery and be fine for a few more years to beat up on defenders.

If Seamalo leaves, he did play LG before switching to RG. Jerry??? LG???

 

[Hadenough]

They both have something in common now. Both cost their team an important game with a turnover. If that was Dak fumbling away a TD in the Super Bowl, half the threads on the board would be trade or cut Dak threads or Dak sucks threads. Sometimes, the other team makes a good play. You have to live with it as long as it doesn’t keep repeating itself.

Big difference between Dak and Hurts.
Hurts hung 35 points on the Chiefs on the biggest stage in front of the whole world. Dak played the Chiefs not long ago and could manage a whopping 9 points in a regular season game. Dak has some of the worst games that always appear against better teams.

 

[CowboyoWales]

The Eagles have the 10th and 30th overall picks in the 1st round of 2023's Draft. This draft class is void of top QB talent. Only the top 2 QBs are worthy of being top 10 picks worthy, and both of them will be long gone by the time the Eagles pick at #10. No way are they getting rid of Jalen Hurts for a lesser rookie QB draft pick.

They did with Wentz. Remind me again where they drafted Hurts ....clue it's between 52nd - 54th. Just in case you've been obsessing over Dak that everything else has passed you by have you seen how the Eagles have traded picks over the past couple of years?
The Eagles are so progressive with their roster turn over there's a chance they either trade a pick until next years draft or even sign Hurts to an extension incorporating a two/three year reasonable CAP hit with a view to trading him. That's the benefit of a team that dont get obsessed with their players....good players, but arent worth CAP killing contracts.

 

[America's Cowboy]

I see Dak and Hurts as similar.

The difference really is that Dak is paid 40m a season and that is an albatross around the salary cap’s neck. There are maybe 3-4 QB’s worth that high a percentage of the salary cap in the league and Dak isn’t one of them. If there are 14 QB’s with higher salaries then at least 10 other teams along with Dallas have made a mistake IMO.

Dak and Hurts are similar? Let's see...

In the same amount of time that Hurts has been in the league:

Games Played % - Pass Yds/Game - Passing TDs/Game - Pass Comp % - Passer Rate

Hurts: 88.24 - 228.17 - 1.27 - 63.93 - 94.37
Dak: 65.63 - 321.81 - 1.86 - 66.56 - 99.66

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/philadelphia-eagles/jalen-hurts-47648/market-value/

Now let's add Kyler Murray and Josh Allen...

Murray: 90.91 - 258.6 - 1.67 - 68.22 - 97.43
Allen: 100.0 - 238.53 - 1.78 - 64.01 - 96.24

As QB passers, Dak and Hurts are not similar. Dak is a better passer. Dak is an even better passer than Kyler Murray and Josh Allen as well, yet they are paid higher than Dak (see contract numbers below)...

Contracts comparison:

Length - Value - Avg. Salary - Age when signed

Murray: 5 - $230,500,000 - $46,100,000 - 24
Allen: 6 - $258,034,000 - $43,005,667 - 25
Dak: 4 - $160,000,000 - $40,000,000 - 27

As you can see, Dak is the lesser paid of all 3 QBs, yet he's the better passer. Hurts is due a new contract. He's estimated to get a new contract averaging around $44.25 million/year. Based on the average pay/year Murray and Allen are getting paid, Hurts will likely end up getting paid higher than his estimated value of $44.25 mil/year.

So, as one can see, Dak's $40 mil/year is much cheaper than what Murray and Allen are getting paid...and what Hurts is about to get paid. All while Dak is the better passer than all QBs in comparison. The QB market is what it is, and it's not going to change anytime soon. Looks like the Cowboys got the better end of the stick compared to the other QBs mentioned.

 

[America's Cowboy]

Big difference between Dak and Hurts.
Hurts hung 35 points on the Chiefs on the biggest stage in front of the whole world. Dak played the Chiefs not long ago and could manage a whopping 9 points in a regular season game. Dak has some of the worst games that always appear against better teams.

Hurts had a full arsenal around him and the top scoring Offense, best Oline, better receiving crew, better RBs, top 3 Defense, better coaches/playcalling. Dak did not. But, hey, don't let those facts get in the way of your opinion.

 

[CowboyoWales]

Hurts had a full arsenal around him and the top scoring Offense, best Oline, better receiving crew, better RBs, top 3 Defense, better coaches/playcalling. Dak did not. But, hey, don't let those facts get in the way of your opinion.

Maybe Dak'll rip up his contract (rather than restructure) in acknowledgement that we arent going to win with his forthcoming 20% CAP.

