JJT Say Garrett Controls the Draft

[Dodger12]

Oh and Dodger12, I didn't defend JJT at all, you'll find I didn't even mention him, but nice try at a strawman.

You didn't reference and defend JJT's position/article (as the last piece of evidence) when you stated the below comment? OK. Lurk mode........engage.

I never intended to post here again, but I took so much crap over this topic that having the last piece of evidence I said would come out has brought me out of lurk mode for this one response.

 

[Dodger12]

It's hilarious, isn't it?

Always is Zordon. It makes for entertaining reading.

 

[Idgit]

This is priceless. JJT is the resident football fool around here, or so many of you have said every time the guy writes something people don't agree with. Now we take this article as some kind of gospel and vindication...

It's hilarious, isn't it?

Seriously, guys? First of all, Calvin Watkins is the resident football idiot around here. JJT is just a disciple.

Second of all, just because you think someone's a hack, it doesn't follow that every thing that person types is always garbage. It's sufficient that most of it is.

Third of all, even though he's saying what most of us already understood, he's still not doing a decent job of saying it well. Stuff like this:

Last season, Claiborne started 16 games and was on the field for 909 snaps. Third-round pick Tyron Crawford played 303 snaps.
The rest of the draft picks? They combined for just 123 plays.
Ridiculous.

When the players in question were 1, rolled up in the pick for Claiborne, in Wilbur's case, sustained two injuries and saw limited reps thereafter, and then in Johnson's, Coale's, and McSurdy's case missed most of their entire seasons to injuries. The only other draft pick who could conceivably play was James Hanna, who contributed and played well. There's nothing ridiculous about it.

Or this:

Garrett has shown a reluctance to play rookies -- aside from first-round picks -- and give them meaty roles.

Which isn't fair, given that he doesn't have much of a track record yet as HC. That his first full offseason was truncated by the CBA neotiations, and because this last year, he played all of his rookies who were healthy, including Beasley as a college FA. And Leary, who they were trying to get ready to compete in camp for a possible starting role.

Sorry, guys. JJT's still mostly clueless. He still draws completely unsubstantiated conclusions from his poorly constructed arguments ("All that matters is when the draft ends, the Cowboys have at least three players capable of being significant contributors in 2013. If not, then Garrett faces an uphill battle to survive past this season.") What?

Just because he's tapped into what many posters have been saying here forever in this case, he's not suddenly leading the band around here. And the fact that posters say 'no, duh?' to an article that points out the obvious shouldn't be seen as either priceless or hilarious. It should be seen as expected.

Only it's not, by some, because it also happens to be something remotely positive relating to the influence of our head coach on our draft.

 

[Doomsay]

You didn't reference and defend JJT's position/article (as the last piece of evidence) when you stated the below comment? OK. Lurk mode........engage.

I think that the Jimmy Johnson football life episode was difficult for those that endorsed the "every coach had the same degree of power under Jerry" theory. It damaged the inside knowledge credo to some degree, and was always an absurd premise.

I agree with Idgit though, some of JJT's PFF snap analysis was interesting - hopefully we focus on some players that are ready to contribute right out of the box this season, or at least give them a chance to do so.

 

[perrykemp]

You know this to be true of all the best GM's?

Heck, there are NFL GMs who still heavily personally scout college players. Ted Thompson, the Packers GM, spends a lot of time during the year personally visiting college campuses, buying donuts for college coaching staffs, picking their brains, etc. In fact he still considers himself a scout (of sorts). This Q&A with Ted excerpt with Thompson was referenced is a thread earlier this year re: how Jerry differs from GMs like Ted Thompson.

Q. There are a number of days during the season where the media sees you coming back with your suitcase from a scouting trip. Can you take people through what your week is like once you start going to college campuses in the fall?

(Thompson Answer) Well normally, I'm here with the team through Monday and kind of put the previous game to bed. Usually by Tuesday, I'm traveling. If you get out of town early enough on Tuesday, visit schools on Tuesday. But for sure, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. And then work my way back home or meet the team if we're playing on the road.

