Eagles RPO game

[MarcusRock]

Always appreciate the insight!

Surely. Just glad more people are digging into the rules now and vetting Twitter claims rather than just running with the "we wuz robbed" popular storyline.

 

[TheFinisher]

It is hard to tell in the film, but it looks like they’re coming off duo blocks at the LOS and climbing to the second level and engaging our linebackers beyond the 1 yard threshold.

I get the rules saying an initial engagement at the LOS is fine, but it certainly looks like those guys are disengaging and climbing to the next level to engage again. That’s my issue with how they run these plays, it’s not just OL/DL at the LOS… these guys are climbing upfield to engage off ball defenders. See Item 2 section C.

Here are the rules of the play. And like with holding, there are exceptions. That video is tough to confirm if all of the exceptions have been accounted for. Basically, if they are engaged with a guy in blocking, they're good down there. And if they're not, they better stand still. The red text below means this part of the rule was added just this season. Based on that blown up tiny video, it looks like they're all engaged at the time the pass is thrown and 1 guy looks like he stands still to watch Hurts throw it. The video is garbled in the large format though.

RULE 8
SECTION 3 INELIGIBLE PLAYER DOWNFIELD
ARTICLE 1. LEGAL AND ILLEGAL ACTS. On a scrimmage play during which a legal forward pass is thrown, an ineligible
offensive player, including a T-formation quarterback, is not permitted to move more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage
before the pass has been thrown.

Item 1. Legally Downfield. An ineligible player is not illegally downfield if, after initiating contact with an opponent within one yard
of the line of scrimmage during his initial charge:
(a) he moves more than one yard beyond the line while legally blocking or being blocked by an opponent
(b) after breaking legal contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he remains stationary until
a forward pass is thrown
(c) after losing legal contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he is forced behind the line of
scrimmage by an opponent, at which time he is again subject to normal blocking restrictions for an ineligible offensive player.

Note: If an ineligible offensive player moves beyond the line while legally blocking or being blocked by an opponent, an
eligible offensive player may catch a pass between them and the line of scrimmage.
​

Item 2. Illegally Downfield. An ineligible offensive player is illegally downfield if:
(a) he moves more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage without contacting an opponent
(b) after losing contact with an opponent within one yard of the line of scrimmage, he advances more than one yard beyond the
line of scrimmage
(c) after losing contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he continues to move toward his
opponent’s goal line.
Penalty: For ineligible offensive player downfield: Loss of five yards from the previous spot.
Note: An ineligible offensive player is illegally downfield when his entire body is more than one yard beyond the line of
scrimmage.​

 

[TheFinisher]

It sure looks like they’re coming off the initial blocks and continue to climb north towards the end zone. Watch the guards, they’re climbing to engage our linebackers.

According the the rules, if the offensive linemen make initial contact within one yard and maintain that contact they are legally downfield. Watching the video clip, the Eagles linemen establish their blocks at the LOS and push the Cowboys backwards. None of them continue to move forward after breaking contact with the Cowboys defenders. That makes them all legally down field.

From the rulebook:

SECTION 3 - INELIGIBLE PLAYER DOWNFIELD
ARTICLE 1. LEGAL AND ILLEGAL ACTS
On a scrimmage play during which a legal forward pass is thrown, an ineligible offensive player, including a T-formation quarterback, is not permitted to move more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage before the pass has been thrown.

Item 1. Legally Downfield. An ineligible player is not illegally downfield if, after initiating contact with an opponent within one yard of the line of scrimmage during his initial charge:

(a) he moves more than one yard beyond the line while legally blocking or being blocked by an opponent
(b) after breaking legal contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he remains stationary until a forward pass is thrown
(c) after losing legal contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he is forced behind the line of scrimmage by an opponent, at which time he is again subject to normal blocking restrictions for an ineligible offensive player.
Note: If an ineligible offensive player moves beyond the line while legally blocking or being blocked by an opponent, an eligible offensive player may catch a pass between them and the line of scrimmage.

Item 2. Illegally Downfield. An ineligible offensive player is illegally downfield if:

(a) he moves more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage without contacting an opponent
(b) after losing contact with an opponent within one yard of the line of scrimmage, he advances more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage
(c) after losing contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he continues to move toward his opponent’s goal line.
(d) Penalty: For ineligible offensive player downfield: Loss of five yards from the previous spot.

