Jerry Jones Sure Makes a Good Scapegoat

[Hostile]

You have the right to be wrong too.

We all do. God bless America.

 

[Bach]

that's where his ego really gets him into trouble

everyone knows who he is, he has 3 Super Bowl rings

why he wants everyone to constantly know that the Cowboys are his brain-child is beyond me

I mentioned the other day that I can't understand why he can't be satisfied with being known as the owner of the world champions. Like you said, everyone knows who he is. But that isn't good enough for him. He craves to be known as the one who put it all together. But wanting to win by hiring the likes of Wade and Campo and Gailey and then undermining them on top of it just kills any real chance he has to win. Not to mention the circus atmosphere he constantly perpetrates and fosters. He just totally cuts his own feet out from underneath himself, when he could have a much better chance at it if he hired a good GM, a quality HC and sit back, open his wallet and watch the show.

 

[Bach]

We all do. God bless America.

God bless America, indeed.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

I mentioned the other day that I can't understand why he can't be satisfied with being known as the owner of the world champions. Like you said, everyone knows who he is. But that isn't good enough for him. He craves to be known as the one who put it all together. But wanting to win by hiring the likes of Wade and Campo and Gailey and then undermining on top of it just kills any real chance he has to win. He just totally cuts his own feet out from underneath himself, when he could have a much better chance at it if he hired a good GM, a quality HC and sit back, open his wallet and watch the show.

shoot, if I were in his position, I would be getting good and drunk every-game in the suite, just being a fan

 

[Hostile]

I brought that up because you of all people should know that arguments like these will take place

arguing that argument is futile is a pretty thin argument

Oh I get it, so me denying the belief that all I am doing is playing devil's advocate was putting on my Admin hat and saying the discussion that I was partaking in needs to end?

Honestly, that isn't even worth the powder to blow it to hell.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Actually, I'm not. I just have the audacity to disagree with the masses calling for something that has no chance of happening.

You know, Einstein defined insanity as doing the same thing over and over and over again, and expecting the results to change.

I think we all realize jerry the owner will never fire jerry the gm.

That does not mean that since he won't you still would not hire another GM if we could.

Your logic so far in this thread has been really flawed. You go from well if we do it then what is to stop us from failing and doing it again and again. Your logic dictates that the same would hold true of coaches so therefore we should have never gotten rid of campo.

Now the difference I see in some people is they are all die hard it is jerry and only jerry's fault for all the ills of the team. An argument could be made for or against that stance. Jerry does not play on the field, jerry is not the coach for a group of players or all the players. However at the end of the day he is held, or should be held, responsible for the players he does bring in and the coaches he does bring in. Kind of hard to deny that. At the same time he also should get credit for the ones that do turn out.

So I am not all anti-jerry, but at the same time There is a problem and I honestly do not think another team would hire him as their GM nor do I think if he was a GM of another team and someone else was the owner of the Cowboys would we, as fans, ever want him to be the GM.

 

[Hostile]

but that's just it! he only looks at talent. nevermind Tank did Prison time for being a thug. nevermind Pacman is punching strippers and his own bodygaurds. nevermind Owens has ruined 2 teams and is working on his 3rd. which just so happens to be the team both of us love and root for. Jerry is more involved in everything you say a GM should do and you know it. he makes every decision from players to coaches. wonder what you will say if and probably we don't win a playoff game game next year too. "oh he's handled the cap well though" pfftt

So basically what you are saying is that you like the merry-go-round.

Wasted my time.

 

[bbgun]

Funny, so am I, and you're going to label me for it..

Have labeled you in any way, though you implied that I should be dragged away to the funny farm.

Bach's going to toss out a strawman. I'm not going to fall for it. I know the game. It isn't my first rodeo.

Is that your lame "word of the day" or something? I think a big bad wolf needs to blow that down.

 

[Bach]

shoot, if I were in his position, I would be getting good and drunk every-game in the suite, just being a fan

Tell me about it. I'd hire a good GM, personally interview the cheerleader candidates, sit back at training camp drinking little drinks with umbrellas in them and then on gamedays sitting up in the suites or hanging out down on the sidelines next to the cheerleaders enjoying the show.

 

[Bach]

, though you implied that I should be dragged away to the funny farm.
own.