Q. So on a normal Wednesday or Thursday, is it mostly watching film and watching practices at these colleges?

(Thompson Answer) A normal day for a scout on the road in the fall is you get to the football offices, depending on what time they open up; some staffs don't like you to get there too early. But let's say it's one of those that it's kind of open, you're usually there by 6:30 or 7 (a.m.). If you're a really good scout, you bring the staff that you're visiting some doughnuts so they have something to eat on. Then you watch tape until usually 2, 2:30, 3 (p.m.), then those players come into those meeting rooms and you have to leave. Then you go meet with the strength staffs and sometimes medical staffs and some other coaches on the staff to get background and things like that. Usually practice is about 4 o'clock in the afternoon and you stay there until as long as you can. Sometimes they ask you to leave before practice is over with. Then you go check into your hotel and you start writing reports. Then you get up the next day and you do it again.​

Could you see Jerry Jones getting up at 6am to be at a po-dunk college locker room buying the unpaid assistance coaches donuts in exchange to their insights on players as well as access to the colleges's tapes of players?

 

[Doomsday101]

So now we are expected to believe that wade was making the picks and "building the team"

And the hilarity continues

Welcome back Hos

Wade's input is big in Houston where they rely on him in the draft. Believe it or not Wade knows a hell of a lot about Pro Football he has spent his life doing it. He is not some message board guru he actually has a fricken clue about the game and what it takes. You guys are funny you run down people who know a lot more about the game than you ever will.

 

[TwoDeep3]

Wade's input is big in Houston where they rely on him in the draft. Believe it or not Wade knows a hell of a lot about Pro Football he has spent his life doing it. He is not some message board guru he actually has a fricken clue about the game and what it takes. You guys are funny you run down people who know a lot more about the game than you ever will.

I am always amused at your take on what someone else says.

Not one person suggests Wade is clueless....unless it is a season where the team is failing and every fan blamed Wade. Then they all wanted him fired.

A couple of 8-8's later sort of validate Wade wasn't Joe Shmoe. But that is beside the point.

The hue and cry here for the years Wade was head coach was he was a puppet of Jerry's.

Now an article comes out by a journalists that is vilified here weekly as a know nothing - pick any journalist actually because they all question the team and when you do that you have no clue - and now because of this argument over who does what, JJT is Sainted as an inside guy.

Even the crickets come out of the wood work because of this validation.

And yet...

There have been former coaches, scouts, and such that have all stated emphatically that Jerry pulls the string on decision when the team is at cross purposes on whom to choose.

Jerry has said this repeatedly.

But suddenly a journalist that is despised by the great unwashed here makes a noise that suggests the redheaded golden boy is the guy with the big sacks on draft day and the usual suspects come running with their Nanny Nanny Poo Poo.

I'm not stupid.

I have read your comments, and the ones of the crickets who flap in the wind like a flag depending on the temperament of the latest JJT article.

And unless he is cheer leading in his prose, he is an idiot to you guys.

Except now...

Because to the myopia set, the position of a fan, a journalist, or a mediot is in direct relationship with how much he knows.

And if you want an example, then look at Mike Fisher. He was despised on this site a few years ago when he had radio programs in Dallas. Every fan here talked down about him because he was admittedly Jerry's "backpocket boy."

That is what he called himself on the radio.

And this board lit him up like long haired music lovers fired up joints at Woodstock.

Now that he is just about the only voice which praises this team consistently, he suddenly has become a home town hero for those very same people who hated him before.

So blowing in the wind for some here and crickets visiting is the stock in trade as long as the dream can stay alive.

And still Jerry Jones states he runs the team and makes the decisions.

I guess JJT and some of you didn't get that memo.

 

[Doomsday101]

I am always amused at your take on what someone else says.

Not one person suggests Wade is clueless....unless it is a season where the team is failing and every fan blamed Wade. Then they all wanted him fired.

