Let's all just get it off our chest; Carp was a bad draftpick

[thewivil]

I'm not calling him a bust so calm down.
And don't give me this transition stuff.

Don't we have a few guys dressing and even starting from our 2nd round draftpick on?

Our 1st rounder looks like he may not even dress for some games early on.
And I didn't see ANYTHING from him in the preseason.

Let's face it, it seems like a bad pick.

Yeah, he sucks so bad. Hell, our team sucks so bad, too. Why should we even play this season?

 

[Qwickdraw]

Not really. By then he'll figure everyone has forgotten and proclaim he called it from the beginning.

LD = learning disability

 

[Hiero]

LD = learning disability

way to try and make everyone forget about what a pitiful thread this is.

 

[Qwickdraw]

way to try and make everyone forget about what a pitiful thread this is.

way to try to rally the anti-Qwickdraw posse to no avail.

 

[HighTechDave]

carpenter is adjusting to the middle.

leave him alone, gawd. the great tuna knows best

 

[jobberone]

Most of you guys think this is some kind of new argument. Well it isn't. At least it isn't new in regards a first round pick with high expectations coming in and the fans getting the illusion that we didn't pick well. The guy is going to be a bust.

Well I don't know but if some of you older guys would have picked up on my earlier post about a player who failed at least some peoples early expectations yet went on to be a great Cowboy this conversation would be over IMO.

There may be a lesson in there.

I really need to shorten up my sentences though.

 

[Qwickdraw]

My thread title is obviuosly far too direct and specific. (or vague depending how you look at it)

I meant "looking like a bad 1st round draft pick".

But it was also intended to initiate a discussion and be a little smartarse/humorous (so I didn't think it needed to be clarified) as opposed to "sky is falling-and I knew it would".

So for the 10th and final time...

I NEVER DID CALL HIM NOR DO I THINK HE IS A BUST.

Just looking a little less like a first round draft pick in terms of what, IMO, should be expected from a player of that cost.

I also never said I didn't like the pick and/or didn't want him to begin with.
Fact of the matter is, I liked the pick and thought the way many here did (do) about his potential.
Never once said I had a better choice for the first round or that I would have taken someone else.
I still think he can become a good player eventually.
All I'm saying is, so will alot of other LBs drafted far later in the draft and I hope for more immediate and impactful contribution out of my 1st rounders.
This thread was a statement of concern similar to the ones that have been started in the past (and have been warranted) about Jacob Rogers, Stephen Peterman, Kevin Burnett, Marcus Spears, etc.
But God be with the man who questions the all-mighty Carp.

And if you say that you didn't expect to be all-a-buzz about Carp after the preseason closed as a result of something he did, you're lying.
If I told you in April he was going to play extensively in all the preseason games and not record a Tackle, FF, INT, Pass Defensed or Sack AND that he might not even dress for the first game, you would have **** a brick and called me an idiot and defended your boy and attacked me personally and ridiculed my statement and so on and so on.

Why?

Because you expect more out of a 1st rounder too... you're just too proud to admit it now.
Hence, "saying what everyone else is thinking"... aside from the bunch of people here who don't think because nothing is ever wrong with their precious football team. Kinda like the losers over at ES.

 

[lostinomiya]

i agree with you qwickdraw. while it is too early to judge carpenter (although we do do it with lots of rookies at training camp who are then cut or kept) it is at least disappointing that he hasnt made more of an impact. i know, give him time but i too remember all the talk about how he is the best compliment to ware and, although he is not as flashy as manny lawson etc., he should be able to step in right away.

well, he has become a project and given all the talk that preceeded his selection about what a solid (if unspectacular) pick he would be i do not think your post is "idiotic" at all (as some have said).

we are, at least, entitled to be a little bit disappointed that he hasnt made much discernable impact yet.

 

[Cowboy Bill Watts]

durn...

14 pages on an issue that won't be resolved for at least 2 seasons...

 

[thewivil]

way to try to rally the anti-Qwickdraw posse to no avail.

