Heard a tidbit about Holland on GaC today

[gimmesix]

When? After Week One and his contract is guaranteed? After camp is over and the much-need time for coaching and building cohesiveness is past?

Are you seriously worried about his guaranteed contract? Is that affecting the team being able to bring in other players? No. Does it affect the salary cap next season? No.

Very weak argument.

"From the folks that brought you Jacob Rogers, Stephen Peterman, James Marten and Robert Brewster, now comes Marvelous Montrae Holland and his ever-expanding waistband!"

Sounds great.

You were probably a "Proctologist" too...

Don't understand the comparison of Holland to those others. They were draft picks who didn't pan out. Dallas has seen Holland play and knows he can get the job done when he's healthy. Big difference.

And as far as Proctor goes ... no. I thought he was an OK backup center, but that was about it.

 

[Mr Cowboy]

Broaddus and McMahon debated this issue last week on their football show. Broaddus said that he knew for a fact that Holland would be plugged in there as soon as he came bcak. He didn't necessarily agree with it but that is what would happen. He said that is was not really a progress stopper because these young guys aren't ready to play in the NFL. Especially with no offseason.

McMahon was toatlly against it, but said it was not surprising to him. He said he that the young guys had busted their butts and were progressing well, but that Jerry has never liked sitting the higher paid player, that's why Newman will be starting as soon as he gets back, no matter how well Scandrick is playing.

 

[gimmesix]

Again, where is Montrae Holland?

Nagy is in the process of winning the job while Holland sits out hurt and out of shape. Bring on the Vikings, because Nagy is putting together a strong case for that LG job.

Ask yourself this.

What is the upside to Montrae Holland?

What is the upside to Bill Nagy.

The coaches better ask themselves this question, too. I think they will. The team just went 6-10, and a weak patch like Holland isn't going to cut it up front. JMO

I don't think upside has much to do with who Dallas wants to start. Obviously, if the Cowboys felt Nagy was the better player now, then they wouldn't be proclaiming Holland the starter.

Obviously, they do not feel that Holland is a weak patch, but the right guy to go with for now.

I like the upside of Nagy, and hope he continues to show what he did Sunday. We need some young linemen to come through for this team.

And I certainly don't mind if he changes the Cowboys' minds about who should be starting. I want them to start whomever they believe is the best player.

My personal preference would have been to bring in the Pro Bowler Brian Waters, but my opinion doesn't count, either.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

Seems pretty simple. Even though most of us see Holland as a progress stopper and someone that will prevent us from running the screens and things that require mobile lineman, the team feels he has proven he can be a solid NFL lineman and can handle all facets of the job better than the rookies can. While the rookies are more athletic, neither have the experience handling the complex stunts they will face and neither has shown an ability to anchor against the bull rushes they are going to see every game. Romo has a better chance of getting hurt behind an OL with more rookies on it.

I think Holland starts if he can practice for a couple weeks, but I think we feel a little bit better about putting one of the young guys in if we have to.

 

[gimmesix]

While the rookies are more athletic, neither have the experience handling the complex stunts they will face and neither has shown an ability to anchor against the bull rushes they are going to see every game.

Yes, the defenses in these games are mostly vanilla and things will get more complicated in the regular season. That's one reason some players looks so good during these exhibition games but struggle during the season.

I can't remember who it was that had a quote about you have to get used to college speed, then you have to get used to NFL preseason speed then everything steps up another notch during the regular season.

The vets' main goal in these games is proper execution and not getting hurt. That's a lot easier for a rookie to handle than motivated players and coordinators doing everything they can to beat you.

Doesn't mean we shouldn't be pleased when the players perform well, just that we need to keep it in the proper perspective. (It's actually easier in these games to pick out who isn't going to be successful than who is. Because if they can't succeed on the preseason level, they don't deserve to be here.)

