Drop percentage

[aikemirv]

I think everyone knew Seattle's receivers had a problem, and knowing some seahawks fan, I was aware of their near hatred for Jeramy Stevens. But you're right, it was made a big deal of, because they were so important. And TO deserves it for those (we all know which ones they were). Probably, if he makes those 3-4 real important grabs, we don't care about his league leading 13-14 drops.

One thing interesting - super bowl MVP Deion Branch dropped 3 (maybe 4) passes for HUGE gains against the Chargers on Sunday. I didn't watch any highlight shows, but I haven't heard a thing about that. Lkely cost them the game, too. I don't need it explained to me why Branch and Owens are different, I'm just saying, is all.

On another note, I live in Virginia and I have had to go to a sports bar 1 time this season to see the Cowboys games. 1 time, that is a record for Cowboy games on in my area as far as I remember. ( I guess I have one thing to thank TO for!) On the other hand Seattle has had maybe 2 -3 on in my area, if that, and that counts nightime games.

So yes T.O is a bit magnified, but a lot of it has to do with the TV time the Boys have gotten this year too.

 

[Hunter71]

Owens - 144 passes, 17 drops - 11.8%
Jackson - 112 passes, 11 drops - 9.8%
A. Johnson - 157 passes, 11 drops - 7.0%
Williamson - 76 passes, 11 drops - 14.5%
Smith - 131 passes, 10 drops - 7.6%
R. Brown - 92 passes, 9 drops - 9.8%
B. Franks - 52 passes, 8 drops - 15.4%
Henderson - 50 passes, 8 drops - 16%
Moss - 97 passes, 8 drops - 8.2%
McMichael - 88 passes, 8 drops - 9.1%
Reggie Williams - 82 passes, 8 drops - 9.8%


Just thought it was interesting that TO's drop percentage isn't far out of line with any other WRs that have been targeted alot and have a little problem with dropsies. I don't know that any of them have a hand problem, either. I can't excuse the critical drops, because he really ought to be clutch, but his drop percentage isn't fantastically bad, as it's made out to be.

Thanks for pulling those together but I think they're a little misleading...

The number of passes also include passes thrown in the direction of a player...

So an errant pass that goes way over TO's head, falls short, etc. is still included in that total...

To get a better sense of the drops, you would take his catches, plus his drops, find that total and then the percentage that are dropped...

He has 79 catches, 17 drops for a total of 96 passes that COULD be caught...

Therefore, the percentage of dropped, catchable passes is actually 17.7%

 

[superpunk]

Thanks for pulling those together but I think they're a little misleading...

The number of passes also include passes thrown in the direction of a player...

So an errant pass that goes way over TO's head, falls short, etc. is still included in that total...

To get a better sense of the drops, you would take his catches, plus his drops, find that total and then the percentage that are dropped...

He has 79 catches, 17 drops for a total of 96 passes that COULD be caught...

Therefore, the percentage of dropped, catchable passes is actually 17.7%

I don't think you can state for certainty that any pass that was not caught or dropped was uncatchable. It could be tipped at any point, intercepted, led too far to the sideline, any number of things, you know? If we do that, though, I think a few players numbers get worse. For instance, Chambers pass catch pct. is something like 38%. I believe TO is at 58 and Glenn at 63.

 

[coogrfan]

I don't think I ever stated that that's what I wanted to find. Williamson is his team's #1 receiver. So is Johnson. I can't remember the others.

Williamson is second on the Vikes in targets (Travis Taylor 81, Williamson 76). A case can be made that Minn. doesn't have #1 wr on their roster, they have a bunch of #2's.

Andre Johnson is definitely a #1, but his Pro Bowl selection notwithstanding he's had a disappointing season.

Maybe I can summarize;

I found that this was Owens worst year ever for drops.

I found that even at his worst, in a new offense and with hand problems, he's not significantly worse than the worst WRs for drops in the NFL. This may not be news to anyone else, but I was under the impression that he was WAY beyond everyone else. That's nt accurate.

As for the effect on the team, only the fans can keep track of that, I'm sure. I know which of Owens' drops have affected us the most. I know Williamson dropped a sure TD against the Packers that cost his team a chance at the playoffs. But the others, I don't know.