 

[America's Cowboy]

They did with Wentz. Remind me again where they drafted Hurts ....clue it's between 52nd - 54th. Just in case you've been obsessing over Dak that everything else has passed you by have you seen how the Eagles have traded picks over the past couple of years?
The Eagles are so progressive with their roster turn over there's a chance they either trade a pick until next years draft or even sign Hurts to an extension incorporating a two/three year reasonable CAP hit with a view to trading him. That's the benefit of a team that dont get obsessed with their players....good players, but arent worth CAP killing contracts.

Now you're moving the goal posts to fit your agenda. No way the Eagles will be able to trade Hurts on a new big contract, especially if they incorporate the contract to be team friendly those first 2-3 years. That means a majority of the money will be pushed to the later years of the contract, and no team will be willing to take on such a ludicrous amount of salary remaining. The Eagles will have to take a majority of the cap hit if they even find a trading partner. In your obsession to criticize Dak, you fail at realistically understanding how Hurts new big contract will affect the Eagles.

 

[CowboyoWales]

Now you're moving the goal posts to fit your agenda. No way the Eagles will be able to trade Hurts on a new big contract, especially if they incorporate the contract to be team friendly those first 2-3 years. That means a majority of the money will be pushed to the later years of the contract, and no team will be willing to take on such a ludicrous amount of salary remaining. The Eagles will have to take a majority of the cap hit if they even find a trading partner. In your obsession to criticize Dak, you fail at realistically understanding what Hurts new big contract will affect the Eagles.

Au contraire, I know exactly how Hurts will effect them, however, the Eagles FO have shown and proved that rather than extend a good (but limited QB) that's an escalating risk to the team winning as the CAP% rises.

What the Eagles did with Wentz as opposed to what we did with Dak.

 

[LatinMind]

Hurts made me a believer last night but the difference in the game was Mahomes. The game reminded me of Dak vs Rodgers in the 2016 playoffs. The Cowboys/Eagles had superior talent but Rodgers/Mahomes were elite quarterbacks.

Lol so the refs missing a holding call in the open on Irving had no effect on the outcome huh

 

[StarOfGlory]

Now you're moving the goal posts to fit your agenda. No way the Eagles will be able to trade Hurts on a new big contract, especially if they incorporate the contract to be team friendly those first 2-3 years. That means a majority of the money will be pushed to the later years of the contract, and no team will be willing to take on such a ludicrous amount of salary remaining. The Eagles will have to take a majority of the cap hit if they even find a trading partner. In your obsession to criticize Dak, you fail at realistically understanding how Hurts new big contract will affect the Eagles.

LOL, they managed to trade Wentz, but you don't think they can trade a QB who just dropped 35 in a Super Bowl? People still not understanding the Satanic powers of Howie Roseman.

 

[America's Cowboy]

Au contraire, I know exactly how Hurts will effect them, however, the Eagles FO have shown and proved that rather than extend a good (but limited QB) that's an escalating risk to the team winning as the CAP% rises.

What the Eagles did with Wentz as opposed to what we did with Dak.

It all depends if Hurts decides to play ball and help the Eagles more than himself.

 

[America's Cowboy]

LOL, they managed to trade Wentz, but you don't think they can trade a QB who just dropped 35 in a Super Bowl? People still not understanding the Satanic powers of Howie Roseman.

Howie Roseman was always chided and berated due to his bad decisions, until recently. Even a blind squirrel can find a nut once in a while.

 

[CowboyoWales]

LOL, they managed to trade Wentz, but you don't think they can trade a QB who just dropped 35 in a Super Bowl? People still not understanding the Satanic powers of Howie Roseman.

The Eagles have 2 first round picks this year and 2 second round picks next year, they'll get creative.

 

[DanA]

Dak and Hurts are similar? Let's see...

In the same amount of time that Hurts has been in the league:

Games Played % - Pass Yds/Game - Passing TDs/Game - Pass Comp % - Passer Rate

Hurts: 88.24 - 228.17 - 1.27 - 63.93 - 94.37
Dak: 65.63 - 321.81 - 1.86 - 66.56 - 99.66

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/philadelphia-eagles/jalen-hurts-47648/market-value/

Now let's add Kyler Murray and Josh Allen...

Murray: 90.91 - 258.6 - 1.67 - 68.22 - 97.43
Allen: 100.0 - 238.53 - 1.78 - 64.01 - 96.24

As QB passers, Dak and Hurts are not similar. Dak is a better passer. Dak is an even better passer than Kyler Murray and Josh Allen as well, yet they are paid higher than Dak (see contract numbers below)...

