Adult Language Lions WR Amon-Ra St. Brown and Cowboys CB Jourdan Lewis trading barbs; Cowboys host Lions Week 6

[GimmeTheBall!]

https://syndication.bleacherreport....is-exchange-barbs-amid-apparent-beef.amp.html

ooowwwwww
Harsh words.
How old are they?

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Last time our D talked smack to a Lions receiver he went for 300yards against us.... good times.

Did they talk smack to Megatrom? Thought he just did what he always did lol.

 

[JW82]

Did they talk smack to Megatrom? Thought he just did what he always did lol.

Our DC Bob the flop Ryan went on TV and said Calvin would be WR3 in Dallas behind Dez and Austin... i told a friend watch Megatron go for 290.

 

[gimmesix]

The only reason it worked is because the defense was told the wrong player.

That last fact is something that tends to be lost on people defending Detroit.

That is the biggest issue no matter who was to blame. The number that was announced is the number the defense knew to cover. We can talk about not being at an eligible position, etc., but protocol is for the number to be called so the defense knows who is eligible, and the wrong number was called. Whether the ref announced the wrong number by his mistake or Detroit's mistake is really immaterial. The wrong number was still announced.

 

[gimmesix]

Can I ask exactly how you feel our roster regressed? It honestly didn't change that much. Oft-injured Tyron Smith left and our painfully average center left. We lost Pollard who was far from anything special. Gallup left who barely made any impact most games. Probably our biggest loss was Hankins on the defensive side. LVE retired who, despite what people say, was solid. We'll get Diggs back and Overshown back. We replaced most of our losses in the draft. Hopefully our RBBC will be serviceable.

It didn't necessarily regress, but it's possibly that it has because we just don't know much about the replacements. We can't just assume that those draft replacements are going to be as good or better. Draft picks fail every year.

 

[Reality]

That is the biggest issue no matter who was to blame. The number that was announced is the number the defense knew to cover. We can talk about not being at an eligible position, etc., but protocol is for the number to be called so the defense knows who is eligible, and the wrong number was called. Whether the ref announced the wrong number by his mistake or Detroit's mistake is really immaterial. The wrong number was still announced.

Exactly! It really does not matter whose fault it was because the only thing that mattered was the defense was told to guard the wrong player by the referees and that is why the play worked.

 

[Chasing6]

Exactly! It really does not matter whose fault it was because the only thing that mattered was the defense was told to guard the wrong player by the referees and that is why the play worked.

That is one aspect.

Sending 3 different tackles to the Official, 2 giving hand signals and a partridge and a pair tree.

The fact they had a meeting before the game tells you it was all premeditated plan to deceive.

 

[Reality]

That is it exactly. Catch the Cowboys defense napping in a pivotal moment of a big game. No assumption of it working, but just try it and see. You think our reputation of shrinking in big moments is only held by this fanbase? And as I failed to recall from the other poster, the Lions met with the refs prior to the game about this. If it were banned, I'm sure they'd have been told so. The Lions were mad because the refs flipped the script in the actual game. As the other poster has been avoiding, why would the ref avoid a question about what was said to him by the other players prior to 70 running out there and not even reaching the ref before being declared eligible? Forget about whether it would have worked on the field or not. That's not my point here. My point is the refs appeared to not follow their own stated rules and then had a ref avoid a question about it in the post-game presser. But folks are saying the refs got it right but also don't want to discuss the particulars. You have to know that to me in particular, that is hilarious that refs are both crooked and clean depending on who benefits.

I think most people realize that the referees announced the wrong player number, likely by assuming which player was the eligible one and not paying attention to what they were told.

Regardless though, the play only worked because the defense was told the wrong number to guard.

So it was definitely the referee's mistake, but Detroit is not without some of the blame because in their attempt to confuse the defense they actually confused the referees.

I said it at the time Detroit fans, players and coaches have every right to be upset over the call, but everyone seemed to (and still seem to) ignore the fact that if the correct number had been announced, the Cowboys would have guarded that player.

It sounds like Detroit did everything right by informing the referees before the game of their plan and it would have been interesting to see how it played out had the referee not told the defense to guard the wrong player.

As it is though, the play worked because the Cowboys were told to guard the wrong player.

 

[Reality]

That is one aspect.

Sending 3 different tackles to the Official, 2 giving hand signals and a partridge and a pair tree.