Agreed.

 

[Hunter71]

True...

It's hard to get a good gauge of what these passes truly mean...

BUT, if dropped passes are strictly defined as what happened in DC, and against the Giants and the Eagles, then it is possible to get a better sense of what true % of dropped passes is...

I can also see someone saying that he had the ball thrown in his direction 144 times and he only caught it 50+ % of the time...

That's unfair as we don't know what THOSE missed catches (65) were all about...

Again , thrown out of bounds, into the ground, etc.

 

[Dave_in-NC]

Just a question,

Did anybody know that Jeremay Stevens ahd a drop problem before they were in the Superbowl last year?

Secondly, when they were on Sunday or Monday night football a few weeks ago did you continually hear about it?

Now, tell me again how everything TO does is magnified. I guarantee you that if he had not dropped the 4th and 2 vs NYG and the Bomb against Washington that this stuff would not even be discussed at this point in time.

His drops are magnified by two things. A couple of them were huge and he keeps complaining about not being involved!

Hate owens, never hid it. His drops do get magnified. They wouldn't if he wouldn't continually find a reason to get his mug in the press. That's the thing with him, he brings himself into the press and then complains because they magnify it.

A smarter man simply wouldn't say a thing. Oh, but then he would be fined.

 

[WV Cowboy]

Thanks for pulling those together but I think they're a little misleading...

The number of passes also include passes thrown in the direction of a player...

So an errant pass that goes way over TO's head, falls short, etc. is still included in that total...

This is what I keep coming back to, I have seen balls that were bad passes, not catchable, or extremely difficult to get to and they have been considered "another TO drop."

I have to take his broken hand and torn tendon in to account too.

Even one in the first skins game was a great defensive effort where Owens had the ball in the EZ and was trying to pull it in, with a broken hand I might add, and the DB reached in and knocked it out.

That is not a drop, that is a good defensive breakup.

So when I see 17, 14, 15 drops, or whatever, I can't take it seriously.

That being said, I hate his drops just as much I do Wittens or Glenns.

They happen though, ... like Roy said, get over it.

 

[DragonCowboy]

I hate TO RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE

T.O SHUT THE F UP ALREADY!

Oh wrong thread.

I'm afraid coogrfan's right though.

 

[romo4pres]

Owens - 144 passes, 17 drops - 11.8%
Jackson - 112 passes, 11 drops - 9.8%
A. Johnson - 157 passes, 11 drops - 7.0%
Williamson - 76 passes, 11 drops - 14.5%
Smith - 131 passes, 10 drops - 7.6%
R. Brown - 92 passes, 9 drops - 9.8%
B. Franks - 52 passes, 8 drops - 15.4%
Henderson - 50 passes, 8 drops - 16%
Moss - 97 passes, 8 drops - 8.2%
McMichael - 88 passes, 8 drops - 9.1%
Reggie Williams - 82 passes, 8 drops - 9.8%


Just thought it was interesting that TO's drop percentage isn't far out of line with any other WRs that have been targeted alot and have a little problem with dropsies. I don't know that any of them have a hand problem, either. I can't excuse the critical drops, because he really ought to be clutch, but his drop percentage isn't fantastically bad, as it's made out to be.

nice data. Somehow TO finds himself as the most underrated receiver in football! the guy is still top 3...

 

[coogrfan]

This is what I keep coming back to, I have seen balls that were bad passes, not catchable, or extremely difficult to get to and they have been considered "another TO drop."

I have to take his broken hand and torn tendon in to account too.

Even one in the first skins game was a great defensive effort where Owens had the ball in the EZ and was trying to pull it in, with a broken hand I might add, and the DB reached in and knocked it out.

That is not a drop, that is a good defensive breakup.

So when I see 17, 14, 15 drops, or whatever, I can't take it seriously.

The folks at Stats Inc (the source for the info in my earlier my post) do take those things into account. A pass is considered a drop only if the player in question got his hands on it, and could have reasonably been expected to have caught the ball (so getting a single hand on a ball doesn't count..).