Contracts comparison:

Length - Value - Avg. Salary - Age when signed

Murray: 5 - $230,500,000 - $46,100,000 - 24
Allen: 6 - $258,034,000 - $43,005,667 - 25
Dak: 4 - $160,000,000 - $40,000,000 - 27

As you can see, Dak is the lesser paid of all 3 QBs, yet he's the better passer. Hurts is due a new contract. He's estimated to get a new contract averaging around $44.25 million/year. Based on the average pay/year Murray and Allen are getting paid, Hurts will likely end up getting paid higher than his estimated value of $44.25 mil/year.

So, as one can see, Dak's $40 mil/year is much cheaper than what Murray and Allen are getting paid...and what Hurts is about to get paid. All while Dak is the better passer than all QBs in comparison. The QB market is what it is, and it's not going to change anytime soon. Looks like the Cowboys got the better end of the stick compared to the other QBs mentioned.

With all due respect there’s some
mental gymnastics going on.

Firstly, with the Hurts comparison you’ve:

• Cherry picked stats that ignore Hurts contribution as a runner
• Included Hurts rookie year but not Dak’s
• Failed to include consideration for Dak’s interception problem this year
• Seemingly ignored Hurts was an MVP candidate.

Dak has been an MVP candidate in the past and like Hurts I see him as a system QB with neither capable of carrying a team.


Secondly, both Kyler Murray and Josh Allen signed contracts that were more recent and longer than Dak , regardless though, those aren’t good deals either in my eyes. I see Murray’s as a worse deal than Dak’s and Allen as just marginally better. To me, the guys worth 40m+ are Mahomes, Rodgers and Burrows with Herbert and then Allen right around the mark. Dak’s in a tier below with Stafford, Jackson, and Hurts.

 

[StarOfGlory]

Howie Roseman was always chided and berated due to his bad decisions, until recently. Even a blind squirrel can find a nut once in a while.

He’s found a hell of a lot more than one nut. Everyone on their starting offense except for AJ Brown was drafted. His bad decisions relate to drafting WR’s. He has now put together two teams in five years that got to the Super Bowl. I wish we had those bad decisions. Facts suck, don’t they?

 

[America's Cowboy]

With all due respect there’s some
mental gymnastics going on.

Firstly, with the Hurts comparison you’ve:

• Cherry picked stats that ignore Hurts contribution as a runner
• Included Hurts rookie year but not Dak’s
• Failed to include consideration for Dak’s interception problem this year
• Seemingly ignored Hurts was an MVP candidate.

Dak has been an MVP candidate in the past and like Hurts I see him as a system QB with neither capable of carrying a team.


Secondly, both Kyler Murray and Josh Allen signed contracts that were more recent and longer than Dak , regardless though, those aren’t good deals either in my eyes. I see Murray’s as a worse deal than Dak’s and Allen as just marginally better. To me, the guys worth 40m+ are Mahomes, Rodgers and Burrows with Herbert and then Allen right around the mark. Dak’s in a tier below with Stafford, Jackson, and Hurts.

I didn't include the running stats because it's a given that Hurts, Murray and Allen and more running QBs than Dak. Out of all 4, Dak is more the passer and puts up better numbers than the other 3. Yet, he's lesser paid.

Question: Which type of QB just won the Super Bowl? The more running QB or the more passing QB?

Exactly my point. Dak does enough to scramble, but it's more important having a better passer.

As for the INTs, I didn't include them since it's not a fair comparison. Dak has always committed 10 or less INTs per year. This past season was an outlier, then again, Dak had no weapons (other than CeeDee) and his Oline was poor with a failed running attack against better Defenses this year. That's not including the poor pass route schemes and concepts he had to play with. It's a big reason why the O-Coordinator, Oline coach, RBs coach and QBs coach were let go recently.

Dak is better than given credit. His recent years average numbers say so. Surround him with better weapons, better Oline, better rushing attack and better pass schemes, you will see Dak perform much better.

 

[baltcowboy]

Lol so the refs missing a holding call in the open on Irving had no effect on the outcome huh

I don’t know what quarterback could have completed that sideline pass on 4th and 20 but Rodgers. The game was really lost because Garrett played for the tie. The Cowboys had the best offensive line and best running back in the league. We should have ran the ball down their throats on that final drive then throw the ball over the top to Dez if they put 8 in the box. Dak was looking for the 5 yard option route to Witten instead.

 

[America's Cowboy]

He’s found a hell of a lot more than one nut. Everyone on their starting offense except for AJ Brown was drafted. His bad decisions relate to drafting WR’s. He has now put together two teams in five years that got to the Super Bowl. I wish we had those bad decisions. Facts suck, don’t they?

True, but let's see how relevant they remain. History shows they will take another big nose dive for the next several years.

 

[Section446]

Dak is terrible, just stop.