Gibbs leaves Skins 23 Million over the salary cap.

[vicjagger]

He got a $3 million bonus when he signed and has an $11 million roster bonus due in 2008. Washington has the right to prorate the bonus, which they obviously will.




They already released him in November, right after he died (or perhaps he was automatically released, by rule). His accelerated bonuses are already counting $2,479,000 against their 2008 cap.

Thanks for the clarification.

Are you still projecting the Skins at about 136M, and the cap at $116M? I think $136.2M was the last number I saw from you but IIRC it was from a post in September, and I know there's debits and credits to be calculated...

I have (perhaps mistakenly) relied on http://www.thewarpath.net/WarpathRedskinsCap.htm

I'm not sure if this site is wrong, or if they have taken the liberty of projecting Cooley's roster to signing bonus conversion, since it's a no-brainer.

:bang2:

Can you refer us laypeople to a more reliable source for cap/contract info? Or are you our only hope...kinda like our lifeline in a sea of misinformation?

 

[Yakuza Rich]

http://i127.***BLOCKED***/albums/p149/1chriscash/minibusve1.jpg

Trucked. It's too bad it wasn't while he was in a skins uni.

I wonder if any Skins fans are still doing Archuleta's workout program.



YAKUZA

 

[AdamJT13]

Are you still projecting the Skins at about 136M, and the cap at $116M? I think $136.2M was the last number I saw from you but IIRC it was from a post in September, and I know there's debits and credits to be calculated.

Right now, they have $139.3 million committed to the 2008 cap. That's about $17 million more than the next team (Indianapolis) and $39.5 million more than the average.

They'll be doing their usual cut-or-restructure-and-put-off-the-cap-hit routine again this offseason, of course.

 

[Bleu Star]

They'll be doing their usual cut-or-restructure-and-put-off-the-cap-hit routine again this offseason, of course.

I'm thinking this will eventually catch up with them.

 

[vicjagger]

Right now, they have $139.3 million committed to the 2008 cap. That's about $17 million more than the next team (Indianapolis) and $39.5 million more than the average.

They'll be doing their usual cut-or-restructure-and-put-off-the-cap-hit routine again this offseason, of course.

I'm presuming the lions' share of the increase from 136 to 139 was from Sean Taylor's release. Maybe now they should come up with a new name for the portion of the salary cap attributable to former players.

It seems to me that the 'Skins have about 95% of their cap tied up in their top 30 players. Are they more "top heavy" than other teams?

So they start 23.3M over, cut 9.16M by guaranteeing & prorating Cooley's bonus, leaving 14.14M still to go. Now they prune Brunell, Daniels, Springs, Washington, Kendall, Griffin, Rabach & Betts. Gross savings approx 17.5M, less the 3.5 million or so you need for the 9 back-ups to take their places (including #21) and viola, they're right there. Whack a few more, re-structure a few more, and they might have room for their draft picks, assuming they have some.

I think they're going to need a punter and a kicker, too. I'm not sure that they have either under contract for next year. And Todd Collins is a free agent, plus with Brunell gone, they're going to need to find some new QBs.

No problem at all. How can anyone think they're in cap hell?

 

[DallasInDC]

I have (perhaps mistakenly) relied on http://www.thewarpath.net/WarpathRedskinsCap.htm

I'm not sure if this site is wrong, or if they have taken the liberty of projecting Cooley's roster to signing bonus conversion, since it's a no-brainer.

I don't know how accruate that site is but according to it, they have about $10.2M in 2008 roster bonuses which could be converted to save roughly $7M. With that, plus the Cooley/Brunell savings, they will still need to reduce their cap figure by another $7M to get under the cap and pay for draft picks. I guess they could get that by releasing some vet players who are short on their contracts. However, considering they only have 45 players signed for next year, and releasing players only decreases that number, they will still need money to fill out their roster (can you say undrafted FA).

Snyder may be able to manipulate the cap to get under and sign the outrageous contracts for mediocre players but this is definetly the wrong way to build team. Basically, he is building his team with over the hill vets and late round/undrafted rookies.

I can't wait to see what type of product they put on the field next year especially without the motivation of playing for ST and a huge QB controversy looming.

 

[StevenOtero]

Just turn it off! Oh...wait this isn't Madden.