Dude, I think you're just creating these stupid threads to stir crap up. Do you really feel the need to take Nors' spot?

 

[k19]

Dude, I think you're just creating these stupid threads to stir crap up. Do you really feel the need to take Nors' spot?

 

[jay cee]

You're wrong on a couple of counts. First, most people thought Carpenter wouldn't start from the beginning of the season way back at the time of the draft. The most commen scenario I heard was that Singleton would start the season and Carpenter might take over part way through. The original post didn't suggest "just a few questions" about Carpenter, it clearly stated he was a bad pick. I don't know if most people were angry, but I for one didn't like being told what we all were thinking, he didn't ask my opinion. Then the shell game started, the poster constantly changing his position. Sort of like you did, chaning "he's a bad pick" to "just asking a few questions". I guess that's how you get a lot of posts on a thread. For the most part people who disagree just made solid points with facts, if you can't refute them it doesn't mean they're angry with you.

You don't remember the number of people saying that Carpenter was the best choice, because he could play right away? Well I do. Plenty of posters said that very thing.

I never said he was a bad pick, but yes, I do wonder if he will have to play on the inside like James to be a legit NFL player.

 

[DallasDW00ds0n]

i agree Carp has not shown any flashes im a little dissapointed

 

[flashback]

Ever heard the saying "assumption is the mother of all mess ups"?

I'm 37 years old. As God is my witness, I've never heard that saying.

 

[mschmidt64]

All I'm saying is, so will alot of other LBs drafted far later in the draft and I hope for more immediate and impactful contribution out of my 1st rounders.

Aside from the OL, what player could we have drafted that would be starting? I can't think of any position where a rookie who was on the board could have cracked the starting lineup or been worthwhile value.

LB was a big need at the time. We didn't know if Burnett was gonna develop, we didn't know if Ellis could/WOULD make the switch, and we didn't know that Ayodele was gonna be sharp in the middle.

We had three big question marks, and to cover those question marks, we signed Boiman and we drafted Carp.

If even ONE of those questions hadn't turned out positive, Carpenter would still be on the outside and he'd be seeing time, if not starting by midseason.

But we hit home runs on every move we made at LB over the offseason. So he was moved, temporarily, probably, to a position where we could use the depth more now that OLB has panned out just fine.

I have no problems with the pick at all. Not knowing how our LBs would develop, OLB was probably our biggest need at the time of the draft, aside from the OL, and I don't think there was anyone there worth taking in the first round, at least not that the coaching staff liked. And if McQ can start by the end of the year, I won't be able to complain about that either.

We're a good team now. Our rookies aren't gonna be cracking our lineup, first round picks or otherwise. Not at QB, not at WR, not at RB, not at TE, not at DL, not at LB, not at CB. Any other illusion you were under was incorrect.

You could have made the argument for OL and FS, but that's it. And I didn't see many worthy candidates at those two spots. Maybe Winston Justice, but a LOT of teams passed over him.

Frankly, we should be ecstatic if we can land Bobby Carpenter type talents now that we are drafting at the bottom of the round every year. Those are the types of guys you need to keep hitting on - guys that will be able to replenish the reserves when the starters leave in free agency.

 

[iceberg]

We had three big question marks, and to cover those question marks, we signed Boiman and we drafted Carp.

If even ONE of those questions hadn't turned out positive, Carpenter would still be on the outside and he'd be seeing time, if not starting by midseason.

But we hit home runs on every move we made at LB over the offseason. So he was moved, temporarily, probably, to a position where we could use the depth more now that OLB has panned out just fine.

ummm...we cut boiman, so i'd not say we're 100% here. i'd also not say that LB was an area of "need". *IF* it were an area of need, then we didn't draft BPA, but based off need. If we're doing that, I'd say OL was a bigger "need" than LB.

however, BP loves LB's and DE's, so he drafts those at every opportunity it seems. i do agree the OL was a bigger ? and yea, maybe there was no "sure fire" answer in the draft.

but *when* are there "sure fire" answers? there are not, so i just didn't get our 1st 2 picks in carp and fasano. esp when people get all glee/happy about drafting BPA and not for need when you say we needed an LB and we obviously needed a TE to run the 2 TE set.

but the entire argument at this point is just stupid. let the kid play a few games and let's see what he can do. this quickdraw crap of "no i didn't say he was a bust!!!" when he's been screaming it out is simply an attention ***** on overtime.