That being said, I hate his drops just as much I do Wittens or Glenns.

They happen though, ... like Roy said, get over it.

True, but they happen to Owens more often than to the other elite reciever's in the game. If T.O. wants to be paid as like an elite wr he has to play like one. Right now, he is not.

 

[blindzebra]

What I see isn't just the drops, it's the give ups he makes too.

Any throw that isn't right at him, allowing him to body catch it, he pulls up on it, gets gator arms and makes the throw look worse than it was.

The Dawkins INT was an example of it.

He did it on an out 100 feet from me in the AZ game, and everyone I was sitting with said the same thing, "It would have been a tough catch, but does anyone think Glenn doesn't lay out for that pass and catch it?"

I've seen him do it several times this year. The announcers have commented on it, and they even broke it down on NFL Live.

There is a lack of focus and a lack of effort going on, and for a receiver making 10 mil and whining about making more plays, that is unacceptable.

 

[Dave_in-NC]

This is what I keep coming back to, I have seen balls that were bad passes, not catchable, or extremely difficult to get to and they have been considered "another TO drop."

I have to take his broken hand and torn tendon in to account too.

Even one in the first skins game was a great defensive effort where Owens had the ball in the EZ and was trying to pull it in, with a broken hand I might add, and the DB reached in and knocked it out.

That is not a drop, that is a good defensive breakup.

So when I see 17, 14, 15 drops, or whatever, I can't take it seriously.

That being said, I hate his drops just as much I do Wittens or Glenns.

They happen though, ... like Roy said, get over it.

Other than the finger problem, wouldn't errant passes,uncatchable balls and other mishaps count for that whole list of WRs?

 

[Dave_in-NC]

What I see isn't just the drops, it's the give ups he makes too.

Any throw that isn't right at him, allowing him to body catch it, he pulls up on it, gets gator arms and makes the throw look worse than it was.

The Dawkins INT was an example of it.

He did it on an out 100 feet from me in the AZ game, and everyone I was sitting with said the same thing, "It would have been a tough catch, but does anyone think Glenn doesn't lay out for that pass and catch it?"

I've seen him do it several times this year. The announcers have commented on it, and they even broke it down on NFL Live.

There is a lack of focus and a lack of effort going on, and for a receiver making 10 mil and whining about making more plays, that is unacceptable.

Blasphemous (sp)

 

[WV Cowboy]

Other than the finger problem, wouldn't errant passes,uncatchable balls and other mishaps count for that whole list of WRs?

I don't know, does it ??

For someone to say TG has only had 3 drops all season, I'm guessing not.

I watch all of our games, and many many (too many) others, I don't trust the whole thing myself, but that's just me.

 

[Rampage]

Owens - 144 passes, 17 drops - 11.8%
Jackson - 112 passes, 11 drops - 9.8%
A. Johnson - 157 passes, 11 drops - 7.0%
Williamson - 76 passes, 11 drops - 14.5%
Smith - 131 passes, 10 drops - 7.6%
R. Brown - 92 passes, 9 drops - 9.8%
B. Franks - 52 passes, 8 drops - 15.4%
Henderson - 50 passes, 8 drops - 16%
Moss - 97 passes, 8 drops - 8.2%
McMichael - 88 passes, 8 drops - 9.1%
Reggie Williams - 82 passes, 8 drops - 9.8%


Just thought it was interesting that TO's drop percentage isn't far out of line with any other WRs that have been targeted alot and have a little problem with dropsies. I don't know that any of them have a hand problem, either. I can't excuse the critical drops, because he really ought to be clutch, but his drop percentage isn't fantastically bad, as it's made out to be.

excuses, excuses. the pre-dallas T.O. was 10x better than all of those guys except moss. stop making excuses for butterfingers owens

 

[Da Hammer]

Owens - 144 passes, 17 drops - 11.8%
Jackson - 112 passes, 11 drops - 9.8%
A. Johnson - 157 passes, 11 drops - 7.0%
Williamson - 76 passes, 11 drops - 14.5%
Smith - 131 passes, 10 drops - 7.6%
R. Brown - 92 passes, 9 drops - 9.8%
B. Franks - 52 passes, 8 drops - 15.4%
Henderson - 50 passes, 8 drops - 16%
Moss - 97 passes, 8 drops - 8.2%
McMichael - 88 passes, 8 drops - 9.1%
Reggie Williams - 82 passes, 8 drops - 9.8%


Just thought it was interesting that TO's drop percentage isn't far out of line with any other WRs that have been targeted alot and have a little problem with dropsies. I don't know that any of them have a hand problem, either. I can't excuse the critical drops, because he really ought to be clutch, but his drop percentage isn't fantastically bad, as it's made out to be.

