Garrett expectations?

[KJJ]

Given the injury on defense we gave up points at will. I think you hire a coach you give him time if your not willing to do that chances are you will not find a HC who would take the job. I don't care if you have a QB or not a football team is more than 1 position

The defense had injuries last season but what's the excuse for the way the defense performed in 2011 and the way it performed in 2010 which resulted in the D giving up a franchise record number of points? Sure injuries played a part in what happened last season but the defense has been playing like crap since 2010 which is why Ryan got the boot. Even before Lee and Carter went down the defense wasn't looking good. A well rested D got shredded in week 2 vs Seattle. As for the coaching the way Jerry undermines all his head coaches no strong, capable HC will take the job. A team is more than one position but the NFL is a QB driven league and there's no excuse for any team to suffer through back to back 8-8 seasons that has a franchise QB who's put up the numbers Romo has the past 2 seasons.

He had a career season in 2011 finishing the year with a 102.5 passer rating and the Cowboys still ended up 8-8. There's been issues with the play calling which is why Garrett was stripped of that job and there's been issues with game management that's cost the team games and will undoubtedly cost Garrett his job if it continues. One of the main reasons Garrett was stripped of his play calling duties wasn't just the issues with his play calling it's an attempt to help free him up so he can manage games better.

 

[Avenger]

Prior to the team quitting on fatso 2 1/2 years ago the Cowboys were coming off 3 consecutive winning seasons making the playoffs twice and had a playoff win. In 2 full seasons under Garrett the team has back to back 8-8 seasons missing the playoffs both years. If that's heading in the right direction then I'm missing something. Like Garrett in 2010 Leslie Frazier also took over as an interim HC in Minn and after an awful 2011 season had the Vikings in the playoffs at 10-6 in 2012.

The Vikings appear to be a team headed in the right direction and they don't even have a QB near the caliber of Tony Romo. Jim Harbaugh took over a 6-10 SF team in 2011 and because of a lockout didn't have the luxury of OTA's or minicamps but still led SF to the NFC title game that season with Alex Smith who had been a bust.

Harbaugh just led SF to the SB last season with a second year QB who took over during the season. How many seasons does Garrett need before we see at least some progress or are you one of those who's seen some progress? Funny how some FANS saw last seasons 8-8 season as being better than the 8-8 season in 2011. As for the 17 players still on the roster from the team that quit on Wade the players who are no longer here like Mike Jenkins are the ones who quit on him.

Garrett took over a 1-7 team of quitters in 2010 and won 5 out of the next 8 games with a 40 year old backup QB, so he's already shown "improvement".
His teams (in transition) have played .500 ball in the last two years... and that sucks, but both seasons we were in a win or go home final game and couldn't get it done.
Garrett's team is moving forward and I expect marked improvement from them this season.

 

[Rockport]

It's telling how we do what if's on negative topics instead of positive ones. No offense to the OP because Jerry's given us more negative's lately.

 

[PA Cowboy Fan]

Garrett took over a 1-7 team of quitters in 2010 and won 5 out of the next 8 games with a 40 year old backup QB, so he's already shown "improvement".
His teams (in transition) have played .500 ball in the last two years... and that sucks, but both seasons we were in a win or go home final game and couldn't get it done.
Garrett's team is moving forward and I expect marked improvement from them this season.

Was it really Garrett that was responsible for that or where the players afraid of Jerry? That was over 2 years ago and I haven't seen that intensity since. I guess we'll find out this year.

 

[Idgit]

..That was over 2 years ago and I haven't seen that intensity since. I guess we'll find out this year.

You haven't? They played with a heck of a lot of intensity last season.

 

[PA Cowboy Fan]

You haven't? They played with a heck of a lot of intensity last season.

All I really saw last year was a lot of sloppy play. That included a team that couldn't get going until after halftime in a lot of games. To be honest, I still don't know how they won 8 games so I guess that's something. I hope this year will be better.

 

[WPBCowboysFan]

Jerry brought Garrett to Dallas in 07 to groom him to be his next HC and even over paid him as the OC to keep him around after Garrett began receiving head coaching interest after the 07 season so regardless of the start the Cowboys get off to in 2013 Jerry will not fire him during the season. He only fired Wade during the season because he couldn't wait to get Garrett's feet wet as the HC. There isn't anyone on the staff that Jerry is itching to be his next HC so you can bet he's going to give Garrett the entire 2013 season regardless of how bad things go. Jerry had a hard enough time admitting he was taking the play calling duties away from Garrett so he's committed to him for the entire 2013 season.