 

[mschmidt64]

ummm...we cut boiman, so i'd not say we're 100% here.

Right, he was signed as insurance. When everything else came up roses, he wasn't needed.

We were literally so good at the position that we couldn't fit another OLB on the roster.

i'd also not say that LB was an area of "need". *IF* it were an area of need, then we didn't draft BPA, but based off need. If we're doing that, I'd say OL was a bigger "need" than LB.

Well, ok.

Say OL was a bigger area of need, but at least we're not talking about a position like DL where you can't foresee the guy cracking the starting lineup anytime soon. We DID have a need to find another LB, whether from within (Ellis) or outside the team (Boiman, Carp).

Carpenter will be starting, probably next year, either at OLB or ILB. If he wasn't the BPA, he was very close to it.

I can't see a better fit between need and value with any other selection we could have made.

I'm just glad we got a quality player who is gonna start when we need him to. For too many years we were drafting Shante Carvers and Kavika Pittmans, and we were never able to re-stock the shelves as free agency was depleting us.

Getting a guy like Carp... now that is how a team like Pittsburgh stays near the top. Good drafting at the bottom of the round.

Who cares if he can't step right in? He's GONNA be good. All I care about is whether he is gonna be quality in the end, instead of a bust.

OL is the only position where we were really hurting anyway, so I can't buy this "We could have found a player that would have made more of an impact than Carp."

Yeah? Like who?

 

[iceberg]

Getting a guy like Carp... now that is how a team like Pittsburgh stays near the top. Good drafting at the bottom of the round.

Who cares if he can't step right in? He's GONNA be good. All I care about is whether he is gonna be quality in the end, instead of a bust.

OL is the only position where we were really hurting anyway, so I can't buy this "We could have found a player that would have made more of an impact than Carp."

Yeah? Like who?

sorry, i don't play "this game". every time i do people get into arguments over who's who and who sucks and who doesn't. if no OL was there, trade down and pick one up a bit later. i'll stick with justice being just a good a choice later in the 1st as any OL, but i'm not gonna get into a wizzing match of words with anyone on "preference".

i'm on carps side to give him time, but i don't feel LB was a "need" position, just another BP lovefest in action.

 

[Stautner]

It's pretty ridiculous for anyone to suggest Carpenter was a wasted draft pick at this point.

I can accept a little disappointment that he didn't become an immediate starter like many thought, but how in the heck can anyone say he is a wasted draft pick less than 2 months into his career and before his first regular season has even started?

Contrary to what some have said, he did show flashes. One game he ran down a receiver from behind, and he typically seems to be around the ball. Granted, that doesn't mean he will be a success, but only time will tell.

As of September 7, 2006 time hasn't had it's chance.

 

[wileedog]

i'm on carps side to give him time, but i don't feel LB was a "need" position, just another BP lovefest in action.

LB was absolutely a need position. We ended the season last year with Fujia, Shanle and Flowler all geting significant playing time. When you have that many JAGs running around at LBer in a 3-4 you are asking to get beat, and our run defense suffered very badly down the stretch.

Now obviously OL was a need too, but I think Carpenter graded out higher than Justice or any other OL on the Cowboy's board, so they pulled the trigger on a good player in a spot that needed to be filled. That's what you are supposed to do.

What if they trade down to get Justice and someone elses reaches for him with the next pick and then Carp goes?

Now you don't have the LBer you wanted, or the Olineman you wanted, and everyone on this board rips Bill and Jerry a new one for getting too cute.