Marinelli's Legacy of Misevaluation

[Jake]

1. Nick Eatman talked about how during the 2019 Draft the Cowboys the debate in the war room was whether to take DT Trysten Hill at #58 or one of the safeties still on the board (Adderley, Rapp, or Thornhill). Eatman said that Marinelli went to bat for "his guy" Hill and the team rolled the dice thinking they could grab one of the safeties with their next pick at pick #90.
2. On the Feb. 9, Draft Show Broadduss was once again rehashing the 2016 Draft debate between Jalen Ramsey and Zeke. You'll remember this was when the team had almost identical grades ("tags were touching") between the two players. The interesting bit to me was not that Marinelli (and McClay) advocated for taking Zeke, but rather that they had misevaluated Ramsey as a safety and not a corner.

*#3 I don't have insider info to 100% validate it, but I think we all suspect in the 2017 Draft that Marinelli was a primary voice in the room that misevaluated TJ Watt as a 3-4 OLB, which was ultimately a factor in passing on him in favor of Taco Charlton.

Marinelli sucks, just to be clear, but to say TJ Watt was "misevaluated as a 3-4 OLB" doesn't make sense. He played that position in college and he plays that position in the NFL. He's never played a 4-3 DE position, so there's no evidence to support the "misevaluated" position.

Maybe he'd be a good 4-3 DE, but we don't know. We do know Taco sucked, but that doesn't necessarily mean Watt would've been good at that position. But he probably wouldn't have been any worse, so it was worth a shot.

 

[kskboys]

Marinelli's blueprint was flawed. Nothing else much mattered after that.

 

[Beaker42]

Every insider in Dallas will tell you that Marinelli had entirely too much juice in that draft room.

I can absolutely understand the thought process with the Taco and Zeke picks, but the Trysten Hill one still befuddles me.

Thornhill should’ve been the pick - Hill would’ve been there in the 3rd and probably even the 4th.

 

[kskboys]

Thornhill should’ve been the pick - Hill would’ve been there in the 3rd and probably even the 4th.

From what I saw he was rated a 6th round pick. His explosion may have gotten him overdrafted in the 4th, but nn earlier than that.

 

[Beaker42]

Marinelli sucks, just to be clear, but to say TJ Watt was "misevaluated as a 3-4 OLB" doesn't make sense. He played that position in college and he plays that position in the NFL. He's never played a 4-3 DE position, so there's no evidence to support the "misevaluated" position.

Maybe he'd be a good 4-3 DE, but we don't know. We do know Taco sucked, but that doesn't necessarily mean Watt would've been good at that position. But he probably wouldn't have been any worse, so it was worth a shot.

What % of snaps does TJ rush the QB?

 

[CowboyRoy]

Been listening to some of the team's podcasts (Draft Show and the Break) over the past few months and couple of things have popped out to me....Rod Marinelli has been directly been involved with at least two (more likely 3) significant prospect evaluations flubs:

1. Nick Eatman talked about how during the 2019 Draft the Cowboys the debate in the war room was whether to take DT Trysten Hill at #58 or one of the safeties still on the board (Adderley, Rapp, or Thornhill). Eatman said that Marinelli went to bat for "his guy" Hill and the team rolled the dice thinking they could grab one of the safeties with their next pick at pick #90.
2. On the Feb. 9, Draft Show Broadduss was once again rehashing the 2016 Draft debate between Jalen Ramsey and Zeke. You'll remember this was when the team had almost identical grades ("tags were touching") between the two players. The interesting bit to me was not that Marinelli (and McClay) advocated for taking Zeke, but rather that they had misevaluated Ramsey as a safety and not a corner.

*#3 I don't have insider info to 100% validate it, but I think we all suspect in the 2017 Draft that Marinelli was a primary voice in the room that misevaluated TJ Watt as a 3-4 OLB, which was ultimately a factor in passing on him in favor of Taco Charlton.

Marinelli, more than anyone is the biggest cause of the defensive issues. Jerry for hiring, not firing, and leaving everything up to that idiot is the #1 issue with Jones overall. A GM simply doesnt leave these kind of big decisions up to a coordinator.

Zeke over Ramsey was the #1 biggest blunder in the last 10 years. And Jerry doubled down on the mistake by resigning the drunk women beater to 15 million a year. The proper move would have been to try and trade Zeke for a windfall of picks. At the time, he probably could have gotten a first and possibly a 2nd or 3rd for him.

Taco over TJ Watt has to be #2 on the list. Then of course, Hill over one of the Safeties that dropped was all Marinelli.

