Is Matt Jones available?

[Stash]

If Austin gets the same PT as Jones has got in his 3yrs, yeah he'll be more producitve

and the Crayton/Jones thing is laughable..if we put Crayton on the market today there'd be alot of teams make decent offers for him...nobody would want Jones and IMO, he's probably getting released at some point before the seasons starts

David

Yeah, they'll be 'lining up' for Patrick Crayton....

Maybe he can run his mouth and not show up for their teams too?

I think you're as guilty as anyone else for 'seeing what you want to see' here.

 

[dbair1967]

Compare the talent Crayton has taking away opposing defenses' attention.

That's not debatable either.

Crayton has had excellent coaching every year, Jones has not.

Jones has also not gotten much of an opportunity in Jacksonville - especially last year. He was firmly in Del Rio's ddoghouse.

The one game he did get the opportunity to play, he had 8catches for 138 and a TD.

why is he always in the doghouse? Because he stinks and doesnt work hard

and the one game you cite was the final game of last season, where Jax didnt make much of an effort to win (game meant nothing to them) and they were playing against a Houston team that basically had no CB's

David

 

[dbair1967]

Yeah, they'll be 'lining up' for Patrick Crayton....

Maybe he can run his mouth and not show up for their teams too?

I think you're as guilty as anyone else for 'seeing what you want to see' here.

so why'd they (Cowboys) sign Crayton to a 4yr contract extension for significant money then back in December then?

David

 

[Stash]

why is he always in the doghouse? Because he stinks and doesnt work hard

and the one game you cite was the final game of last season, where Jax didnt make much of an effort to win (game meant nothing to them) and they were playing against a Houston team that basically had no CB's

David

Maybe he's in the doghouse because he's getting bad coaching?

What other receivers have succeeded in Jacksonville recently?

I can't think of any.

And maybe Crayton's numbers came from the fact that he was the last option that opposing defenses worried about?

See, these things work both ways.

Can you name me a quality position coach that Matt Jones has had in Jacksonville since being drafted and converting from quarterback to wider receiver?

Seems you're quick to disregard any other factors and squarely place all responsibilty and blame on Matt Jones.

 

[Stash]

so why'd they (Cowboys) sign Crayton to a 4yr contract extension for significant money then back in December then?

Given the fact that they had TO and ..................... nothing at the position, I think they absolutely needed to re-sign Crayton.

And as soon as they did, they probably regretted it.

I did.

And I'm pretty confident that I'm not alone in my thinking.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

do you see us trading for other teams garbage to replace him? No you dont

compare what Crayton did last to anything Jones has done, the story isnt evebn debatable. Crayton is clearly improving every yr in the league, Jones has not. He has been so poor that the jags are trying everything they can to replace him...he's hurt alot too, but even in games where he's healthy he sometimes hardly plays or makes no impact whatsoever

the guys a huge bust, period.

David

I guess I would ask you why signing Jones means replacing Crayton, in your mind?

The fact of the matter is that had Crayton played in as few games as Jones played in last year, his numbers would not have improved. If your saying that Jones is too often injured, then OK, I can understand that point. However, to lean on the fact that Crayton has improved every year as a criteria for why he is better is illogical. Prior to last years injury season for Jones, he too had improved every year and at a faster rate then Crayton.

You must present more info to convince me of the fact that Crayton is so much better then Jones. At this point, I am not convinced that this is the case David.

 

[ArkCowboy]

Given the fact that they had TO and ..................... nothing at the position, I think they absolutely needed to re-sign Crayton.

And as soon as they did, they probably regretted it.

I did.

And I'm pretty confident that I'm not alone in my thinking.

you are not alone
crayton had his chance to shine last season
he had a couple of decent games
but IMO played no where close to what was expected of him
especially in big games

 

[dbair1967]

you are not alone
crayton had his chance to shine last season
he had a couple of decent games
but IMO played no where close to what was expected of him
especially in big games

huh? he wasnt ever expected to be the starter, he ended up there because of Glenn's knee...yet he out produced alot of others teams #2 WR's...and we werent like Detroit or somethign, throwing 40 times a week either...we also had two other guys who had HUGE production...

David

 

[dbair1967]

I guess I would ask you why signing Jones means replacing Crayton, in your mind?

The fact of the matter is that had Crayton played in as few games as Jones played in last year, his numbers would not have improved. If your saying that Jones is too often injured, then OK, I can understand that point. However, to lean on the fact that Crayton has improved every year as a criteria for why he is better is illogical. Prior to last years injury season for Jones, he too had improved every year and at a faster rate then Crayton.

