Forget Dak, he's not the problem

[Diehardblues]

Dak should have plenty of supporting cast. We had an amazing supporting cast all around in the 70s and 90s. I blame Dak for a lot, but I'm not blaming him for our last two playoff losses. The Cowboys went 13-3 and we still had that same crap D. Similar to what Romo had in '14 with that same crap D. Relatively speaking Dak has the best supporting cast a Cowboys QB has had in a very long time going into this season. Because all teams are subject to the same cap restraints.

I don't think Dak is as good as our past HOF QBs. I don't even think he's as good as Romo. But he has some qualities that surpass Romo. I'm saying he's still a good QB. If QB Jeff Hostetler can win a super bowl with an inferior team, Dak can win one with this team.

In the end it’s about what you do with the surrounding talent.

Troy needed Elite talent . But look what he did with it. That’s the difference.

 

[DandyDon52]

Dak was a little part of the problem in the playoffs....but it was a team loss (and a coaching loss).

His atrocious inaccuracy in the first half helped lead to the deficit that they had to try to come back from.

That being said, he played great in the second half. Now that he has a different QB coach and OC, I expect him to do better. I assume he's working on his weaknesses in the off-season and well see an improved Dak come regular season time. I'm just against paying him until next season because I would want to be SURE. I think he'll be good, but I'd want to be sure about any player I was about to drop 30 million on.


If they signed Dak for 25 million this season, I'd be all for it. But if they told him 25 now or wait until next year and if we see that you kicked tail, we'll offer you 28-30, I'd be okay with that. I just think that the current QB market is ridiculous given how much cap it takes up. Teams that overpay their QB generally don't go anywhere.

Romo was overpaid and it hurt the team. Rogers was overpaid and it hurt the Packers... etc etc.

That is partly true, they lose players, or cant afford to keep or sign a few players.
But without the QB's they probably would not do any better.
So teams have to sign the qb's, it is just the way it is, and it is up to the coaches to make the best of it.
The problem is the coaches just are not that good, throughout the nfl.

Belichek is the only one who is good, and that is why even with a lesser team he still wins all the time.
The other coaches cant compete with him.
Belichek could have won a SB or 2 with Romo, maybe more, he could win one with the current dallas roster.
So to me it is more about the coaching, than the qb's.

 

[DandyDon52]

Dak should have plenty of supporting cast. We had an amazing supporting cast all around in the 70s and 90s. I blame Dak for a lot, but I'm not blaming him for our last two playoff losses. The Cowboys went 13-3 and we still had that same crap D. Similar to what Romo had in '14 with that same crap D. Relatively speaking Dak has the best supporting cast a Cowboys QB has had in a very long time going into this season. Because all teams are subject to the same cap restraints.

I don't think Dak is as good as our past HOF QBs. I don't even think he's as good as Romo. But he has some qualities that surpass Romo. I'm saying he's still a good QB. If QB Jeff Hostetler can win a super bowl with an inferior team, Dak can win one with this team.

Dak doesnt have bill parcells, as HC and Belichek as the DC. I think they were still there when jeff won.
The coaching matters.

 

[Flamma]

Coaching matters absolutely.

 

[PAPPYDOG]

Dak Prescott is problem # 1 and is holding this team back from Superbowl Glory!
Our passing game is for the dogs and 1-3 yard check-downs will never take us to the promise land!

 

[G2]

In the end it’s about what you do with the surrounding talent.

Troy needed Elite talent . But look what he did with it. That’s the difference.

All QBs need talent around them, that's why it's called a "team."

 

[ghst187]

True but look at the talent on both Aikman and Staubach's teams. Both had HOF RB's and one a HOF WR and the D's were peppered with great players and HOFers. And let's not forget coaching as well.

More importantly look at the coaching for Aikman and Staubach...
Jimmy and Landry....two all time greats that got the most out of heir players, were innovative, and motivating.....JG has none of that...

 

[ElGatoGrande]

It's a lot harder to coach a consistent contender these days IMO. With free agency and the salary cap it's almost impossible to consistently have a balanced team with depth and with the rule changes the teams that have an elite QB have a huge advantage over everyone else. Throw in the ridiculous officiating and you've got to be lucky AND good to make it to the NFC championship alone, much less win the Superbowl. I think this coach has built a good team, from the ground up through the draft, and now we just have to hope that the QB can get to the point where he can make teams pay for focusing on the run. If and when that happens then we'll have to hope for some luck too.

 

[Jake]

Dak should have plenty of supporting cast. We had an amazing supporting cast all around in the 70s and 90s. I blame Dak for a lot, but I'm not blaming him for our last two playoff losses. The Cowboys went 13-3 and we still had that same crap D. Similar to what Romo had in '14 with that same crap D. Relatively speaking Dak has the best supporting cast a Cowboys QB has had in a very long time going into this season. Because all teams are subject to the same cap restraints.

I don't think Dak is as good as our past HOF QBs. I don't even think he's as good as Romo. But he has some qualities that surpass Romo. I'm saying he's still a good QB. If QB Jeff Hostetler can win a super bowl with an inferior team, Dak can win one with this team.

Hostetler won a Super Bowl backed by a defense that only allowed 13 points to the 49ers and 19 to the Bills. The Giants scored a total of 35 points in those two wins.