 

[theogt]

I've never understood the constant disdain for Holland that he's received from day 1 here. Literally every single time he's played for us he's done well. Dude just can't stay healthy. No idea if he could keep up that level of play over a longer period of time.

 

[Alexander]

I know what I have seen out of Holland, and it is plain and simple. Fat, unable to stay healthy and inconsistent.

But since the team endorses that, I should accept it? Absolutely not.

He should have to earn every single snap he gets.

I don't care if I am right or wrong about the player. I just think allowing this kind of player to come back in and reclaim his job is completely wrong.

 

[Alexander]

I've never understood the constant disdain for Holland that he's received from day 1 here. Literally every single time he's played for us he's done well. Dude just can't stay healthy. No idea if he could keep up that level of play over a longer period of time.

I am equally puzzled when I saw people begging that he be installed as the starter over Kosier based off a game and a quarter of play several years ago.

Players like Holland are solid lifers who can make careers out of what they do. He is an average player. Not terrible but obviously made worse when he is not even smart enough to be in shape.

Players like Holland are not solutions. They are stopgaps. Someone serviceable who you plug in hoping they can actually make it through the game.

So what should everyone do? Cross their fingers and hope this player decides to play hard and stay healthy while at the same time be happy about it?

 

[theogt]

I am equally puzzled when I saw people begging that he be installed as the starter over Kosier based off a game and a quarter of play several years ago.

That was equally puzzling, I agree. I don't get either extreme.

So what should everyone do? Cross their fingers and hope this player decides to play hard and stay healthy while at the same time be happy about it?

If he ever actually sucked on field, people should call for his head. But since he hasn't actually ever sucked on field, it doesn't make any sense. At all.

If him being on the team meant we can't keep a Nagy, then screw the guy. But if the difference is him or Parnell, it's an easy answer.

 

[gimmesix]

I know what I have seen out of Holland, and it is plain and simple. Fat, unable to stay healthy and inconsistent.

But since the team endorses that, I should accept it? Absolutely not.

He should have to earn every single snap he gets.

I don't care if I am right or wrong about the player. I just think allowing this kind of player to come back in and reclaim his job is completely wrong.

The team didn't sideline him because he's fat, but because he's injured. If he'd been fat and uninjured, he would have been in the starting lineup.

What you believe the team is allowing and what they believe they are allowing are two different things. I don't think the players see it like you do, either.

It isn't like he wasn't doing the work when he reported to training camp. He was running, moving from drill to drill and sweating just like everyone else (probably more).

All they are endorsing is if they believe you are the best player, you will start. I think that's plenty of motivation for the other guys to try to become the best.

 

[gimmesix]

So what should everyone do? Cross their fingers and hope this player decides to play hard and stay healthy while at the same time be happy about it?

No. Being unhappy and griping about it is going to change everything.

Of course, we cross our fingers and hope this player decides to play hard (seen no evidence he won't) and stay healthy. And we cross our fingers that if he can't (which we believe to be likely based on his past) that someone else will be able to step in and do that job. Or we cross our fingers and hope that someone else wins over the coaches.

Any way you go about it, we're crossing our fingers and hoping.

 

[yimyammer]

Broaddus and McMahon debated this issue last week on their football show. Broaddus said that he knew for a fact that Holland would be plugged in there as soon as he came bcak. He didn't necessarily agree with it but that is what would happen. He said that is was not really a progress stopper because these young guys aren't ready to play in the NFL. Especially with no offseason.

McMahon was toatlly against it, but said it was not surprising to him. He said he that the young guys had busted their butts and were progressing well, but that Jerry has never liked sitting the higher paid player, that's why Newman will be starting as soon as he gets back, no matter how well Scandrick is playing.

Man, I hope McMahon is wrong here, this type of thinking makes me want to puke......

 

[gimmesix]

Man, I hope McMahon is wrong here, this type of thinking makes me want to puke......

I really don't think it's Jerry's call. Holland isn't making enough to be forced into the lineup, and I'd be surprised if Garrett would let that happen. Doesn't seem like his MO.