 

[Boysboy]

To be fair to the Skins in the last couple of years, with not that many draft picks to spare b/c of worthless trades, they actually made the most out of them(i.e. Rocky Mcintosh, Anthony Montgomery, LaRon Landry, Reed Doughty, and URFA Stephon Heyer held his own OK when Janson went down). Both Andre Carter and London Fletcher have paid dividends as UFAs too.

But Wow...how can ANY team be THIS much over the salary cap?? I don't get it. Now, it's to the point where EVERYONE has alot of cash to spare. To clarify, HOW can they be THIS much over??

 

[InmanRoshi]

The typical Commanders restructure shell game will be difficult if they bring in a new coach with new systems. What if the new coach doesn't want these players' contracts extended? What if he doesn't like them? What if they don't fit his scheme? If they were to bring in Cowher (who I don't think is coming), London Fletcher and Andre Carter would be horrible fits in the 3-4 (Carter sucked as a 3-4 OLB in SF). Do you want to extend their contracts and keep bad fits along for several more years just because you need to prorate their bonus? Can you cut them and accelerate their cap hit when you're already in dire straights with the cap? Who are you going to replace them with? And of course, all this is complicated by the fact that the Commanders don't have a GM and a "big name" like Carroll or Cowher might want to bring in his own player-personnel or VP Operations people instead of Snyder's henchmen.


Unless they just want to drop the atom bomb on everything and rebuild from the ground up, they better just keep Gregg Williams and hopefully talk Saunders into staying because they have no roster or cap flexibility when it comes scheme or philosophy changes.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

I'm thinking this will eventually catch up with them.

it has, just look at their roster, completely void of any franchise-type players

 

[Sonny#9]

Burgundy, you are wrong. It has cost you and it will cost you. Even if you do not want to admit it. The age factor, lack of depth, etc.

OK where does this lack of depth come from?

The Skins lost 6 starters, and still made the playoffs. I'd say that's some pretty decent depth. Maybe that's just me.

Really the cap doesn't worry me. Every year it's the same thing -- the Skins cap situation is going to keep them from signing FAs. And result is the same year in and year out, the skins do what they need to do and get who they want. Sometimes good (Class of '05, Fletcher, Smoot) sometimes bad (Lloyd, Archuletta, Duckett).

 

[silverbear]

OK where does this lack of depth come from?

The Skins lost 6 starters, and still made the playoffs. I'd say that's some pretty decent depth. Maybe that's just me.

Really the cap doesn't worry me. Every year it's the same thing -- the Skins cap situation is going to keep them from signing FAs. And result is the same year in and year out, the skins do what they need to do and get who they want. Sometimes good (Class of '05, Fletcher, Smoot) sometimes bad (Lloyd, Archuletta, Duckett).

Sonny, the problem is, doing it this way the Skins haven't become a serious contender, and don't really show signs of becoming a contender in the foreseeable future...

Yeah, you can cut and restructure and go out and sign more players again this year, but as long as you guys keep playing that game, you won't be big winners...

You build through the draft, fill in the holes with free agency... you do that because draft picks are cheaper than free agents, which leaves you more money to build quality depth...

 

[Sonny#9]

it has, just look at their roster, completely void of any franchise-type players

I think that's pretty near-sighted. There's some talent there -- maybe not "franchise" types, yet, however, anyone that wants to downplay the talent of Chris Cooley or LaRon Landry isn't watching.

I am neither sold nor soured on Campbell as of yet. I want to see what happens next year -- hopefully with Saunders taking the handcuffs off.

Another one to watch is Anthony Montgomery -- he was a monster this year. Big part of holding Peterson and Taylor to 41 yards, and Dallas to 1 total yard.

Moss pissed me off this year...but he's got the talent, but *** happened to his hands?!

We'll see what happens this offseason. It should be interesting to watch at least!

 

[AmishGangsta]

The typical Commanders restructure shell game will be difficult if they bring in a new coach with new systems. What if the new coach doesn't want these players' contracts extended?


Unless they just want to drop the atom bomb on everything and rebuild from the ground up, they better just keep Gregg Williams and hopefully talk Saunders into staying because they have no roster or cap flexibility when it comes scheme or philosophy changes.

Good post!

If they were to bring in a new staff right now, they might have to shake things up a bit; atleast cut some of the players that they signed in their first free agent splurge in 2004 (ie Griff, Daniels, Springs -- maybe even Portis)

I'm thinking they'll hire Gregg Williams, though.