A couple of 8-8's later sort of validate Wade wasn't Joe Shmoe. But that is beside the point.

The hue and cry here for the years Wade was head coach was he was a puppet of Jerry's.

Now an article comes out by a journalists that is vilified here weekly as a know nothing - pick any journalist actually because they all question the team and when you do that you have no clue - and now because of this argument over who does what, JJT is Sainted as an inside guy.

Even the crickets come out of the wood work because of this validation.

And yet...

There have been former coaches, scouts, and such that have all stated emphatically that Jerry pulls the string on decision when the team is at cross purposes on whom to choose.

Jerry has said this repeatedly.

But suddenly a journalist that is despised by the great unwashed here makes a noise that suggests the redheaded golden boy is the guy with the big sacks on draft day and the usual suspects come running with their Nanny Nanny Poo Poo.

I'm not stupid.

I have read your comments, and the ones of the crickets who flap in the wind like a flag depending on the temperament of the latest JJT article.

And unless he is cheer leading in his prose, he is an idiot to you guys.

Except now...

Because to the myopia set, the position of a fan, a journalist, or a mediot is in direct relationship with how much he knows.

And if you want an example, then look at Mike Fisher. He was despised on this site a few years ago when he had radio programs in Dallas. Every fan here talked down about him because he was admittedly Jerry's "backpocket boy."

That is what he called himself on the radio.

And this board lit him up like long haired music lovers fired up joints at Woodstock.

Now that he is just about the only voice which praises this team consistently, he suddenly has become a home town hero for those very same people who hated him before.

So blowing in the wind for some here and crickets visiting is the stock in trade as long as the dream can stay alive.

And still Jerry Jones states he runs the team and makes the decisions.

I guess JJT and some of you didn't get that memo.

Because you call him a puppet or others feel like that please you don't have a clue. Wade input on defensive players like Lee were important some players who were brought in were players Wade had connections to. As for him losing the team the year he was fired it can happen and has happened to other coaches as well. As for Jerry he gets a lot of imput from those around him and yes the final call is his he does not pass the buck he takes the heat and yet no credit? Only bad picks are Jerry right? and all picks that pan out you guys claim oh that was someone else pick. Reality is many are involved but like anything when a final call is made it is the GM like him or not who will make that call but none is don't without a lot of work by others.

 

[WPBCowboysFan]

I am always amused at your take on what someone else says.

Not one person suggests Wade is clueless....unless it is a season where the team is failing and every fan blamed Wade. Then they all wanted him fired.

A couple of 8-8's later sort of validate Wade wasn't Joe Shmoe. But that is beside the point.

The hue and cry here for the years Wade was head coach was he was a puppet of Jerry's.

Now an article comes out by a journalists that is vilified here weekly as a know nothing - pick any journalist actually because they all question the team and when you do that you have no clue - and now because of this argument over who does what, JJT is Sainted as an inside guy.

Even the crickets come out of the wood work because of this validation.

And yet...

There have been former coaches, scouts, and such that have all stated emphatically that Jerry pulls the string on decision when the team is at cross purposes on whom to choose.

Jerry has said this repeatedly.

But suddenly a journalist that is despised by the great unwashed here makes a noise that suggests the redheaded golden boy is the guy with the big sacks on draft day and the usual suspects come running with their Nanny Nanny Poo Poo.

I'm not stupid.

I have read your comments, and the ones of the crickets who flap in the wind like a flag depending on the temperament of the latest JJT article.

And unless he is cheer leading in his prose, he is an idiot to you guys.

Except now...

Because to the myopia set, the position of a fan, a journalist, or a mediot is in direct relationship with how much he knows.

And if you want an example, then look at Mike Fisher. He was despised on this site a few years ago when he had radio programs in Dallas. Every fan here talked down about him because he was admittedly Jerry's "backpocket boy."

That is what he called himself on the radio.

And this board lit him up like long haired music lovers fired up joints at Woodstock.