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

I don't know why this bothers people, since every single person is getting what they want. Holland will start on week 1, get injured, then Nagy/Arking can continue to fight it out for the spot. The "Pro-Holland" folks win and "Pro-Youth" folks win.

We should all be happy right now! :

 

[Stash]

No. Being unhappy and griping about it is going to change everything.

Of course, we cross our fingers and hope this player decides to play hard (seen no evidence he won't) and stay healthy. And we cross our fingers that if he can't (which we believe to be likely based on his past) that someone else will be able to step in and do that job. Or we cross our fingers and hope that someone else wins over the coaches.

Any way you go about it, we're crossing our fingers and hoping.

I'm crossing my fingers and hoping that the team has realized that it's foolish to count on the unreliable Montrae Holland and that they sign a veteran lineman.

 

[burmafrd]

I am equally puzzled when I saw people begging that he be installed as the starter over Kosier based off a game and a quarter of play several years ago.

Players like Holland are solid lifers who can make careers out of what they do. He is an average player. Not terrible but obviously made worse when he is not even smart enough to be in shape.

Players like Holland are not solutions. They are stopgaps. Someone serviceable who you plug in hoping they can actually make it through the game.

So what should everyone do? Cross their fingers and hope this player decides to play hard and stay healthy while at the same time be happy about it?

man take a chill pill.

 

[rkstevens]

I wanted Leonard Davis gone last year. Who was 'right' then? Take a look around the league, the guy is so far gone that he can't even find work, what does that say about Dallas' expertise in the area of offensive linemen?

Didn't you want the Cowboys to bring in Brian Waters who can't even get a workout let alone a job? And didn't you want Trai Essex, who finally got signed yesterday by his former team that cut him halfway into pre-season -- and only because they lost a couple linemen in the Eagles game? What does it say about YOUR expertise in the area of offensive linemen when the guys you wanted couldn't find work like Davis? Maybe you know about as much as the Cowboys? I love how people love to point out when the Cowboys are wrong yet and they are right, yet never acknowledge when they are wrong. Why hasn't an NFL team snapped you up yet?

 

[Stash]

Didn't you want the Cowboys to bring in Brian Waters who can't even get a workout let alone a job?

Yep. Still do. If you can show me where he's tried to get a workout and failed, it would be news to me. I think he's either playing in Texas or he's not playing. Maybe he's done?

And didn't you want Trai Essex, who finally got signed yesterday by his former team that cut him halfway into pre-season -- and only because they lost a couple linemen in the Eagles game?

They lost tackles, not guards and even those only temporarily. And the team that Essex played for - the Steelers - wanted him back. That tells me enough about what they thought of him.

What does it say about YOUR expertise in the area of offensive linemen when the guys you wanted couldn't find work like Davis? Maybe you know about as much as the Cowboys?

Tell you what I did know. I knew Davis was awful last year, a full season before the Cowoys did.

I love how people love to point out when the Cowboys are wrong yet and they are right, yet never acknowledge when they are wrong. Why hasn't an NFL team snapped you up yet?

I have no problems admitting when I'm wrong.

I loved the Roy Williams trade when they made it!

Completely wrong-o!

And if I'm wrong about this and Holland somehow miraculously stays healthy and plays well, I'll gladly admit that too. I get the same 'internet cookies' for being wrong as I do for being right.

And if you feel that keeping an unreliable, out-of-shape player makes more sense than looking for alternatives, that's your choice, more power to ya!

By the way, latest word is that Holland will be out 'another couple of weeks'.

 

[Aven8]

Update on Holland per David Moore this morning on the Ticket...Holland will be out another week and will not be playing the Minny game.

This guy is milking the clock!

 

[Stautner]

It shouldn't be a surprise Holland will start. He's the only choice with any NFL experience, and while his time in Dallas has been disappointing, and while he is not the ideal option, the rookies need some time to learn and strengthen their bodies.