How do you feel about this defensive line?

Risen Star said:
Sure we do. We know that Mincey can't play. We know Hayden can't play. We know Selvie's best story to his grandchildren is the year where he had 7 sacks. We know who these players are. They have a resume. It's completely irrelevant if we've seen them all play together.

When the fans start chanting we don't know, you know things are really bad.
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Your probably right.
 
The defensive line certainly appears to be a somewhat incomplete package at this point to say the least. There are a couple of promising candidates but no doubt, we'll be beating the bushes, mostly at DE, to find someone reasonably capable. Outside of Melton and McClain, there are some young candidates like Crawford, Bass, Coleman, Gardner, Bishop and even Wilson who might fare well in a rotation. Some stalwarts with impact, especially at DE, would surely be a welcome sight, though.
 
Bluestang said:
To play devils advocate here, Seattle DL did not have one pro bowler. They predicated their DL on waves.

I don't believe Dallas has that proven talent yet, but the philosophy is there.
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They also had Cliff Avril, Chris Clemons, Michael Bennett, and Bruce Irvin rushing the passer.
 
CyberB0b said:
They also had Cliff Avril, Chris Clemons, Michael Bennett, and Bruce Irvin rushing the passer.
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Those guys were all question marks going into the season. Those names are not pro bowlers or all-pros.
 
CyberB0b said:
Question marks? They had over 100+ career sacks between them.
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They also had 20 yrs of experience there too. None of those guys were pro bowlers.

Chris Clemons was a huge disappointment until Carroll adj his scheme to let him play more of 34 OLB technique rushing the passer.

Bennett had a career high 9 sacks before going to Seattle, and TB didn't want to keep him around after his pedestrian 3 years before.

Avril was the only guy that had been consistent but it took about 3 years to get to that level.

Like I said I'm not here to say that Dallas is going to be the best ever, but Seattle didn't have one pro bowler on the roster on the DL yet they used the approach that Marinelli wants to use.
 
Bluestang said:
They also had 20 yrs of experience there too. None of those guys were pro bowlers.

Chris Clemons was a huge disappointment until Carroll adj his scheme to let him play more of 34 OLB technique rushing the passer.

Bennett had a career high 9 sacks before going to Seattle, and TB didn't want to keep him around after his pedestrian 3 years before.

Avril was the only guy that had been consistent but it took about 3 years to get to that level.

Like I said I'm not here to say that Dallas is going to be the best ever, but Seattle didn't have one pro bowler on the roster on the DL yet they used the approach that Marinelli wants to use.
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They have 20 years of proven experience, combined. Chris Clemons started had over 33 sacks in the 3 years prior to last season.

I haven't looked, but I would guess our entire defensive line doesn't have 75 sacks combined. Our most proven passrusher is Anthony Spencer, who looks like his career might be over. You want to talk about question marks? Look at our defensive line.

Mincey - Career journeyman. Didn't even start last year.
Hayden/McClain - Both career journeyman. McClain hasn't started a game since late 2011 and Hayden has 29 starts in 5 seasons in the NFL.
Melton - Looked bad in 2013 before blowing out his knee. His best season produced 7 sacks.
Selvie - Came off the couch and played well last year, but again, a proven journeyman. Never started a game before coming here and never had more than 2 sacks in a season. An injured DeMarcus Ware nearly matched his production, while playing 3 less games.

Then we have the guys like Crawford (never done a thing in the NFL), Lawrence (never done a thing in the NFL, and injured), Spencer (could barely walk as of 6 months ago), and a glut of undrafted rookies and camp bodies.

You want to talk about question marks? You are rich.
 
CyberB0b said:
They have 20 years of proven experience, combined. Chris Clemons started had over 33 sacks in the 3 years prior to last season.

I haven't looked, but I would guess our entire defensive line doesn't have 75 sacks combined. Our most proven passrusher is Anthony Spencer, who looks like his career might be over. You want to talk about question marks? Look at our defensive line.

Mincey - Career journeyman. Didn't even start last year.
Hayden/McClain - Both career journeyman. McClain hasn't started a game since late 2011 and Hayden has 29 starts in 5 seasons in the NFL.
Melton - Looked bad in 2013 before blowing out his knee. His best season produced 7 sacks.
Selvie - Came off the couch and played well last year, but again, a proven journeyman. Never started a game before coming here and never had more than 2 sacks in a season. An injured DeMarcus Ware nearly matched his production, while playing 3 less games.