You must present more info to convince me of the fact that Crayton is so much better then Jones. At this point, I am not convinced that this is the case David.

Jones played in 12 games and caught less than half as many passes as Crayton...are you somehow suggesting that those 26 more receptions Crayton got were because of playing in only 4 more games?

The fact is Crayton has improved every yr in the league, and Jones has got worse and worse as a player, to the point that they dont really want him.

David

 

[dbair1967]

You must present more info to convince me of the fact that Crayton is so much better then Jones. At this point, I am not convinced that this is the case David.

I've presented a ton of info on this ABQ, its just that you want to ignore it...if you cant see the obvious progressive improvement Crayton has made since being a 7th rd pick and stuck on the PS for 1.2 his rookie yr until today, I dont know what I can do for you. The last two seasosn Crayton has 86 catches for 1213 yds and 11 tds, and he was the 3rd guy one season and the #2 guy the next...Jones was a 1st rd pick, he was expected to devleop into at LEAST a capable #2 guy, yet they cant wait to replace him. Crayton was a 7th rd pick and has developed into a capable starter but at the least is an excellent #3 guy. Jones supposedly has "great" speed, yet Crayton has more long yardage plays than Jones does and Jones has never had a play over 49 yds. Crayton has more tds...Crayton has a betetr yds per catch and more receptions

It's really a pretty cut and dry case, and I bet if you polled 32 NFL teams abotu which guy they'd rather have, it'd be a 32-0 landslide on who they'd want.

David

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Jones played in 12 games and caught less than half as many passes as Crayton...are you somehow suggesting that those 26 more receptions Crayton got were because of playing in only 4 more games?

The fact is Crayton has improved every yr in the league, and Jones has got worse and worse as a player, to the point that they dont really want him.

David

David,

Don't insult my intelligence. Jones played in 12 games, Crayton started 13 as the #2 WR in our offense. He played in 15 all together. Of course I am saying that the additional 26 catches are directly attributable to, not only the amount of games Crayton played, but the amount of snaps Crayton saw as opposed to Jones, as the #2 WR option. I mean, there is no dispute there. If you are saying that this is not the case, then I challenge you to produce any evidence to the contrary. Would be interesting to see how you twist this one.

The fact is that whatever the reason, you have not produced any quantifiable evidence that supports your position for a statistical point of view. There is an easy way to figure this out. Look at actual minutes played. That will tell you who was on the field more and who had opportunities to catch more balls.

 

[Stash]

huh? he wasnt ever expected to be the starter, he ended up there because of Glenn's knee...yet he out produced alot of others teams #2 WR's...and we werent like Detroit or somethign, throwing 40 times a week either...we also had two other guys who had HUGE production...

David

Yeah, two Pro Bowl guys who pulled all of the coverage away from Crayton.

Keep 'cherry-picking' the information that suits you and ignore everything else.

 

[Stash]

Jones played in 12 games and caught less than half as many passes as Crayton...are you somehow suggesting that those 26 more receptions Crayton got were because of playing in only 4 more games?

The fact is Crayton has improved every yr in the league, and Jones has got worse and worse as a player, to the point that they dont really want him.

Crayton was the default starter - the Cowboys had no choice. Matt Jones was in the coaches' doghouse and got few opportunities last year.

Plenty of teams have players they no longer want.

Doesn't make them bad players, just bad fits for their situation.

 

[Stash]

I've presented a ton of info on this ABQ, its just that you want to ignore it...

Pot meet kettle]

if you cant see the obvious progressive improvement Crayton has made since being a 7th rd pick and stuck on the PS for 1.2 his rookie yr until today, I dont know what I can do for you. The last two seasosn Crayton has 86 catches for 1213 yds and 11 tds, and he was the 3rd guy one season and the #2 guy the next...Jones was a 1st rd pick, he was expected to devleop into at LEAST a capable #2 guy, yet they cant wait to replace him. Crayton was a 7th rd pick and has developed into a capable starter but at the least is an excellent #3 guy. Jones supposedly has "great" speed, yet Crayton has more long yardage plays than Jones does and Jones has never had a play over 49 yds. Crayton has more tds...Crayton has a betetr yds per catch and more receptions

Please continue to ignore all other factors which fail to support your side of the argument. Maybe that will make them go away?

It's really a pretty cut and dry case, and I bet if you polled 32 NFL teams abotu which guy they'd rather have, it'd be a 32-0 landslide on who they'd want.