The fact they had a meeting before the game tells you it was all premeditated plan to deceive.

I don't blame Detroit for attempting to trick the defense, especially the sloppy defense the Cowboys had last season.

As I posted above, it sounds like Detroit tried to do it the right way by telling the referees about it before the game, but games are hectic and in their attempt to confuse the defense, they confused the referees.

The NFL rules on substitutions and eligibility are rigid and have been a focal point in recent years by the NFL to maintain fairness to both the offense and defense.

The referees go out of their way to inform both sides of the in-between-play changes either through announcements or holding up snaps, so the odds of "tricking" the other team are really no better than relying on blown assignments by the defense that could happen on any play, even those without any trickery.

 

[Chasing6]

I don't blame Detroit for attempting to trick the defense, especially the sloppy defense the Cowboys had last season.

As I posted above, it sounds like Detroit tried to do it the right way by telling the referees about it before the game, but games are hectic and in their attempt to confuse the defense, they confused the referees.

The NFL rules on substitutions and eligibility are rigid and have been a focal point in recent years by the NFL to maintain fairness to both the offense and defense.

The referees go out of their way to inform both sides of the in-between-play changes either through announcements or holding up snaps, so the odds of "tricking" the other team are really no better than relying on blown assignments by the defense that could happen on any play, even those without any trickery.

How can you trick the defense when the Official has to announce it to the defense and over the loud speaker???

Dan Cambell is a dumb coach.

It was not a trick play. It was a deceitful play. It was an attempt at cheating. It was an attempt to make the Ref's feel like they made a mistake and they hoped they would go along with it.

68 reported. Then 70 reported. 70 was announced. 70 then intentionally lines up ineligible. Their scam was why would he line up that way if we wanted 70 to be eligible?

Official - I don't know why your coach is dumb and had 3 different players in my face.

 

[Cowboys5217]

Our DC Bob the flop Ryan went on TV and said Calvin would be WR3 in Dallas behind Dez and Austin... i told a friend watch Megatron go for 290.

I thought he was going to go for 400 yards at one point during that game. One of the most humiliating, even worse than the Randy Moss games.

 

[Reality]

How can you trick the defense when the Official has to announce it to the defense and over the loud speaker???

Dan Cambell is a dumb coach.

It was not a trick play. It was a deceitful play. It was an attempt at cheating. It was an attempt to make the Ref's feel like they made a mistake and they hoped they would go along with it.

68 reported. Then 70 reported. 70 was announced. 70 then intentionally lines up ineligible. Their scam was why would he line up that way if we wanted 70 to be eligible?

Official - I don't know why your coach is dumb and had 3 different players in my face.

The "trick" was to send the same player out there several times during the game to report as eligible and they were hoping when the referee announced the correct number of the eligible player the defense would be distracted and would assume it was the same player as before.

As I have said many times, both today and back when it happened, in their attempt to confuse the defense they confused the referees so Detroit is not without blame.

It is very likely that when Detroit sent multiple players over to the referee that it played a key role in the confusion of the referee.

I think Detroit put too much weight into the before-the-game conversation thinking they could be sloppy with the in-game notification process because they assumed the referees would act on the pre-game-provided information.

I doubt referees think like that during games though because they are so focused on the plays as they happen and likely view the pre-game discussions as nothing more than pre-game rule clarifications.

 

[Cowboys5217]

The "trick" was to send the same player out there several times during the game to report as eligible and they were hoping when the referee announced the correct number of the eligible player the defense would be distracted and would assume it was the same player as before.

As I have said many times, both today and back when it happened, in their attempt to confuse the defense they confused the referees so Detroit is not without blame.

It is very likely that when Detroit sent multiple players over to the referee that it played a key role in the confusion of the referee.

I think Detroit put too much weight into the before-the-game conversation thinking they could be sloppy with the notification process because they assumed the referees would act on the pre-game-provided information.

I doubt referees think like that during games though because they are so focused on the plays as they happen and likely view the pre-game discussions as nothing more than pre-game rule clarifications.

Yeah, at the time when it happened my first thought was that the trickery had backfired and only confused the refs.

Here's what a lot of people mad about the call won't admit or deal with: It would have been a much bigger travesty for the refs to have helped trick the Cowboys and let it stand.

 

[Chasing6]

The "trick" was to send the same player out there several times during the game to report as eligible and they were hoping when the referee announced the correct number of the eligible player the defense would be distracted and would assume it was the same player as before.