It'll be another offseason where the skins have an issue with maybe one player (Springs, Moss or Portis would be my guess,.) cut him -- the message board accountants start raving about how the Skins can't afford to cut him; next thing you know that player's buying out of his contract and the Skins restructure a few contracts here and there to get 10-15 million under the cap.

...and then the saga continues

"how the hell did they do that, how did they sign those players, I thought they were in cap hell". "well they are, if you look at it real closely, they had to cut their 31 year old corner to save 2 mil and now they have no depth"

It's the way they do business, they backload the contracts, resorting in large figures, and then ask the player to restructure somewhere down the road -- or they cut him.

They do infact get burned, however, when trying to match offers like Antonio Pierce's, Smoots offer from Min., and Derrick Dockery's large contract he was offered last year, but then they replace them.

The Cowboys are really good at keeping all of there players intact, but other than them, most teams lose more players every year to free agency than the Commanders -- even when they have the cap space to re-sign them, they're just not willing to spend it.

 

[Sonny#9]

Sonny, the problem is, doing it this way the Skins haven't become a serious contender, and don't really show signs of becoming a contender in the foreseeable future...

Yeah, you can cut and restructure and go out and sign more players again this year, but as long as you guys keep playing that game, you won't be big winners...

You build through the draft, fill in the holes with free agency... you do that because draft picks are cheaper than free agents, which leaves you more money to build quality depth...

Yes, I fully agree with your last statement there, and that is what worries me the most about Gibbs retiring -- Snyder and Wonder Boy Cerrato aren't held in check by anyone. Under Gibbs we did more with fewer picks then many teams around the league. With only 20 draft picks the last 4 years the Commanders brought in:

2004:
Taylor (god how good would that backfield have been with Taylor and Landry back there for the next 10 years?)
Cooley

2005:
Campbell -- jury is still out, but is the starter
Rogers -- he gets a lot of heat, but was playing well before his injury

2006:
McIntosh
Montgomery
Doughtery
Golston

2007:
Landry
HB Blades

All ten of those players have seen significant playing time. Some of them have pro-bowls under their belt or in the near future. And half those players came the 5th, 6th and 7th rounds.

I don't know what's going to happen next, but it should be interesting.

And I am still not worried about the cap -- I'll worry about it when it actually becomes a problem.

 

[03EBZ06]

And I am still not worried about the cap -- I'll worry about it when it actually becomes a problem.

But it is a problem because you have to constantly manipulate players salary, release players, and sign older players who doesn't command much money. Your team can't afford to sign impact FAs.

As long as your team is last in cap list and playing restructuring/cutting/signing older players, I don't see your team having much of chance of winning the SB.

 

[redster]

Salary cap is not a problem for this team. Since Gibbs became our coach, 80% of the players have been guys he hired. If salary cap is such a big problem for us, this would not be the case. Plus, it's not like we don't have any depth. We played against seattle without 1) Jon Jansen 2) Randy Thomas 3)Sean Taylor 4)Carlos Rogers 5) Rocky McIntosh and many other players. When Cowboys rested just 4 players, they just looked atrocious against us. Are you sure have more depth than we do?
Trust me, salary cap is never an issue with the Washington Commanders.

 

[InmanRoshi]

Well, since cap is absolutely not a problem with the Commanders then I'll just assume that if you release Shawn Springs it won't be because of his cap weight it will be because he's the 5th or 6th best CB on your team and you need his roster spot to make room for better players.

Which would be odd, considering he started every game for you.

But we know, it would have absolutely nothing to do with the cap. No. Nothing.

 

[dogunwo]

Well, since cap is absolutely not a problem with the Commanders then I'll just assume that if you release Shawn Springs it won't be because of his cap weight it will be because he's the 5th or 6th best CB on your team and you need his roster spot to make room for better players.

Which would be odd, considering he started every game for you.

But we know, it would have absolutely nothing to do with the cap. No. Nothing.

No response to that from Commanders fans..........I wonder why.

 

[redster]

Well, since cap is absolutely not a problem with the Commanders then I'll just assume that if you release Shawn Springs it won't be because of his cap weight it will be because he's the 5th or 6th best CB on your team and you need his roster spot to make room for better players.

Which would be odd, considering he started every game for you.

But we know, it would have absolutely nothing to do with the cap. No. Nothing.

Shawn Springs will not be released this year. However, Springs has clearly lost a step. He got owned by TO this year, and didn't look too good against Seattle. I would still retain him though. Also, we can easily get 15 million below salary cap this year. Link below:
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=71#s=71&f=1348&t=1802670