Not even close.

Keep ignoring any facts which don't support your case though.

And I haven't seen anyone who says "sign Jones, cut Crayton" anyway.

More to the point that some are interested in acquiring a receiver to improve this team. If a 'talent' like Miles Austin needs to go, so be it. The team has plenty of kick returners now anyway.

 

[InmanRoshi]

Doesn't make them bad players, just bad fits for their situation.

I'm just curious why Jacksonville is a "bad fit" for Jones.

Too much competition among Ernest Wilford and Reggie Williams? Gosh, who could get playing time with a roster that stacked?

Anyway, I think this is futile as I don't think he's for sale. The addition of Jerry Porter is negated by the loss of Wilford in free agency, and they didn't draft anyone. There were some rumblings that Del Rio wanted to ship him out when he was at his peak of laziness, but evidently he's picked it up a tad ... at least enough to keep a roster spot.

 

[gbrittain]

I'm just curious why Jacksonville is a "bad fit" for Jones.

Too much competition among Ernest Wilford and Reggie Williams? Gosh, who could get playing time with a roster that stacked?

Anyway, I think this is futile as I don't think he's for sale. The addition of Jerry Porter is negated by the loss of Wilford in free agency, and they didn't draft anyone. There were some rumblings that Del Rio wanted to ship him out when he was at his peak of laziness, but evidently he's picked it up a tad ... at least enough to keep a roster spot.

I don't know much about Matt Jones, so I am not going to shed tears one way or another.

However, I think it is a factual statement that some players are nobodies until they go to another team.

As I mentioned earlier...Jay Novacek.

I sure would not go out on a limb and say anything definitive about how good Matt Jones will be, but I think given our WR situation it is hard for me to say I have no interest.

 

[Stash]

I'm just curious why Jacksonville is a "bad fit" for Jones.

Too much competition among Ernest Wilford and Reggie Williams? Gosh, who could get playing time with a roster that stacked?

I would say it's a bad fit because he may be getting mediocre to bad coaching.

A player making the transition he is needs a lot of coaching. Maybe he didn't get it in Jacksonville?

Anyway, I think this is futile as I don't think he's for sale. The addition of Jerry Porter is negated by the loss of Wilford in free agency, and they didn't draft anyone. There were some rumblings that Del Rio wanted to ship him out when he was at his peak of laziness, but evidently he's picked it up a tad ... at least enough to keep a roster spot.

Maybe. But there were stories that he was still 'on the outs'. And keep in mind that Mike Tice convinced the team to trade for Troy Williamson.

Personally, I would investigate it.

I would rather do that than have anything to do with Chad Johnson.

 

[dbair1967]

. Look at actual minutes played. That will tell you who was on the field more and who had opportunities to catch more balls.

well if you have any suggestions on how we'd find that kind of info, please do tell

however, as others have noted the Jags hardly had much talent at WR, again an example of if the guy was any good, he'd be on the field...

also, the Jags only attempted 62 fewer passes than the Cowboys (less than 4 attempts a game) so its not like there was some massive disparity in passing plays...

I honestly cant believe people keep making a huge thing out of a guy thats a total stiff and CLEARLY has been a bust...its another example of people just smidden over a big name...the guy's played like a late rd pick or an undrafted free agent, and he likely will be released before the season starts

David

 

[dbair1967]

I would rather do that than have anything to do with Chad Johnson.

OMG you cant be serious

31 other defensive coordinators would have absolute nightmares about an Owens, Johnson, Witten & Crayton grouping...31 other teams would laugh their arses off about Matt Jones being picked over Chad Johnson...I dont care what kind of drama & theatrics come with the guy, Johnson is EONS a better player than Matt Jones will ever be

David

 

[Stash]

OMG you cant be serious

31 other defensive coordinators would have absolute nightmares about an Owens, Johnson, Witten & Crayton grouping...31 other teams would laugh their arses off about Matt Jones being picked over Chad Johnson...I dont care what kind of drama & theatrics come with the guy, Johnson is EONS a better player than Matt Jones will ever be

David

I'm absolutely serious.

Johnson is much better than Matt Jones, he's also a lunatic.

This whole game with Cincinnati is about one thing - money.

Johnson wants to get paid a ton of it.

And whatever team he hopes to get traded to will have to deal with that when they get him, along with whatever draft picks they would have to give up.

You don't care about his drama and theatrics, but I do.

As well as the huge chunk of change you'd have to give the nut.