Jerry is so enamored with Garrett he won't even admit he's coaching for his job in 2013. Who knows maybe Garrett isn't and he'll be back in 2014 even if the Cowboys suffer through another 8-8 season. It may take a 5-11 to 6-10 season for Jerry to pull the plug on his boy. Jerry wants so much for Garrett to be the long-term answer at HC he's going to give him every chance to develop as a HC. My gut feeling tells me another 8-8 season will probably lead to a head coaching change. If the Cowboys go 9-7 to 10-6 and still miss the playoffs the improved record might be just enough for Jerry to give Garrett another year.

Why would an owner/GM who is enamored with his HC, yank the play calling duties from that HC?

You guys that put all this stuff on Jerry cant even see the contradictions you create . . . . . . . . . . . . amazing.

 

[Idgit]

All I really saw last year was a lot of sloppy play. That included a team that couldn't get going until after halftime in a lot of games. To be honest, I still don't know how they won 8 games so I guess that's something. I hope this year will be better.

Ok, then. We were watching different things. I saw the sloppy play on offense, too, early. But attributed most of that to the juggling on the OL we'd done since day one of camp. Once they settled down, we had a stretch there where we were one of the hotter teams in the league, and we refused to go away against some pretty good teams.

 

[KJJ]

Why would an owner/GM who is enamored with his HC, yank the play calling duties from that HC?

You guys that put all this stuff on Jerry cant even see the contradictions you create . . . . . . . . . . . . amazing.

He stripped Garrett of his play calling duties to free him up in hopes it will improve his game management so he doesn't have to fire him as HC. It took Jerry practically the entire offseason to even admit Garrett would no longer call the plays. Even after it leaked he still wouldn't confirm it.

I'm surprised Jerry didn't go into the season with both Garrett and Callahan standing on the sidelines with play sheets in front of their face so no one would know who was calling the plays. All the issues with the Cowboys starts with Jerry he's admitted that.

 

[KJJ]

Garrett took over a 1-7 team of quitters in 2010 and won 5 out of the next 8 games with a 40 year old backup QB, so he's already shown "improvement".
His teams (in transition) have played .500 ball in the last two years... and that sucks, but both seasons we were in a win or go home final game and couldn't get it done.
Garrett's team is moving forward and I expect marked improvement from them this season.

Garrett won 5-8 games after Jerry fired Wade and ripped the team telling the players "I didn't fire Wade YOU fired him!" Jerry let the players know they were playing for their jobs and it would be their heads rolling next. A lot of teams play better after their HC gets fired during the season it's a wake up call. After Mike Singletary took over as interim HC for a 2-5 49ers team in 08 they finished the season 5-4 under him. We all know how it ended up for Singletary. What some fail to realize is that Garrett was partially responsible for that 1-7 start under Wade with him being the OC. It was Garrett's play call on opening day vs Wash right before the half that led to a scoop and score fumble return that helped cost the Cowboys that game. Even as the OC Garrett showed poor judgment.

That 2010 team was Wade's team Garrett was just handed the controls until he could put his own touch on the team. He's had 2 full seasons to get the team moving forward but all the Cowboys have been doing is spinning their wheels at 8-8. Most fans expected marked improvement last season with Garrett having a full offseason to prepare unlike in 2011 when there was a lockout. Comparing the 2011 8-8 season with the 2012 8-8 season I thought the Cowboys looked better in 2011. The Cowboys were able to put back to back wins together during week 2 and 3 of the 2011 season which is something they weren't able to accomplish until week 10 and 11 of the 2012 season.

The Cowboys biggest margin of victory in 2012 was only by 15 points over Philly. In 2011 the Cowboys blew out Buffalo by 37 points and the Rams by 27 points. In 2012 the Cowboys never put more than 3 wins together but in 2011 they were able to put 4 straight wins together. The 2011 team looked like it would win 10 to 11 games that season heading into Dec until they finished 1-4. The 2012 team looked like they would finish 6-10 to 7-9 heading into Dec. It took 3 straight wins in Dec for that team to reach 500. The Cowboys haven't moved an inch forward since the interim tag was removed from Garrett. Another up and down 500 season will force Jerry to have to fire him. With all the coaching moves and Garrett being stripped of his play calling duties the writing is on wall heading into this season.