Now that he is just about the only voice which praises this team consistently, he suddenly has become a home town hero for those very same people who hated him before.

So blowing in the wind for some here and crickets visiting is the stock in trade as long as the dream can stay alive.

And still Jerry Jones states he runs the team and makes the decisions.

I guess JJT and some of you didn't get that memo.

 

[Aurican]

Not sure why some think it's all Jerry or all the HC when it's likely both. Sure a stronger HC will limit what Jerry does but I don't believe Jerry leaves a draft without making one or two picks himself .

 

[justbob]

I am NOT amused at the posts become personal. Stay on thread without the jabs or step off!

 

[zrinkill]

So for years I hear that the coach is supposed to pick the players and that JJ is meddling and thinks he knows the talent and picks who he wants.

Constant griping ensues.

Now, when it becomes evident that Garrett is taking charge of the draft and that Jerry lets him and the scouts make the draft decisions, then I hear that Jerry is the GM and is supposed to be making the picks because that is what the GM does.

And constant griping ensues.

Wow.

 

[Oh_Canada]

It's simple- bad pick= Jerry's doing. Good pick= coach's input.

 

[TwoDeep3]

Because you call him a puppet or others feel like that please you don't have a clue. Wade input on defensive players like Lee were important some players who were brought in were players Wade had connections to. As for him losing the team the year he was fired it can happen and has happened to other coaches as well. As for Jerry he gets a lot of imput from those around him and yes the final call is his he does not pass the buck he takes the heat and yet no credit? Only bad picks are Jerry right? and all picks that pan out you guys claim oh that was someone else pick. Reality is many are involved but like anything when a final call is made it is the GM like him or not who will make that call but none is don't without a lot of work by others.

My personal feelings about Wade were simple. I did not think he had ever shown anything as a head coach to warrant him coming here.

Once he was hired it was the situation as usual. The team deals with it until either the guy produces or Jones fires him.

I would suggest the wunderkind hasn't shown enough to suggest firing Wade was worthwhile.

As far as Jerry, I'd suggest there are a few good moves he's made. But he has a tendency to overpay, because he is a fan foremost. And he shops with his heart.

The GM is not the friend of the players. He is the man who personally makes evaluations and pays accordingly. I don't see Jones as standing back and keeping the players at arms length. I also do not see him making sound decisions at times when his passion overrides common sense.

He paid Austin for a season he had and since the guy is so much less than what he was during his "breakout" year.

I'm scared to death this contract with Romo is going to be a shackle on this team. Especially if they cannot or will not fix the line and protect the guy. I believe in Romo, but his health is not a sure thing if he keeps getting beaten on constantly.

So guaranteeing a ton of money to ignore the OL is Jerry seeing the scrambling ability of Romo and thinking that will always be there.

Romo breaks just like other QB's do, and if they do not protect him the odds grow exponentially that he has a season ending injury, and even a career ending injury.

Then the team is screwed.

The footprint of the company Jones runs is built like no other I have ever seen except maybe Playboy magazine. Because Hef is nailing the women in the pictures.

Jerry has created a hierarchy that allows players to walk around the head coach and go directly to him.

And I don't care what anyone on this board or in the press says, that never works. There has to be a chain of command.

I do not make excuses for Jerry and the seventeen years of his also-rans signal no excuse is necessary.

Did he draft Ware, Lee, Carter, Mo, Smith, and sign Carr and Romo and others?

You bet. Good job.

I can also post the special teams draft where they had 12 picks and came away with magic beans.

Now who ignores those lousy picks that far outweighs the good ones?

People who make excuses for Jerry.

 

[xwalker]

Wade's input is big in Houston where they rely on him in the draft. Believe it or not Wade knows a hell of a lot about Pro Football he has spent his life doing it. He is not some message board guru he actually has a fricken clue about the game and what it takes. You guys are funny you run down people who know a lot more about the game than you ever will.

You seem to be saying that all professional NFL people are always correct an should not be questioned.