Yeah well, haven't we all at one time or another? :

 

[Royal Laegotti]

God bless America, indeed.

Dude I love that sig. Wait no I don't! What I mean is it's !!!!

And but true all at once!

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Oh I get it, so me denying the belief that all I am doing is playing devil's advocate was putting on my Admin hat and saying the discussion that I was partaking in needs to end?

Honestly, that isn't even worth the powder to blow it to hell.

this isnt' about your admin hat, please understand that

just you've been around here a long time, being an admin only underscores that fact, and which is why I pointed it out, arguments like these happen, opposing someone's viewpoint just because it's not going to happen is weak, you pointing out it's futility is even weaker

 

[Hostile]

I disagree completely, and earlier in the thread outlined just some of the mistakes I think he has made just in the two years since Bill left.

Would you please point out for me the perfect GM in the NFL. The guy who has made no mistakes. I want to go kiss that man's feet.

I think this team is an internal and external mess, and I believe Jerry's penchant for flash over substance, talent over character, and over-riding need for a coaching staff which neither threatens his authority or chance to take all the credit are a major reason why. Even Aikman called him out for his lack in the belief for team leadership and chemistry - that he thinks if he just finds the most talent people and throws them on the field they will win.

And I think this is an over-simplified gut reaction to what he does contribute.

Is he Matt Millen South? No, if only because he can acquire talent. But there's too much other baggage he brings to create a successful championship team. Even if we got hot next year and somehow went to the Superbowl, there is no doubt in my mind the team as presently constructed and with Jerry's need for the spotlight could crash and burn the whole thing the next year. There won't be a Patriots like dynasty under Jerry ever, this organization is just too unstable.

I don't fault Jerry for liking the spotlight. I wouldn't want a tainted "dynasty" any way.

You say he's learned, that he's not the problem, etc. I don't believe that one bit. He created this mess. He put the lame duck and inexperienced and ineffective coaches in place, he signed the hired thugs that created an absolute embarrassing end of the season and has players sniping at each other in the press because there is nothing resembling accountability anywhere in that clubhouse. And he's the guy that believes we will suck it all down again next year, because where else are we going to go?

All of his coaches are inexperienced? Really? You want to stick with that story or research the truth on your own?

He's a salesman with a Fantasy Football roster, nothing more, and his track record of over 13 years proves it.

I don't agree.

If he's not the problem, who is? The coaches? He hired them. The players? He drafted, traded for and signed them. The media? He has tons of them in his pocket too.

See, that's the thing, I'm just naive enough to think there isn't one single problem. Hence my audacity to think differently about this subject.

Or is it just easier to say we're too whiny because then you don't have to change anything?

Of course it is easier, but I'm not advocating that by any wild stretch of the imagination.

I haven't said we don't need to change things. Not once, not ever. Isn't even part of the conversation here Wilee.

 

[Rampage]

So basically what you are saying is that you like the merry-go-round.

Wasted my time.

not at all. you're wasting your own time defending our clown owner and "Gm"

 

[SultanOfSix]

Well, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting different results.

Denigrating Jerry over and over again, especially on a fan forum, isn't going to make him leave. It's only going to annoy other posters who reside on this forum. Your solution to the problem is to remove someone you no power to remove. In absence of this, you ***** and complain constantly without providing any other solutions.

JJ the GM HAS gotten better. Anyone who isn't biased will see this. What we can do is hope that he continues to get better, and this results in a championship, because that is what positive people do. They don't wish that he fails so they can brandish their egos that they were right.

 

[TNCowboy]

Tell me about it. I'd hire a good GM, personally interview the cheerleader candidates, sit back at training camp drinking little drinks with umbrellas in them and then on gamedays sitting up in the suites or hanging out down on the sidelines next to the cheerleaders enjoying the show.

I'd be tempted to do the same thing he's doing. I can think of few things more interesting than managing the personnel of an NFL team. I have zero interest in coaching, but being a GM, I'd love to do that.

Jerry's ego demands he get the credit Jimmy got 15 years ago, and the fans continued financial support of the team has allowed him to get away with it all these years. Now that he has a new stadium, why not continue his little excercise in futility?

I'd hoped the team getting booed off the field after the Baltimore embarrassment might cause him to reconsider, and had a feint hope after Sunday, one of the worst losses in team history. It appears to have only entrenched him. It's basically a big middle finger to the fans, which is what some season ticket holders who called into ESPN radio said this morning.