Then we have the guys like Crawford (never done a thing in the NFL), Lawrence (never done a thing in the NFL, and injured), Spencer (could barely walk as of 6 months ago), and a glut of undrafted rookies and camp bodies.

You want to talk about question marks? You are rich.
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You may want to read my earlier posts. It appears to me that you didn't read my earlier stance and just took one post out of context.

No one is saying we are going to amount to this or that.

The philosophy is to come at the opposing offense in numbers, just like Seattle did. We don't have any proven guys, I know that. It's painfully obvious to anyone, but the philosophy is there and the offense can really help the defense by putting points on the board and making the other team one dimensional.
 
Bluestang said:
The philosophy is to come at the opposing offense in numbers, just like Seattle did. We don't have any proven guys, I know that. It's painfully obvious to anyone, but the philosophy is there and the offense can really help the defense by putting points on the board and making the other team one dimensional.
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My contention is that this approach only works when you have talented players. Every team in the league rotates their defensive line players and they have been doing it for decades.
 
CyberB0b said:
My contention is that this approach only works when you have talented players.
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I think you've discovered the "secret sauce", quick go tell Stephen Jones what the formula is.


Every team in the league rotates their defensive line players and they have been doing it for decades.
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I think you could make a good case that Dallas didn't do that near enough with their 34 front or this new 4-3 front. We also never did a good job with drafting DL to replace Ware, Spencer, Hatcher, or Ratliff. Again more poor drafting philosophies from the FO.
 
Parcells4Life said:
Upgrades from last years DL:

Crawford, Melton, Lawrence (will still play 10-12 games) and probably Selvie being 2nd year in system.

Mincey, McClain and Bass can all potentially be an improvement if they get up to speed and stay healthy
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I would bet that if we enjoyed a similar DL rebuild that we've seen along the OL the last few years that no more than 3 of those players are still with the team in 2016.

Its a very pedestrian group. About as bad as I can ever remember.
 
CyberB0b said:
My contention is that this approach only works when you have talented players. Every team in the league rotates their defensive line players and they have been doing it for decades.
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Fans start talking about waves when the starters aren't any good.

Wait wait..... Are you telling me we're going to get a fresher Nick Hayden? Well Go Cowboys!
 
Bluestang said:
I think you've discovered the "secret sauce", quick go tell Stephen Jones what the formula is.




I think you could make a good case that Dallas didn't do that near enough with their 34 front or this new 4-3 front. We also never did a good job with drafting DL to replace Ware, Spencer, Hatcher, or Ratliff. Again more poor drafting philosophies from the FO.
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Had to give you a like for the secret sauce reference.
 
I'm hopeful that Crawford can be a player, Lawrence comes back and at least flashes the ability to be our weakside end and the Cowboys can find at least one productive player from Gardner, Bishop or Coleman. If only in a rotation.

And, of course, Melton returns to form and sticks around.

Then it's off to the offseason. Where we need to add some talent before I care to hear about this wave aspect.

It's a multi-year fix, gentlemen.
 
I think we can have a good starting D line with what we have now. But the depth would be perhaps one step up from JAGS.
 
CyberB0b said:
Hayden/McClain - Both career journeyman. McClain hasn't started a game since late 2011 and Hayden has 29 starts in 5 seasons in the NFL.
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You forgot the part about Belicheat cutting McClain in a week.
 
I've not seen any meaningful games yet, I have no clue.
 
Risen Star said:
Because there's this thing called past performance. Bad players grouped together play badly.

That DL could possibly be the worst I've ever seen here.
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Yep. It's a bad defensive line.

For grins I thought, "Well the 1989 team probably has as shatty a defensive line".

I got *****-slapped for my effort:

RDE Jim Jeffcoat (started 16 games and had 11.5 sacks)
RDT Willie Broughton (started 14 games and had 3 sacks)
LDT Dean Hamel (started 13 games and had 3.5 sacks)
LDE Ed "Too Tall" Jones (started 10 games and had 1 sack)

Not a great starting defensive line but on paper better than the 4 guys the OP put up.
 
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