Mike Lynn (the guy that traded for Herschel Walker) was an NFL professional and not a message board poster or media guy.

The guys that drafted Tony Mandarich were NFL professionals.

 

[perrykemp]

The guys that drafted Tony Mandarich were NFL professionals.

It show what an inexact science the whole draft is.

Tony Mandarich, I believe, had the highest rating for a college prospect ever going into the 1989 draft. Higher than Aikman, higher than Barry Sanders, higher than Deion Sanders, higher than Derick Thomas, etc etc etc

He ended up INSTANTLY the biggest bust in NFL history -- more than Ryan Leaf IMHO.

I still recall when he told the press before the draft how he didn't want to play for a "village" (ie Green Bay) and how he there was almost a fight between Mandarich and Mike Tyson that was floated.

 

[Doomsday101]

You seem to be saying that all professional NFL people are always correct an should not be questioned.

Mike Lynn (the guy that traded for Herschel Walker) was an NFL professional and not a message board poster or media guy.

The guys that drafted Tony Mandarich were NFL professionals.

Not saying that at all but they do have a lot more insight than some message board want to be.

Wade has struggled as a HC however Wade does understand defense and even in Houston they rely on his views and judgement when it comes to the draft and FA pickups. Does not mean he will be right every time but given the years of experiance at his craft for someone to claim he was nothing but a puppet and had no part in the draft while in Dallas is pathetic from a person who has no clue as to what takes place in Dallas or any other team

 

[khiladi]

Wade was a nice guy, and he's a good defensive coach, but we killed our roster not adding any players during those years between Parcells and Garrett. Jerry gets blamed for it (and he's the owner/GM, he does deserve some blame), but I think the bigger damage was done by having a HC who didn't have a strong philosophy or program in place for finding the talent he needed to run his own system.

Sean Lee, the 'captain' of the defense and Anthony Spencer. He wasn't drafting the offensive players like Felix Jones. Wade wanted Chris Johnson, as is well acknowledged. Wade didn't touch the offense at all, which is why Houck was brought in as opposed to Solari as OL coach. Roy Williams was brought in to 'boost' the offense after input from Jason Garrett. Wade was the man that put Ratliff at NT and Ratliff wasn't drafted for it. Jerry extended Ratliff 3 games after Wade was gushing about him.

Dan Reeves has acknowledged Wade as one of the best personnel guys and talent evaluators he's been around.

The idea that Wade doesn't know good football players is border-line ridiculous. Wade's failure can be attributed to a cluster f of things happening at Valley Ranch, but it wasn't Wade that wanted scrubs like Jacques Reeves.

 

[CanadianCowboysFan]

It's simple- bad pick= Jerry's doing. Good pick= coach's input.

Bingo

 

[Idgit]

Sean Lee, the 'captain' of the defense and Anthony Spencer. He wasn't drafting the offensive players like Felix Jones. Wade wanted Chris Johnson, as is well acknowledged. Wade didn't touch the offense at all, which is why Houck was brought in as opposed to Solari as OL coach. Roy Williams was brought in to 'boost' the offense after input from Jason Garrett. Wade was the man that put Ratliff at NT and Ratliff wasn't drafted for it. Jerry extended Ratliff 3 games after Wade was gushing about him.

Dan Reeves has acknowledged Wade as one of the best personnel guys and talent evaluators he's been around.

The idea that Wade doesn't know good football players is border-line ridiculous. Wade's failure can be attributed to a cluster f of things happening at Valley Ranch, but it wasn't Wade that wanted scrubs like Jacques Reeves.

The drafts from 2007 to 2010 suggest otherwise, to me. They were better under Parcells, and have looked better again under Garrett. But, whatever the cause, there were some incredible stinkers during the Wade regime years.

It might not all be drafting, too. It could be player development.

And I acknowledge that were still early in the JG years to determine how much better we've gotten. We need to see continued improvement from the 2011 picks, and last years injured players are a complete mystery as of now.