 

[Idgit]

Garrett won 5-8 games after Jerry fired Wade and ripped the team telling the players "I didn't fire Wade YOU fired him!" Jerry let the players know they were playing for their jobs and it would be their heads rolling next. A lot of teams play better after their HC gets fired during the season it's a wake up call. After Mike Singletary took over as interim HC for a 2-5 49ers team in 08 they finished the season 5-4 under him. We all know how it ended up for Singletary. What some fail to realize is that Garrett was partially responsible for that 1-7 start under Wade with him being the OC. It was Garrett's play call on opening day vs Wash right before the half that led to a scoop and score fumble return that helped cost the Cowboys that game. Even as the OC Garrett showed poor judgment.

That 2010 team was Wade's team Garrett was just handed the controls until he could put his own touch on the team. He's had 2 full seasons to get the team moving forward but all the Cowboys have been doing is spinning their wheels at 8-8. Most fans expected marked improvement last season with Garrett having a full offseason to prepare unlike in 2011 when there was a lockout. Comparing the 2011 8-8 season with the 2012 8-8 season I thought the Cowboys looked better in 2011. The Cowboys were able to put back to back wins together during week 2 and 3 of the 2011 season which is something they weren't able to accomplish until week 10 and 11 of the 2012 season.

The Cowboys biggest margin of victory in 2012 was only by 15 points over Philly. In 2011 the Cowboys blew out Buffalo by 37 points and the Rams by 27 points. In 2012 the Cowboys never put more than 3 wins together but in 2011 they were able to put 4 straight wins together. The 2011 team looked like it would win 10 to 11 games that season heading into Dec until they finished 1-4. The 2012 team looked like they would finish 6-10 to 7-9 heading into Dec. It took 3 straight wins in Dec for that team to reach 500. The Cowboys haven't moved an inch forward since the interim tag was removed from Garrett. Another up and down 500 season will force Jerry to have to fire him. With all the coaching moves and Garrett being stripped of his play calling duties the writing is on wall heading into this season.

Ever notice how the same sorts of posters (not you in particular here, KJJ) who believe these fantastically negative interpretations of reality tend to also be the ones who also complain about QB play, and how pathetic the OL play is, and about spending too much money on players like Anthony Spencer, and about how poorly the head coach calls plays, and about how the organization drafts/operates/signs free agents?

It's a wonder we're not 0-16 every year if every single negative spin were accepted as true.

Thankfully, most of it falls squarely into the category of 'one possible interpretation,' while the team has remained relatively competitive while adding depth to the roster without much in the way of additional draft picks or free agent signings. It's been fun to watch.

 

[KJJ]

Ever notice how the same sorts of posters (not you in particular here, KJJ) who believe these fantastically negative interpretations of reality tend to also be the ones who also complain about QB play, and how pathetic the OL play is, and about spending too much money on players like Anthony Spencer, and about how poorly the head coach calls plays, and about how the organization drafts/operates/signs free agents?

It's a wonder we're not 0-16 every year if every single negative spin were accepted as true.

Thankfully, most of it falls squarely into the category of 'one possible interpretation,' while the team has remained relatively competitive while adding depth to the roster without much in the way of additional draft picks or free agent signings. It's been fun to watch.

One thing you learn from being on forums like this is that most posters interpret the Cowboys a lot differently than others. A lot of how a poster sees the team is determined by whether they're an optimist/pessimist or a realist. Sometimes their interpretation of the team comes strictly from what they feel in their heart and from what they hope will happen. Some can be overly positive about the team while others can be overly negative. If you're going to see the Cowboys for what they are you have to strike a balance between an optimist and a pessimist. You have to be able recognize the positives and the negatives with the team.

You have to take every win by the Cowboys in stride as well as every loss. The way things have been going for the team the past few seasons you have to keep your expectations realistic. The game has changed so any team that makes the playoffs has a chance. The last 2 SB winning teams were 9-7 and 10-6. Record wise the Cowboys aren't that far off. They've competed toe to toe with both SB winning teams from 2011 and 2012 but you have to make the playoffs to have a chance. The Cowboys have a HC who's a work in progress I think we can all agree to that. Obviously after 3 straight seasons with no playoffs Jerry can't wait much longer to see some clear movement forward.