As I have said many times, both today and back when it happened, in their attempt to confuse the defense they confused the referees so Detroit is not without blame.

It is very likely that when Detroit sent multiple players over to the referee that it played a key role in the confusion of the referee.

I think Detroit put too much weight into the before-the-game conversation thinking they could be sloppy with the in-game notification process because they assumed the referees would act on the pre-game-provided information.

I doubt referees think like that during games though because they are so focused on the plays as they happen and likely view the pre-game discussions as nothing more than pre-game rule clarifications.

70 ran out there and reported multiple times correctly by himself with zero problems. Why the change to 3 different tackles approaching the referee? The rule clearly states 1 player, the reporting player is responsible to self report. It is not the official's responsibility.

If 68 reported correctly, then explain why did 70 need to then run towards and up to the Official giving him hand signals?

Explain what the need was for the pre game meeting?

 

[Reality]

70 ran out there and reported multiple times correctly by himself with zero problems. Why the change to 3 different tackles approaching the referee? The rule clearly states 1 player, the reporting player is responsible to self report. It is not the official's responsibility.

If 68 reported correctly, then explain why did 70 need to then run towards and up to the Official giving him hand signals?

Explain what the need was for the pre game meeting?

Not sure why you are all worked up over this as I am not debating anything you are saying.

I am not on a "side" with this as I have simply been explaining what likely happened, not whether it was right or wrong.

The official announced the wrong player, which you can blame the referee for not paying attention or the Lions for confusing the referee by sending multiple players when only one was reporting.

The Lions coaches and players had a chance to correct the referees when the wrong player was announced but either they were not paying attention or they were hoping to benefit from the mistake so they didn't alert the referees that they had announced the wrong player number.

It really does not matter because in the end, the wrong player was announced so that's the reason why the play worked before being called back, and that has been the only point I have been making.

 

[Chasing6]

Not sure why you are all worked up over this as I am not debating anything you are saying.

I am not on a "side" with this as I have simply been explaining what likely happened, not whether it was right or wrong.

The official announced the wrong player, which you can blame the referee for not paying attention or the Lions for confusing the referee by sending multiple players when only one was reporting.

The Lions coaches and players had a chance to correct the referees when the wrong player was announced but either they were not paying attention or they were hoping to benefit from the mistake so they didn't alert the referees that they had announced the wrong player number.

It really does not matter because in the end, the wrong player was announced so that's the reason why the play worked before being called back, and that has been the only point I have been making.

That is an opinion that he announced the wrong player. 70 clearly ran up to the official giving him hand signals. He could have easily just ran into the huddle.

So was the meeting before the game about the following. So we may decide to go for 2. So we are going to send two players over to you with similar numbers in an attempt to confuse Dallas numbers 58 and 68. 68 is going to report to you as eligible. Then we are going to pretend like 70 is going to report again like he has already multiple times earlier in the game. When he gives you the hand signals and runs over to you, we want you to ignore him and announce the original tackle # 68 as reporting.

Is this what you believed the meeting was about?

The rule announcing to the defense and announcing it over the loud speaker is specifically designed to not create confusion. That is the hole purpose of the rule to begin with.

The same reason it states 1 player, the reporting player, reports they are eligible to the Official.

This was not a trick play. This was an attempt at cheating and the meeting was to try and get permission to do so. Or an attempt to make the Ref believe he made a mistake and he would not correct it.

 

[Reality]

That is an opinion that he announced the wrong player. 70 clearly ran up to the official giving him hand signals. He could have easily just ran into the huddle.

So was the meeting before the game about the following. So we may decide to go for 2. So we are going to send two players over to you with similar numbers in an attempt to confuse Dallas numbers 58 and 68. 68 is going to report to you as eligible. Then we are going to pretend like 70 is going to report again like he has already multiple times earlier in the game. When he gives you the hand signals and runs over to you, we want you to ignore him and announce the original tackle # 68 as reporting.

Is this what you believed the meeting was about?

The rule announcing to the defense and announcing it over the loud speaker is specifically designed to not create confusion. That is the hole purpose of the rule to begin with.

The same reason it states 1 player, the reporting player, reports they are eligible to the Official.

This was not a trick play. This was an attempt at cheating and the meeting was to try and get permission to do so. Or an attempt to make the Ref believe he made a mistake and he would not correct it.