 

[jrumann59]

RPOs are tricky and offenses are allowed more leeway than ever

if they called it everytime the RPO offense would go extinct and the nfl needs offenses to sell tickets

Yes but it is the job of the coaches to see this and tell Mike to get into the officials ears leading up to the game.

 

[davey999]

Roughing the passer would be called unless the tackler is within 2 steps before the QB releases the ball. The way to stop this would have been to see where Parsons lines up and when the QB rolls out to his side, the safety has to come up and immediately take on the receiver while Parons runs at Hurts at full speed hoping to force him to make an early throw.

Isn't he considered a "runner" if he runs the option?

 

[noshame]

When you got guys with arms like Dak and rush you should be using RPO's bootlegs and everything else in your offense to make defenses cover the whole field .
you don't have to make a living at it just show it to them

Wait until Dallas gets good at it , the rule will be enforced

once or twice a series
Finally they began moving rush around in the 2nd half and it was like a different offense

 

[MarcusRock]

It is hard to tell in the film, but it looks like they’re coming off duo blocks at the LOS and climbing to the second level and engaging our linebackers beyond the 1 yard threshold.

I get the rules saying an initial engagement at the LOS is fine, but it certainly looks like those guys are disengaging and climbing to the next level to engage again. That’s my issue with how they run these plays, it’s not just OL/DL at the LOS… these guys are climbing upfield to engage off ball defenders. See Item 2 section C.

Yeah, I don't see that. I see our LBs run up on the line and their guys engage with them but I don't see level climbing here. I ran the small video and used the video slider to make it slow motion and don't see that. Can you point out which lineman of theirs did this? Just count them off like 3rd from the left, etc.

 

[TheFinisher]

Yeah, I don't see that. I see our LBs run up on the line and their guys engage with them but I don't see level climbing here. I ran the small video and used the video slider to make it slow motion and don't see that. Can you point out which lineman of theirs did this? Just count them off like 3rd from the left, etc.

The LG bangs our nose at the LOS before climbing north to engage Parsons at the 5 yard line.

The RG also combos our Tackle and comes off the block doing the same thing, moving upfield.

It also looks like the Center, Kelce, slips of his block and re-engages again inside the 5 yard line.

I mean look at this scene, Hurts still has the ball!

 

[TheFinisher]

 

[john van brocklin]

I’ve noticed this in previous weeks and it was happening over and over last night. Their OL will come off the ball 3-4 yards run blocking essentially signaling to the defense it’s a run play. Hurts will wait until the linebackers and safeties are forced to commit to honoring those keys, and then throw the ball down field. This is completely illegal and the eagles have been exploiting this all season in their RPO game. On the RPO the decision for the quarterback to pass downfield requires him to make that decision immediately, it is impossible for him to hold onto the ball and start rolling out because by that time the lineman are 3-4 yards downfield… as far as they’re concerned they’re just blocking this up like a run play! Hurts does this constantly and it never gets called, the referees are allowing him WAY too much extended time for the run/pass option to be available to him.

Enforce the damn rules of the game!

As in Illegal man downfield ?

 

[Playmaker3128]

So how do we stop it. We’ve struggled against it against the rams in the past… also with Kyler Murray. Then there was the 49er game last year.

My guess is do more of what we did when Micah went out in coverage. Drop him back… dont dictate what your doing.

or have Micah rush but up the middle… guard center. So he can play more downhill.

problem is our run d up the middle isn’t as great so we’re susceptible to runs there. Gotta figure something out going forward.

 

[Playmaker3128]

this play is simply not Micahs fault. What the hell can he do here? He follows the wr hurts has a first… he follows hurts its to the wideout.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

If I'm DQ I instruct micah to blow the qb up whether he pitches or not. They will stop calling it.

I hope he does. It’s a free lick on the QB.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

this play is simply not Micahs fault. What the hell can he do here? He follows the wr hurts has a first… he follows hurts its to the wideout.

Yeah I don’t Know how to stop that especially in that formation.

 

[bigdnlaca]

According the the rules, if the offensive linemen make initial contact within one yard and maintain that contact they are legally downfield. Watching the video clip, the Eagles linemen establish their blocks at the LOS and push the Cowboys backwards. None of them continue to move forward after breaking contact with the Cowboys defenders. That makes them all legally down field.