Dak has lost two playoff games. The defense allowed 34 and 30 points in those losses. Even Aikman and Staubach never won a playoff game in which Dallas allowed 30 points.

 

[Diehardblues]

All QBs need talent around them, that's why it's called a "team."

Yep ... and they are defined by what they do with it.

The greats play for championships when surrounded by enough talent.

 

[CouchCoach]

And I agree with you
I'm not arguing you don't need a better team, of course you do
My point is that to seriously contend on a consistent basis and to have a realistic chance to win a SB you need a great/elite QB. You can win one in a blue moon with an average QB but not contend consistently.

A team constructed well, and I do think the Cowboys are one of those, can contend with just a good, not great QB, but they have to be balanced on O and D and in the pass/run and most of all be healthy. The bane of the game is that injury report and the players lost to IR.

Just look at that thread about Spagnola's article about all of the off season surgeries, a lot of shoulders. We, all too often, criticize players when we don't really know how healthy they are. I remember one year everyone was talking about Emmitt's career winding down and he wasn't the old Emmitt and he played on an ankle that required surgery all season long. Then we did the same with Ware and the man couldn't lift his arm to a 90 degree angle. Lord Byron had a hip issue and how important is the hip to a DB?

 

[CouchCoach]

Hostetler won a Super Bowl backed by a defense that only allowed 13 points to the 49ers and 19 to the Bills. The Giants scored a total of 35 points in those two wins.

Dak has lost two playoff games. The defense allowed 34 and 30 points in those losses. Even Aikman and Staubach never won a playoff game in which Dallas allowed 30 points.

And how many points did the Patriots allow to that juggernaut Rams offense?

 

[G2]

Yep ... and they are defined by what they do with it.

The greats play for championships when surrounded by enough talent.

Even QBs who aren't elite/top 5 have SB rings. Balance is the key.

 

[Flamma]

Hostetler won a Super Bowl backed by a defense that only allowed 13 points to the 49ers and 19 to the Bills. The Giants scored a total of 35 points in those two wins.

Dak has lost two playoff games. The defense allowed 34 and 30 points in those losses. Even Aikman and Staubach never won a playoff game in which Dallas allowed 30 points.

Well, for Roger I think only twice did an opposing team score over 30 in a playoff game. Same with Aikman and he didn't start one of them. So yeah, defense is important. I just think Dallas will step up on D this upcoming season similar to what happened between '91 and '92. If that doesn't happen we're not getting past the Div round.

 

[Diehardblues]

And how many points did the Patriots allow to that juggernaut Rams offense?

That same Patriot defense also gave up 28 and 31 to Chargers and Chiefs respectively. And needed more offense to win both of those games.

Framing the argument over that lone playoff game in Super Bowl doesn’t tell the whole story and why statistics aren’t drawn on one game alone.

 

[Diehardblues]

Even QBs who aren't elite/top 5 have SB rings. Balance is the key.

Of course but that’s not the norm. The list of Bus Drivers is much shorter.

And most of those in Cap era are winning while on Rookie contract. Once less than Elite QB’s are paid they aren’t afforded as much surrounding support.

 

[jazzcat22]

To be fair, Dak is pretty easy to forget.

Not as easy as that guy in Philly, what's his name, you know, the guy who's accuracy is built around 2 out pass. Well, whatever his name is.

 

[G2]

Of course but that’s not the norm. The list of Bus Drivers is much shorter.

And most of those in Cap era are winning while on Rookie contract. Once less than Elite QB’s are paid they aren’t afforded as much surrounding support.

That's a very subjective phrase that gets tossed around often. Most use is as a derogatory term. There are more "bus drivers" than you suggest.

 

[Diehardblues]

That's a very subjective phrase that gets tossed around often. Most use is as a derogatory term. There are more "bus drivers" than you suggest.

No doubt Bus Driver is subjective. Much like Elite is. Not everyone agrees on the particulars.

I’m not denying Dak might be enough to win a championship. He has some intangible assets. But based on what I’ve seen he needs a greater supporting cast than more prolific passers. I know. Another subjective term.

And once we pay him it’s going to be tougher if we aren’t able to surround him with the same level of support.

Wanting or thinking a more prolific passer or Elite QB would enhance our chances doesn’t have to be a derogatory thought on Dak. That’s what I believe would help put us over the top. When you have one of those QB’s then the discussion for improvement can move elsewhere.

But as long as he’s not and continue not playing for championships then it’s going to be front and center.

 

[visionary]

A team constructed well, and I do think the Cowboys are one of those, can contend with just a good, not great QB, but they have to be balanced on O and D and in the pass/run and most of all be healthy. The bane of the game is that injury report and the players lost to IR.

Just look at that thread about Spagnola's article about all of the off season surgeries, a lot of shoulders. We, all too often, criticize players when we don't really know how healthy they are. I remember one year everyone was talking about Emmitt's career winding down and he wasn't the old Emmitt and he played on an ankle that required surgery all season long. Then we did the same with Ware and the man couldn't lift his arm to a 90 degree angle. Lord Byron had a hip issue and how important is the hip to a DB?

But that's exactly why the great/elite QB is so important
These hurdles WILL occur but he can get the team through them. An average QB has a tough enough time doing what he's asked, he can't overcome these losses

JMO of course