Again, I am not sure what you are debating with me about because I simply explained what I believe happened based on the videos, the on-field audio, the stadium announcement and the comments by the players and coaches in the days after the game was played.

I get that you are on a "side" about this and that's perfectly fine, but I am not on any side nor do I care who is ultimately to blame for the mistake.

The only thing I have been commenting on is that some people and media who have said Detroit was screwed or the Cowboys were lucky seem to be forgetting that the defense was told the wrong player to guard, and that is why the play worked.

As to who is to blame, it really does not matter. The referees could have announced played #197 was eligible. If the offense did not alert the referee the wrong player number was announced, that's on the offense regardless of the process used to inform the officials.

Just like it is important for the defense to listen to the officials when they walk over to them to announce an eligible player, it is also just as important for the offense, at least the player who is reporting as eligible, to confirm the right number is announced.

Even if no trickery (or whatever terminology you prefer to use) was used, if the referee announces the wrong player number as eligibile and the offense and coaches do not alert the official they announced the wrong player number, then it's going to be flagged if the ball goes to another non-eligible player.

 

[Chasing6]

Again, I am not sure what you are debating with me about because I simply explained what I believe happened based on the videos, the on-field audio, the stadium announcement and the comments by the players and coaches in the days after the game was played.

I get that you are on a "side" about this and that's perfectly fine, but I am not on any side nor do I care who is ultimately to blame for the mistake.

The only thing I have been commenting on is that some people and media who have said Detroit was screwed or the Cowboys were lucky seem to be forgetting that the defense was told the wrong player to guard, and that is why the play worked.

As to who is to blame, it really does not matter. The referees could have announced played #197 was eligible. If the offense did not alert the referee the wrong player number was announced, that's on the offense regardless of the process used to inform the officials.

Just like it is important for the defense to listen to the officials when they walk over to them to announce an eligible player, it is also just as important for the offense, at least the player who is reporting as eligible, to confirm the right number is announced.

Even if no trickery (or whatever terminology you prefer to use) was used, if the referee announces the wrong player number as eligibile and the offense and coaches do not alert the official they announced the wrong player number, then it's going to be flagged if the ball goes to another non-eligible player.

If you are saying the defense was told to guard the wrong guy, then you are clearly blaming the Official who announced it.

What I am saying is, if you don't want to confuse the officials, then they should have done it the exact same way they reported multiple times before to that play.

If you're not on a side how do you have an opinion? Why do you continue to explain what the other side thinks or believes?

The other side is 100% wrong. It is obvious. There is video evidence proving they reported correctly multiple times before that play. Then 3 tackles approach the Ref during the 2 point play. The prior meeting before the game means it was premeditated.

The Officials announced 70 to the World. No one from GB questioned it.

Dan Cambell is an idiot.

 

[Reality]

If you are saying the defense was told to guard the wrong guy, then you are clearly blaming the Official who announced it.

What I am saying is, if you don't want to confuse the officials, then they should have done it the exact same way they reported multiple times before to that play.

If you're not on a side how do you have an opinion? Why do you continue to explain what the other side thinks or believes?

The other side is 100% wrong. It is obvious. There is video evidence proving they reported correctly multiple times before that play. Then 3 tackles approach the Ref during the 2 point play. The prior meeting before the game means it was premeditated.

The Officials announced 70 to the World. No one from GB questioned it.

Dan Cambell is an idiot.

It's great that you picked a side and want to argue it, but it is wasted on me as I am not on any side nor do I care who was right or wrong in what happened.

I simply explained what happened based on the information that came out in the days after the game.

Whose fault it was is irrelevant to me, so I will leave the emotional arguments to fans like yourself that seem to be quite upset and bothered by it.

The only thing I have been pointing out is that the reason the play worked (before being called back) was because the Cowboys were told the wrong player was eligible.

By "wrong" I mean they were told to guard one player while another one was the offensive target.

Since the other player was not announced as eligible, it made that player ineligible and resulted in a flag being thrown, which was the right call given the situation.

 

[Brooksey]

I don't care what anyone says, Dallas was gift wrapped that game by the refs. Words were said out there to the refs that nobody will know. It turned out for the better anyways because playing GB exposed that it wasn't all SFs defense to blame for Daks poor play. I hope Detroit comes into Dallas and gives them the beat down they deserve.

The refs gift wrapped the Lions final drive by calling tripping on the wrong team on 3rd down. The game was over, Lions were beat.