From the rulebook:

SECTION 3 - INELIGIBLE PLAYER DOWNFIELD
ARTICLE 1. LEGAL AND ILLEGAL ACTS
On a scrimmage play during which a legal forward pass is thrown, an ineligible offensive player, including a T-formation quarterback, is not permitted to move more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage before the pass has been thrown.

Item 1. Legally Downfield. An ineligible player is not illegally downfield if, after initiating contact with an opponent within one yard of the line of scrimmage during his initial charge:

(a) he moves more than one yard beyond the line while legally blocking or being blocked by an opponent
(b) after breaking legal contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he remains stationary until a forward pass is thrown
(c) after losing legal contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he is forced behind the line of scrimmage by an opponent, at which time he is again subject to normal blocking restrictions for an ineligible offensive player.
Note: If an ineligible offensive player moves beyond the line while legally blocking or being blocked by an opponent, an eligible offensive player may catch a pass between them and the line of scrimmage.

Item 2. Illegally Downfield. An ineligible offensive player is illegally downfield if:

(a) he moves more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage without contacting an opponent
(b) after losing contact with an opponent within one yard of the line of scrimmage, he advances more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage
(c) after losing contact with an opponent more than one yard beyond the line of scrimmage, he continues to move toward his opponent’s goal line.
(d) Penalty: For ineligible offensive player downfield: Loss of five yards from the previous spot.

Thanks for this. It does seemed as though it was legal and they were basically mixing it up with the rushers.
This showed in the video how easy the Cowboys line can be moved on a run play.

 

[MarcusRock]

The LG bangs our nose at the LOS before climbing north to engage Parsons at the 5 yard line.

The RG also combos our Tackle and comes off the block doing the same thing, moving upfield.

It also looks like the Center, Kelce, slips of his block and re-engages again inside the 5 yard line.

Hurts still has the ball and those 3 are inside the 4 yard line.

I went and pulled my own video to see what happened on this play and ran it in slow motion.

On the LG, that's not accurate. He engages with Parsons at about the 6, which is within 1 yard. His back foot is actually on the black line denoting the LOS, so he's technically counted as engaging at the 7.

On the RG, he engages with Osa and the RT actually hits him in the back as he helps with a double team and slides Osa further onto the RG's back so that there's a push into Bohanan being blocked by Kelce. He was pushed into him and does put a hand up to brace but doesn't appear to full-on engage. After Osa is away from him, he is the one that actually stops blocking (as Kelce continues on Bohanan) and turns around to watch Hurts throw. So he checks the box of Item 1 (b) in the rule to be legally downfield.

Not sure what you're seeing with Kelce. It looks like he stumbles a little but stays on Bohanan the whole time after being assisted early by the LG. He's the first one in the end zone to greet Smith after sticking with his block the whole way. He never disengaged.
​

Again, if all of this happened like I saw it did, they could all be at the 1 yard line when Hurts threw the ball and it was all legal.

 

[MarcusRock]

The LG bangs our nose at the LOS before climbing north to engage Parsons at the 5 yard line.

The RG also combos our Tackle and comes off the block doing the same thing, moving upfield.

It also looks like the Center, Kelce, slips of his block and re-engages again inside the 5 yard line.

I mean look at this scene, Hurts still has the ball!

You added that picture after I had already started to respond but it shows all I said based on video. The LT and RT have their feet on the 6. They're good. The LG is still engaged with Parsons after contacting him within 1 yard of the LOS, not the 5. The RG is looking back because he became disengaged from his original block more than 1 yard downfield, so he has to stop. He did that and turned around to watch the pass. Kelce is still engaged in his original block and has turned Bohanan around but is clearly still engaged.

What is the problem here?

 

[Zman5]

Clear as day the EaGirl's OL were still blocking past 1 yard of LOS(7 yard line).

 

[MarcusRock]

Clear as day the EaGirl's OL were still blocking past 1 yard of LOS(7 yard line).

Find the rules in the thread, young man.

 

[lostar2009]

If I'm DQ I instruct micah to blow the qb up whether he pitches or not. They will stop calling it.

He did a few times.