If God could show Jerry a future with him as GM - sort of a football version of A Christmas Carol - that involved winning no Super Bowls, and a version that showed him hiring a legitimate GM and winning 5 in the next 10 years, I have little doubt he'd keep himself as GM.

 

[bbgun]

You mean the same way Art Rooney did? The same way any owner would?.

You yourself said that GMs have little to do with Super Bowl titles, so why would an ancillary, insignificant figure like Jerry wear a ring? Or maybe "Jerry the owner" gets to wear it. I bet there's a cute little explanation/double standard right around the corner ...

He was part of the team

And there it is. Please don't combine Jerry jocksniffing with utter predictability. You're better than that.

Oh crap! Another strawman disintegrates

Oh crap! Hos is playing to type. Again.

 

[Doomsay]

And none of them have a snowballs chance in hell of happening. Its either Stephen or Jerry. Really if people cannot handle that then I am sure the Dolphins or Texans fanbase will accept them.

Seems that you've stepped back from your checklist (now debunked) and are taking refuge in the Jerry won't leave so you should routine.

Last year's playoff loss was so embarrassing and they were so unprepared and pampered going into it that I thought surely they would get some of the issues resolved prior to the start of the season - so I had some hope, the draft looked pretty good as well, then came the pre-season and the soap operatic hard knocks and I knew nothing had changed. Lots of penalties, bad special teams, non-NFL caliber back-up QB play, softness compared to other teams that we scrimmaged with etc.

Can't get fooled again. There is no hope for an undisciplined team - smarter football minds than mine would agree. I have yet to hear a single source (ex Cowboy - insider, ex Coach, player analysts) suggest that this team just is a player or 2 away from success - it's all about chemistry and leadership none of which you get with a yes man coach who was drummed out of Denver for losing control of his team and fired in Buffalo for refusing to dismiss an underperforming special teams coach.

This is the guy that Jerry wants to keep on for continuity sake? There will of course be continuous elements, like downward spiraling performance, JJ undermining Wade with the players, TO imploding, and lots of coverage of Jerry on TV.

 

[Hostile]

I think we all realize jerry the owner will never fire jerry the gm.

That does not mean that since he won't you still would not hire another GM if we could.

Your logic so far in this thread has been really flawed. You go from well if we do it then what is to stop us from failing and doing it again and again. Your logic dictates that the same would hold true of coaches so therefore we should have never gotten rid of campo.

Oh here we go. The logic is flawed in a discussion about hypothetical changes. Really? Isn't that EXACTLY my point?

Now the difference I see in some people is they are all die hard it is jerry and only jerry's fault for all the ills of the team. An argument could be made for or against that stance. Jerry does not play on the field, jerry is not the coach for a group of players or all the players. However at the end of the day he is held, or should be held, responsible for the players he does bring in and the coaches he does bring in. Kind of hard to deny that. At the same time he also should get credit for the ones that do turn out.

I actually think both sides are doing that. Bach and I don't agree on Jerry Jones, but I have heard him say the 2008 Draft class is all he could hope for and more.

So I am not all anti-jerry, but at the same time There is a problem and I honestly do not think another team would hire him as their GM nor do I think if he was a GM of another team and someone else was the owner of the Cowboys would we, as fans, ever want him to be the GM.

And I do think he could.

Honestly BP I get it. I just don't agree. You asked me. I said my answer would not placate you. It didn't. I know my beliefs on this subject will not be popular here in Salem. But they are mine and I'm not spin controlling anything or playing devil's advocate. I was asked an honest question and I supplied an honest answer. Either you can be cool with that or you can't. I'll get over it if you can't. I'll get over it if these other guys can't. They are free to lose respect for me if they so wish. It will not be a two way street.

It never has been.

 

[Bach]

I'd hoped the team getting booed off the field after the Baltimore embarrassment might cause him to reconsider, and had a feint hope after Sunday, one of the worst losses in team history. It appears to have only entrenched him. It's basically a big middle finger to the fans, which is what some season ticket holders who called into ESPN radio said this morning.

That's basically what it seems like. Even hearing about his interview with Norm this morning, he sounded like he's dug in a basically telling the fans to kiss his butt. And you know what? Some on here have even taken him up on it.