Firing Marinelli was equally as important as getting rid of Garrett. Having these two dummies control our offense , defense, and team overall, it was no wonder the mediocrity over the last 10 years.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Garrett in a interview said, "we trust Marinelli and try to give him whatever he wants...player wise".

So the problem was Garrett going with Marinelli and Jerry going with Garrett. Shiites rolls down hill. Damn you Jerry! Quit hiring guys you can get alone with! Hire someone with some chops.

Both Jerry and Garrett simply left everything for the defense up to Marinelli. Both big mistakes on both of them. No accountability, no checks and balances. Just a couple of non football idiots like Jerry and Garrett leaving things up to a has been like Marinelli.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Every insider in Dallas will tell you that Marinelli had entirely too much juice in that draft room.

I can absolutely understand the thought process with the Taco and Zeke picks, but the Trysten Hill one still befuddles me.

NO more than you claiming you understand the thought process of the Taco and Zeke picks. That is more befuddling.

 

[buybuydandavis]

Been listening to some of the team's podcasts (Draft Show and the Break) over the past few months and couple of things have popped out to me....Rod Marinelli has been directly been involved with at least two (more likely 3) significant prospect evaluations flubs:

1. Nick Eatman talked about how during the 2019 Draft the Cowboys the debate in the war room was whether to take DT Trysten Hill at #58 or one of the safeties still on the board (Adderley, Rapp, or Thornhill). Eatman said that Marinelli went to bat for "his guy" Hill and the team rolled the dice thinking they could grab one of the safeties with their next pick at pick #90.
2. On the Feb. 9, Draft Show Broadduss was once again rehashing the 2016 Draft debate between Jalen Ramsey and Zeke. You'll remember this was when the team had almost identical grades ("tags were touching") between the two players. The interesting bit to me was not that Marinelli (and McClay) advocated for taking Zeke, but rather that they had misevaluated Ramsey as a safety and not a corner.

*#3 I don't have insider info to 100% validate it, but I think we all suspect in the 2017 Draft that Marinelli was a primary voice in the room that misevaluated TJ Watt as a 3-4 OLB, which was ultimately a factor in passing on him in favor of Taco Charlton.

I think Marinelli is like Jerry. They don't pick the best guy, they pick the guy who might make them look the best.
Marinelli wants his Dline Whisperer points; Jerry wants his Genius Jerry points.

Though I wonder. When drafts were going well, wasn't McClay the genius in charge? But now that we've had years of stinking defensive drafts, we're blaming it on Marinelli?

 

[CowboyRoy]

This is classic blame game, McClay is the talent evaluator and Jerry has final say so WM the talent guru is to blame for the poor draft picks, as for Zeke I would of preferred Ramsey but how soon folks forget that Zeke carried the team for 3 seasons and why he got the big$$$$ contract that most do not like. So it is WM and JJ’s fault and no one else’s for the poor drafting.

3 seasons you say that Zeke carried the Cowboys?

1. 2016....Dak won rookie of the year over Zeke.
2. 2017....Zeke single handily ruined the season by getting suspended for 6 games. Cowboys went 9-7 and missed the playoffs by 1 game.
3. 2018....Cowboys were 3-7 the first 8 games until Cooper was traded for. Dak and the passing game led the Cowboys to a 7-1 record in the 2nd half of the season to make the playoffs at 10-6.

Overall, Dak Prescott led the NFL in final drive comeback wins the first 3 years in the NFL. The same first 3 years you claim, Zeke the drunk carried the team.

In other words, he not only carried the team in crunch time, but beat Zeke in Rookie of the year honors in his best season as a RB.

Nice try troll.............another laughable comment gets smacked down!!!!

 

[KingintheNorth]

Jerry has often attached way too much value in the opinion of washed-up old guys. I feel he thinks the fellow old guys make him feel relevant.

For years he consulted with Barry Switzer and Larry Lacewell on critical personnel decisions, well after they were out of the league. Lately, it's been Gil Brandt (who I think was as innovative a football mind as there has ever been, 40 years ago). He bought into Monte Kiffin too much in 2013 and 2014, and gave Marinelli way too much influence in personnel from 2013 to 2019, despite several swing-and-misses.

One of Jerry's biggest issues as GM all these years, besides total incompetence and being completely unqualified, is that he doesn't have a core philosophy for building a football team. He's very much flavor-of-the-month.

 

[blumayne38]

3 seasons you say that Zeke carried the Cowboys?

