Looking like we'll be facing Brady after all

[Yakuza Rich]

No, because there was no investigation of Feely when the Jets equipment manager was caught tampering with k-balls - which is totally the point I am making.

You can't give one guy a totally free pass and then conduct a 4 month sham of an investigation and levy a 4 game suspension against another guy for the exact same "crime".

Goodell has said that the reason for the suspension was for not complying with the investigation. In particularly suddenly destroying his phone when Wells asked for it.

Feeley didn't lie to the league and didn't try to cover up their 'crime.' So Feeley doesn't work as a precedent.

I thought you were going to fully accept Wells' findings?




YR

 

[Rogah]

The texts were with McNally and Jastremski saying that Tom wanted the footballs deflated and Jastremski would do it for cash, sneakers (and I believe autographs). The silly excuse from Pats homers is that they were deflating it to the minimal amount because Brady got overinflated footballs before. But, that doesn't explain the fact that if Brady wants them to do their job, legallly, then they are going to do it without Brady having to pay them. He only pays them when they are doing something illegal and their butt is on the line if they get caught.

The NFL lawyer admitted under oath that there is no direct evidence linking Brady to any of the above.

Oh yeah...again, they fired both guys after the Wells Report came out. Guess they were innocent because we all know you fire guys for something they didn't do.

The NFL told the Patriots to suspend them and one of the deflategate punishments announced by the league is that only the league can reinstate them.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

so lying is the difference between 0 games and 4?

Well, Terrell Pryor was suspended for 4 games for something he did in college.

Nobody is saying that Goodell's judgments are consistent. That's why using precedent with him doesn't really work. The precedent with Goodell is that he has consistently changed his penalties without any precedent.




YR

 

[Rogah]

Goodell has said that the reason for the suspension was for not complying with the investigation. In particularly suddenly destroying his phone when Wells asked for it.

In his arbitration ruling, Goodell stated the punishment was for general awareness, providing inducements, and failure to cooperate.

As Judge Berman said, that was a "quantum leap" from even the findings of the Wells Report.

Feeley didn't lie to the league and didn't try to cover up their 'crime.' So Feeley doesn't work as a precedent.

Of course he does. As I stated above, he wasn't investigated, which is the point I am making.

But if we want to talk about refusal to turn over a phone, the precedent there is Brett Favre, who got a $50,000 fine, and no suspension.

I thought you were going to fully accept Wells' findings?

As I have admitted, my one mistake in this whole ridiculousness is I foolishly thought Wells was conducting a fair and independent investigation.

As we have since learned, it was not an independent investigation. Unfortunately, Wells was controlled by the league office from day 1.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

The texts were with McNally and Jastremski saying that Tom wanted the footballs deflated and Jastremski would do it for cash, sneakers (and I believe autographs). The silly excuse from Pats homers is that they were deflating it to the minimal amount because Brady got overinflated footballs before. But, that doesn't explain the fact that if Brady wants them to do their job, legallly, then they are going to do it without Brady having to pay them. He only pays them when they are doing something illegal and their butt is on the line if they get caught.

Let me preface this by saying, I 100% believe Brady is guilty. I have the entire time, but if the best evidence they have is a third party text indicating Brady, then I would say, you and I both know that it would not stand up in court. If you had a business partner who was murdered and you were the main benefactor from it and the police found a text on my phone where I told a friend of mine Yakuza Rich would pay to have his partner taken care of, there's no way it would be admissible. Again, I know he did it, he's a cheater, but realistically speaking this was a huge reach on Goodell's part that ultimately will make him look more like a clown.

Oh yeah...again, they fired both guys after the Wells Report came out. Guess they were innocent because we all know you fire guys for something they didn't do.




YR

And in a thread a while back, I mentioned how this was bull****. How can New England say there was no deflating of balls and then leave them hanging out to dry. I'd LOVE for the two to expose Brady and the Pats, however, this is nothing but circumstantial evidence.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

The NFL lawyer admitted under oath that there is no direct evidence linking Brady to any of the above.
The NFL told the Patriots to suspend them and one of the deflategate punishments announced by the league is that only the league can reinstate them.

Direct evidence can mean different things.

There was a guy named Tom who wanted them to deflated footballs according to those texts and Jastremski wanted money to do so and was referring to himself as the 'deflator' and if he didn't get his money he would inflate them to the size of watermelons.

It's not completely unreasonable to think that Brady has had personal conversations with McNally (like the time that Brady called McNally to the QB room, for the first time ever) and then McNally relayed the message to Jastremski.




YR

 

[burmafrd]

Brady refused to give up his phone. Wells told Brady he didn't need it. The fact that Brady destroyed the thing is irrelevant, except in terms of public relations.