Progress will be determined in 2013 by the Cowboys won/loss record. Another 500 season is not going to keep Garrett around another year. I may not believe in Garrett as a HC because he hasn't given me any reason to believe in him after back to back 500 seasons but I'm pulling for him because no guarantees the next HC Jerry throws in front of the media licking and smacking his lips over will turn out to be any better.

 

[WPBCowboysFan]

Sometimes their interpretation of the team comes strictly from what they feel in their heart

Sorta like thinking Red was "stripped" of his play calling? Thats a mediat created story that just doesnt fit reality and yet you keep preaching it.

 

[JackWagon]

I dunno ... if it gets really bad .. like 2-6 ... I could see JJ pulling the trigger and hiring Chucky out of the booth.

 

[Doomsday101]

One thing you learn from being on forums like this is that most posters interpret the Cowboys a lot differently than others. A lot of how a poster sees the team is determined by whether they're an optimist/pessimist or a realist. Sometimes their interpretation of the team comes strictly from what they feel in their heart and from what they hope will happen. Some can be overly positive about the team while others can be overly negative. If you're going to see the Cowboys for what they are you have to strike a balance between an optimist and a pessimist. You have to be able recognize the positives and the negatives with the team.

You have to take every win by the Cowboys in stride as well as every loss. The way things have been going for the team the past few seasons you have to keep your expectations realistic. The game has changed so any team that makes the playoffs has a chance. The last 2 SB winning teams were 9-7 and 10-6. Record wise the Cowboys aren't that far off. They've competed toe to toe with both SB winning teams from 2011 and 2012 but you have to make the playoffs to have a chance. The Cowboys have a HC who's a work in progress I think we can all agree to that. Obviously after 3 straight seasons with no playoffs Jerry can't wait much longer to see some clear movement forward.

Progress will be determined in 2013 by the Cowboys won/loss record. Another 500 season is not going to keep Garrett around another year. I may not believe in Garrett as a HC because he hasn't given me any reason to believe in him after back to back 500 seasons but I'm pulling for him because no guarantees the next HC Jerry throws in front of the media licking and smacking his lips over will turn out to be any better.

It was the reality of last season funny people here talk about being realist well lets get real, if you lose 4 to 5 key player on defense your team will struggle that is reality not an excuse a reality. Backups are backup for a reason. Garrett is turning this roster, he is putting in players he wants that he feels that they will approach this game as he believes they should instead of the prima donna it is all about me type players.

As I said Garrett has to win there is no question he is in year 3 and he must produce results. this notion that he should not get at least 3 years is BS most teams who hire coaches do give them the time to put their team together. You guys show no paients you take the total 17 years you moan about and throw it on the back on Garrett. I don't know if he will fail or not but you bet he should get the same chance as any HC that gets hired in the NFL

 

[visionary]

Garrett took over a 1-7 team of quitters in 2010 and won 5 out of the next 8 games with a 40 year old backup QB, so he's already shown "improvement".
His teams (in transition) have played .500 ball in the last two years... and that sucks, but both seasons we were in a win or go home final game and couldn't get it done.
Garrett's team is moving forward and I expect marked improvement from them this season.

can you please explain this, because your fuzzy logic escapes me a little

under garrett

2010: 5-3 = .600
2011: 8-8 = .500 lost win or go home game
2012: 8-8 = .500; lost win or go home game

can you show me the "improvement"?

if by "moving forward" and "improvement" you mean regressing and doing worse then you might be on to something

 

[KJJ]

Sorta like thinking Red was "stripped" of his play calling? Thats a mediat created story that just doesnt fit reality and yet you keep preaching it.

His play calling duties were taken away like that one better? Was Garrett's play calling duties not taken away or are you saying he freely gave up his play calling duties? You honestly believe what he said that he was board with the change?

 

[KJJ]

It was the reality of last season funny people here talk about being realist well lets get real, if you lose 4 to 5 key player on defense your team will struggle that is reality not an excuse a reality. Backups are backup for a reason. Garrett is turning this roster, he is putting in players he wants that he feels that they will approach this game as he believes they should instead of the prima donna it is all about me type players.