Great Stats Any other player and it might be talked about but no way its considered as big a deal as it with because the player is T.O. he has been known to drop the ball but no way he drops more than 10 if it werent for his hand injuries

 

[coogrfan]

Great Stats Any other player and it might be talked about but no way its considered as big a deal as it with because the player is T.O. he has been known to drop the ball but no way he drops more than 10 if it werent for his hand injuries

Please take a look at post #30 in this thread and get back to us.

 

[Chuck 54]

Owens - 144 passes, 17 drops - 11.8%
Jackson - 112 passes, 11 drops - 9.8%
A. Johnson - 157 passes, 11 drops - 7.0%
Williamson - 76 passes, 11 drops - 14.5%
Smith - 131 passes, 10 drops - 7.6%
R. Brown - 92 passes, 9 drops - 9.8%
B. Franks - 52 passes, 8 drops - 15.4%
Henderson - 50 passes, 8 drops - 16%
Moss - 97 passes, 8 drops - 8.2%
McMichael - 88 passes, 8 drops - 9.1%
Reggie Williams - 82 passes, 8 drops - 9.8%


Just thought it was interesting that TO's drop percentage isn't far out of line with any other WRs that have been targeted alot and have a little problem with dropsies. I don't know that any of them have a hand problem, either. I can't excuse the critical drops, because he really ought to be clutch, but his drop percentage isn't fantastically bad, as it's made out to be.

1. I would have no problem with a drop that was actually a tough catch or a drop of a hard zinger that required he stop it with his injured hand...I have a problem with the easy catches that float into him and are dropped across the middle because he looks away from the ball or the deep balls that he simply seems to lose focus on.

2. How many of those other WR's on your list are being paid 10 million dollars...it's not a big deal if Alvin Harper or Kelvin Martin drop that many passes or even clutch passes...it is news when Michael Irvin, your super star, drops them.

Clearly, T.O. doesn't drop them on purpose...I haven't seen him drop them out of fear of being hit, either. But when you bring in a superstar and pay him superstar money, you expect a superstar performance...his TD's not withstanding, he has not given a Super Star performance this season...just my opinion. He's still head and shoulders above anyone we could put in his place, and he has helped our offense...but I can assure you Jerry Jones and the entire coaching staff were expecting more...of that, i have no doubt.

 

[STSINAZ]

now let's get the percentage of game changing plays he drops...its alot of them

 

[LatinMind]

Owens - 144 passes, 17 drops - 11.8%
Jackson - 112 passes, 11 drops - 9.8%
A. Johnson - 157 passes, 11 drops - 7.0%
Williamson - 76 passes, 11 drops - 14.5%
Smith - 131 passes, 10 drops - 7.6%
R. Brown - 92 passes, 9 drops - 9.8%
B. Franks - 52 passes, 8 drops - 15.4%
Henderson - 50 passes, 8 drops - 16%
Moss - 97 passes, 8 drops - 8.2%
McMichael - 88 passes, 8 drops - 9.1%
Reggie Williams - 82 passes, 8 drops - 9.8%


Just thought it was interesting that TO's drop percentage isn't far out of line with any other WRs that have been targeted alot and have a little problem with dropsies. I don't know that any of them have a hand problem, either. I can't excuse the critical drops, because he really ought to be clutch, but his drop percentage isn't fantastically bad, as it's made out to be.

actually on espn they had his stats, and he has 14 statistical drops not 17. what i dont like this that 144 attempts and only 80 catches. that means the quarterbacks are missfiring at a larger rate