Wells has the texts Brady exchanged with Jastremski and McNally by virtue of having had complete access to those 2 guys' phones.

you never have been able to explain Brady lying about not knowing their names have you? Your pathetic excuse for him destroying the phone is laughable. PUBLIC RELATIONS. Ha.
Once a cheater always a cheater- something else you have never been able to admit that once caught you are always guilty.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

Well, Terrell Pryor was suspended for 4 games for something he did in college.

Nobody is saying that Goodell's judgments are consistent. That's why using precedent with him doesn't really work. The precedent with Goodell is that he has consistently changed his penalties without any precedent.




YR

Which was bull**** as well, but nobody stood up for Pryor because no one like him. Even the Josh Gordon situation is bull****, why would Goodell make one of his restrictions alcohol? It's a condition that no other player in the NFL was under and while Gordon agreed to it, it was that or sit a year.

 

[burmafrd]

Let me preface this by saying, I 100% believe Brady is guilty. I have the entire time, but if the best evidence they have is a third party text indicating Brady, then I would say, you and I both know that it would not stand up in court. If you had a business partner who was murdered and you were the main benefactor from it and the police found a text on my phone where I told a friend of mine Yakuza Rich would pay to have his partner taken care of, there's no way it would be admissible. Again, I know he did it, he's a cheater, but realistically speaking this was a huge reach on Goodell's part that ultimately will make him look more like a clown.



And in a thread a while back, I mentioned how this was bull****. How can New England say there was no deflating of balls and then leave them hanging out to dry. I'd LOVE for the two to expose Brady and the Pats, however, this is nothing but circumstantial evidence.

what you and the judge never seem to get is that this was not a court of law nor ever intended to be. Strange how supposedly intelligent people cannot get that.

 

[burmafrd]

Which was bull**** as well, but nobody stood up for Pryor because no one like him. Even the Josh Gordon situation is bull****, why would Goodell make one of his restrictions alcohol? It's a condition that no other player in the NFL was under and while Gordon agreed to it, it was that or sit a year.

once in the drug program alcohol is part of it. You seem to forget that. Josh Gordon screwed himself- did not need any help. Have to laugh at those always looking for someone else to blame instead of the guilty party.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

what you and the judge never seem to get is that this was not a court of law nor ever intended to be. Strange how supposedly intelligent people cannot get that.

yea, I get that, but now it's in front of a judge. so he's going to hold Goodell to a legal standard, so if Goodell wants to stop players from going to court, he needs to apply punishments consistently and fairly, which most of you agree he does not. none of you guys were ok with the cap penalty we received, but are ok with this? as much as we dislike Brady, which I do to because he's a cheater, we should all welcome this check on Goodell's power.

 

[trickblue]

NFL wants this game... it will be a mega ratings. boon...

 

[Rogah]

Direct evidence can mean different things.

The NFL lawyer testified under oath in a Federal Court that there was no direct evidence. "Direct evidence" has a very specific meaning in the legal sense of the word so, when a Judge asks a lawyer about "direct evidence," it most certainly does not "mean different things."

 

[Manwiththeplan]

once in the drug program alcohol is part of it.

Wait, so if you test positive for drugs once, you can't drink alcohol without getting suspended?

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Let me preface this by saying, I 100% believe Brady is guilty. I have the entire time, but if the best evidence they have is a third party text indicating Brady, then I would say, you and I both know that it would not stand up in court. If you had a business partner who was murdered and you were the main benefactor from it and the police found a text on my phone where I told a friend of mine Yakuza Rich would pay to have his partner taken care of, there's no way it would be admissible. Again, I know he did it, he's a cheater, but realistically speaking this was a huge reach on Goodell's part that ultimately will make him look more like a clown.

I disagree.

If we know the business partner is murdered, I have a perfect motive for murder (financial gain) and we have texts between two guys talking about how Yakuza Rich wants this person murdered and the other guy says he will do it for money and it is later okay'd in the texts and with the guys continuing to text after the murder and telling them to not panic along with video evidence showing one of the hired hitmen being the last person to be in the same room with the murdered business partner before he was discovered...yeah..that would go to court.

The problem is that in our society we think that with all of the forensics TV shows that there should be a distinct and exact smoking gun. Instead, life rarely works out that way. I think at the very best for the Brady lapdogs...they can say that gaseous physics is an inexact science. There's just as many scientists that disagree with Wells' findings as there are that support Wells findings. So to me, it really comes down to the texts and the video.

Goodell's mistakes are about the past. He's been inconsistent and illogical in doling out penalties. That made him suspect in terms of giving punishment towards the Patriots. Even if we had video proof of Brady paying Jastremski for deflating the footballs, you would still get people saying '4 games for deflating footballs when domestic violence offenders have gotten 2 games?'