1. 2016....Dak won rookie of the year over Zeke.
2. 2017....Zeke single handily ruined the season by getting suspended for 6 games. Cowboys went 9-7 and missed the playoffs by 1 game.
3. 2018....Cowboys were 3-7 the first 8 games until Cooper was traded for. Dak and the passing game led the Cowboys to a 7-1 record in the 2nd half of the season to make the playoffs at 10-6.

Overall, Dak Prescott led the NFL in final drive comeback wins the first 3 years in the NFL. The same first 3 years you claim, Zeke the drunk carried the team.

In other words, he not only carried the team in crunch time, but beat Zeke in Rookie of the year honors in his best season as a RB.

Nice try troll.............another laughable comment gets smacked down!!!!

Lmao one player ruined the season and your argument is that he isn’t any good

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

Marinelli sucks, just to be clear, but to say TJ Watt was "misevaluated as a 3-4 OLB" doesn't make sense. He played that position in college and he plays that position in the NFL. He's never played a 4-3 DE position, so there's no evidence to support the "misevaluated" position.

Maybe he'd be a good 4-3 DE, but we don't know. We do know Taco sucked, but that doesn't necessarily mean Watt would've been good at that position. But he probably wouldn't have been any worse, so it was worth a shot.

And Ramsey was evaluated as a safety. They also had Byron Jones shoehorned in at safety.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Lmao one player ruined the season and your argument is that he isn’t any good

Never said he wasn't any good. What do you think the team would have looked like with Dak out 6 games for beating his GF?

Zeke cost us at least one game.

Cowboys are 4-3 with Dak and no Zeke during that time period.

 

[Typhus]

Garrett in a interview said, "we trust Marinelli and try to give him whatever he wants...player wise".

So the problem was Garrett going with Marinelli and Jerry going with Garrett. Shiites rolls down hill. Damn you Jerry! Quit hiring guys you can get alone with! Hire someone with some chops.

Thats exactly how I remember that rolling down hill as well.
Jerry tries to hire people that can make the right choice so that he doesnt get blamed for being football stupid.
Jerrys problem is that he cant even hire the guy that has a football mind.

 

[Typhus]

Marinelli sucks, just to be clear, but to say TJ Watt was "misevaluated as a 3-4 OLB" doesn't make sense. He played that position in college and he plays that position in the NFL. He's never played a 4-3 DE position, so there's no evidence to support the "misevaluated" position.

Maybe he'd be a good 4-3 DE, but we don't know. We do know Taco sucked, but that doesn't necessarily mean Watt would've been good at that position. But he probably wouldn't have been any worse, so it was worth a shot.

There is absolutely zero value in comparing TJ Watt vs Taco.
Watt would still be on this roster and changing the defensive coaching decisions on how you build a defense.

 

[big dog cowboy]

trust your scouts to do the job.
trust your board....its what you pay them for.

 

[Bizwah]

Marinelli, more than anyone is the biggest cause of the defensive issues. Jerry for hiring, not firing, and leaving everything up to that idiot is the #1 issue with Jones overall. A GM simply doesnt leave these kind of big decisions up to a coordinator.

Zeke over Ramsey was the #1 biggest blunder in the last 10 years. And Jerry doubled down on the mistake by resigning the drunk women beater to 15 million a year. The proper move would have been to try and trade Zeke for a windfall of picks. At the time, he probably could have gotten a first and possibly a 2nd or 3rd for him.

Taco over TJ Watt has to be #2 on the list. Then of course, Hill over one of the Safeties that dropped was all Marinelli.

Firing Marinelli was equally as important as getting rid of Garrett. Having these two dummies control our offense , defense, and team overall, it was no wonder the mediocrity over the last 10 years.

I don't know about Zeke and Ramsey. Both have been great players. I agree that it was a major misfire by our scouting department to label him a safety.

Ramsey forced his way out of Jax. Would he had done that with us?

The bigger blunders, IMO, were with Taco over TJ. And I don't know what they saw in Hill. Just an enormous whiff there.

 

[plymkr]

Every insider in Dallas will tell you that Marinelli had entirely too much juice in that draft room.

I can absolutely understand the thought process with the Taco and Zeke picks, but the Trysten Hill one still befuddles me.

I think Rod's main criteria for drafting a defensive lineman is what are the chances of the guy getting a roughing the passer penalty. Those penalties kill a defense.

So in Rod's mind both the Taco pick and Hill were home runs because there's no chance they'll get a roughing the passer penalty.

 

[Bullflop]

Our valiant leader, GM Jerry, promised many moons ago, that he would avoid listening to the coaches, rather than the scouts, in matters of talent acquisition. It must have been a decade ago, if it was a day. Yet, many years later, we're still doing that. It seems some things never change.