As I said Garrett has to win there is no question he is in year 3 and he must produce results. this notion that he should not get at least 3 years is BS most teams who hire coaches do give them the time to put their team together. You guys show no paients you take the total 17 years you moan about and throw it on the back on Garrett. I don't know if he will fail or not but you bet he should get the same chance as any HC that gets hired in the NFL

Never said the injuries last season didn't play a part but you didn't answer the question what was the issue with the defense in 2011 and 2010? The defense hasn't been good in 3 years was it all due to injuries? If it was all due to injuries Ryan would still be the DC and the Cowboys wouldn't be changing their scheme. Ryan took over the defense in 2011 and was excused for the subpar defensive performance that season due to the lockout. He wasn't able to implement his scheme until training camp so he got a pass in 2011. Even before all the injuries last season the defense didn't look good Jerry went as far as to admit that when asked why Ryan was fired. He brought up the Seattle game in week 2 and the Chicago game in week 5 before all the injuries. He said you can't count on having a healthy team at the end of every season.

As for Garrett he's been with the Cowboys since 07 as the OC that should have given him an advantage taking over at HC. He got 8 games in 2010 to get his feet wet and the team showed more progress during those 8 games than they have the last 32 games under him. As I mentioned the main reason that 2010 team played better under Garrett the final 8 games was due to the players fearing for their jobs. Another big reason that team played better they had nothing to play for being out of the playoffs so they were able to go out and throw caution to the wind. It's easy for a lot of teams to loosen up and play better when they're out of the playoff picture and they get to play spoiler the rest of the season.

A lot of fans are inpatient because Garrett didn't take over a team that needed to be rebuilt. That 2010 team was picked by many prior to that season to go to the SB. Garrett took over a talented but underachieving team in 2010. There's no excuse for a team that has one of the most productive QB's in the league who's blessed with a very talented receiving corp led by a future HOF TE and a defense that has one of the great sack masters of this era who's also a future Hall of Famer only able to manage 8 wins in each of the last 2 seasons. That's not acceptable! We'll see how many FANS are still preaching patience if the Cowboys go 8-8 for a 3rd straight season.

 

[Doomsday101]

Never said the injuries last season didn't play a part but you didn't answer the question what was the issue with the defense in 2011 and 2010? The defense hasn't been good in 3 years was it all due to injuries? If it was all due to injuries Ryan would still be the DC and the Cowboys wouldn't be changing their scheme. Ryan took over the defense in 2011 and was excused for the subpar defensive performance that season due to the lockout. He wasn't able to implement his scheme until training camp so he got a pass in 2011. Even before all the injuries last season the defense didn't look good Jerry went as far as to admit that when asked why Ryan was fired. He brought up the Seattle game in week 2 and the Chicago game in week 5 before all the injuries. He said you can't count on having a healthy team at the end of every season.

As for Garrett he's been with the Cowboys since 07 as the OC that should have given him an advantage taking over at HC. He got 8 games in 2010 to get his feet wet and the team showed more progress during those 8 games than they have the last 32 games under him. As I mentioned the main reason that 2010 team played better under Garrett the final 8 games was due to the players fearing for their jobs. Another big reason that team played better they had nothing to play for being out of the playoffs so they were able to go out and throw caution to the wind. It's easy for a lot of teams to loosen up and play better when they're out of the playoff picture and they get to play spoiler for 8 games.

A lot of fans are inpatient because Garrett didn't take over a team that needed to be rebuilt. That 2010 team was picked by many prior to that season to go to the SB. Garrett took over a talented but underachieving team in 2010. There's no excuse for a team that has one of the most productive QB's in the league blessed with a very talented receiving corp led by a future HOF TE and a defense that has one of the great sack masters of this era who's also a future Hall of Famer only able to manage 8 wins in each of the last 2 seasons. That's not acceptable! We'll see how many FANS are still preaching patience if the Cowboys go 8-8 for a 3rd straight season.

No excuse at all, as I said I think when any HC is hired they should be given at least 3 years to get a program in place and turned around. Being OC is not the same as HC so regardless of how many years he has been OC does not change anything. I'm not giving Garrett some free ride, I give him the same leeway I would give any HC on any team in sports.

For me this has nothing to do with some love I have for Garrett is has to do with the respect I have for the job of HC and any person hired I would give them that same courtesy. Lastly and I have said in this thread and others this is a must season for Garrett I don’t believe he can survive a losing season.

 

[Rockport]

Why would an owner/GM who is enamored with his HC, yank the play calling duties from that HC?

You guys that put all this stuff on Jerry cant even see the contradictions you create . . . . . . . . . . . . amazing.

We really don't know how the play calling duty switch played out. I do think that if Garrett wanted to continue to call plays, he would still be calling plays. However in his words, 28 head coaches don't call the plays tells you something.