The evidence is more than sufficient and DA's would bring this to court if there was a similar case that they had and the perp, provided he didn't have a billion dollar machine behind them, would get convicted. It's just that Goodell is a buffoon and is completely over his head when it comes to doling out punishment. But as casmith mentioned...there's nothing really in black and white in the CBA other than it's a given that a 1st time offender, regardless of their offense, is going to get up to 4-games. That's what happened to Hardy and that's why his suspension got dropped from 10-games to 4-games. Goodell wanted to look good and now he can always say 'hey, I wanted to suspend Hardy for longer, but the CBA prevented me from doing that.' With Brady, Goodell knew that the most he can get out of it is 4-games and that suspending him for more is likely to hurt the league's case and get it dropped all together.

In the end, this could have all been prevented if the Patriots and Brady didn't cheat in the first place. Thanks, Tom.





YR

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Wait, so if you test positive for drugs once, you can't drink alcohol without getting suspended?

I'm pretty sure that is the case. IIRC, Favre had an issue with that a while back. He had some prescription drug problems and then a year or so later he had to petition to be allowed to drink alcohol.




YR

 

[Manwiththeplan]

I'm pretty sure that is the case. IIRC, Favre had an issue with that a while back. He had some prescription drug problems and then a year or so later he had to petition to be allowed to drink alcohol.




YR

fair enough, did not know that

 

[Manwiththeplan]

I disagree.

If we know the business partner is murdered, I have a perfect motive for murder (financial gain) and we have texts between two guys talking about how Yakuza Rich wants this person murdered and the other guy says he will do it for money and it is later okay'd in the texts and with the guys continuing to text after the murder and telling them to not panic along with video evidence showing one of the hired hitmen being the last person to be in the same room with the murdered business partner before he was discovered...yeah..that would go to court.

The problem is that in our society we think that with all of the forensics TV shows that there should be a distinct and exact smoking gun. Instead, life rarely works out that way. I think at the very best for the Brady lapdogs...they can say that gaseous physics is an inexact science. There's just as many scientists that disagree with Wells' findings as there are that support Wells findings. So to me, it really comes down to the texts and the video.

Goodell's mistakes are about the past. He's been inconsistent and illogical in doling out penalties. That made him suspect in terms of giving punishment towards the Patriots. Even if we had video proof of Brady paying Jastremski for deflating the footballs, you would still get people saying '4 games for deflating footballs when domestic violence offenders have gotten 2 games?'

The evidence is more than sufficient and DA's would bring this to court if there was a similar case that they had and the perp, provided he didn't have a billion dollar machine behind them, would get convicted. It's just that Goodell is a buffoon and is completely over his head when it comes to doling out punishment. But as casmith mentioned...there's nothing really in black and white in the CBA other than it's a given that a 1st time offender, regardless of their offense, is going to get up to 4-games. That's what happened to Hardy and that's why his suspension got dropped from 10-games to 4-games. Goodell wanted to look good and now he can always say 'hey, I wanted to suspend Hardy for longer, but the CBA prevented me from doing that.' With Brady, Goodell knew that the most he can get out of it is 4-games and that suspending him for more is likely to hurt the league's case and get it dropped all together.

In the end, this could have all been prevented if the Patriots and Brady didn't cheat in the first place. Thanks, Tom.





YR

then we just have to disagree, yes common sense ties Brady to this, but that's about it. you have two guys talk about doing this for Brady, but with out any text from Brady or any video of Brady doing this and it's a weak argument from a legal perspective.

 

[Nightman]

then we just have to disagree, yes common sense ties Brady to this, but that's about it. you have two guys talk about doing this for Brady, but with out any text from Brady or any video of Brady doing this and it's a weak argument from a legal perspective.

You can't have direct evidence if the co-conspirators destroy the evidence and the underlings take the fall.

That is why the Feds had to use the RICO act to get the Mob bosses. And the NFL doesn't have subpoena power.

They still have motive, they have the act on video, they have payments mentioned in texts, the guy calls himself the "Deflator", Brady destroys his phone and oh yeah.................ALL THE NE BALLS WERE SEVERELY UNDER-INFLATED.............

 

[Rogah]

They still have motive, they have the act on video, they have payments mentioned in texts, the guy calls himself the "Deflator", Brady destroys his phone and oh yeah.................ALL THE NE BALLS WERE SEVERELY UNDER-INFLATED.............

I respectfully disagree. As the AEI study proved, the balls were within range of where they were predicted to be by the Ideal Gas Law, and that didn't even take into account the potential that the leather stretched when wet.

The NFL has been lying to the public about this since day 1. If the league office lied about the Cowboys 1/10th as much as they lied here, this forum would absolutely lose its collective minds.