More and more support for Jerry Jones

[ilovejerry]

Clearly too much jumping to conclusions....too many insults of the owner and gm, Jerry Jones, because fans think they know what's better for the team than the owner. I really don't understand fans thinking JJ would hire someone comfortable just because he knows them...the man wants to win.

More and more, it's looking like JJ is being very thorough and that he has a plan, probably put together in discussion with Parcells and others, for what he wants the next staff to look like, where he wants experience and where he wants youth.

I think it also sounds like Norv Turner has a very well-thought out plan for what he intends to do and what he demands in order to take a final journey into the HC-ing world of the NFL. If Turner is hired, he may succeed or he may fail, just as Parcells failed to meet his goals, but it won't be because he wasn't totally committed this time nor because he didn't have a very clear plan of what he wants and needs.

It may very well be Turner, Rivera, and Garrett. If Rivera doesn't come on board, it may end up being Phillips, Garrett, and Bowles,etc. Singletary and Rivera as HC may still end up as possibilities, but I'm sort of doubting it.

NO one knows what's going to happen, and certainly no one knows whether it will turn out great or poorly....that first year with JJ and Jimmy sure had Dallas fans everywhere calling it a joke, but it turned out okay.

I just think Jerry Jones deserves a little more credit and benefit of the doubt than what he's being shown. He made some real bonehead decisions for a few years while learning on the job, but he's been doing this for a long time now, and he has learned a thing or two, and most importantly for me, the man loves his Cowboys and wants to win and will do whatever he thinks will make that happen.

Nice post, good for you very insightful, anyone who thinks Jerry is an idiot, all I need to say is he is not the Dallas Cowboys owner among other business's because he is an idiot, He is a very smart business man who loves his Cowboys and wants to win, I support Jerry and glad he is the owner of this team.
That why I love Jerry !!! My favorite Cowboy right now.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Nice post, good for you very insightful, anyone who thinks Jerry is an idiot, all I need to say is he is not the Dallas Cowboys owner among other business's because he is an idiot, He is a very smart business man who loves his Cowboys and wants to win, I support Jerry and glad he is the owner of this team.
That why I love Jerry !!! My favorite Cowboy right now.

I just got off the phone with Jerry. I have good news and bad news for you.

I will start with the bad.

Although you may love Jerry...Jerry tells me he does not love you.

Now the Good.

Although he does not love you, he did say that if you paid to get advertising or luxury suits in the new Stadium...or even just donate some money for the new stadium...he would Like you, not love, but Like you.

Oh he also said before hanging up...He would also like you if you were a very good plastic surgeon who would do his face lifts for free or at a great discount.

:

 

[BulletBob]

I hope Jerry himself has learned and maybe he has but this is my guess as to what is different this time around. You can go ahead and pretent that Jerry has no history of bad decisions if you like but I have seen and still remember those bad decisions.

If you go back and reread my post, you will find that I have been very clear that he has made mistakes.

I followed up that point by indicating that every business owner makes mistakes (often doozies), and it is foolish to expect that an owner will travel a path to success without failures and missteps.

 

[BulletBob]

As BP mentions here Jerry's history leaves him open to the criticism. And if he hires Norv Turner on Monday I don't care if he interviewed the entire state of Texas he will still deserve more.

What's more ironic is everyone jumping all over people for 'drawing conclusions' when there is still no name on the dotted line. Isn't the gloating today just as premature as the criticism earlier in the week?

No, it isn't premature, because the point of most of the people criticizing the conclusion-jumpers is that instead of running around with your hair on fire and condemning Jerry for being an idiot, we should wait until we have all of the information on what his decision will actually be.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

No, it isn't premature, because the point of most of the people criticizing the conclusion-jumpers is that instead of running around with your hair on fire and condemning Jerry for being an idiot, we should wait until we have all of the information on what his decision will actually be.

Yet at the same time those that Gloat about it now...before there is an official announcement of the next coach...are really not much better.

Because in the end they are also drawing conclusions and gloating before the chicken is hatched.

Also who is to say that those that have been complaining about norv will be wrong in the end?

Maybe in the end we still hire Norv and Norv bombs?

We just don't know yet.

 

[wileedog]

If you go back and reread my post, you will find that I have been very clear that he has made mistakes.

I followed up that point by indicating that every business owner makes mistakes (often doozies), and it is foolish to expect that an owner will travel a path to success without failures and missteps.

Where do you draw the line though?

At what point is it just "making mistakes", which obviously everyone does, versus it becoming "hrmm, I don't think you are very good at this."

His post-Jimmy track record was abysmal - not just a 'few mistakes'. Just about every decision he made contributed to driving a Dynasty team into the ground. That's like saying Ghengis Khan was just a little cranky.

To his credit, he (finally) figured that out and hired Parcells. But with his presence in VR gone I think the fear that Jerry returns to his ways was and is a legitimate one, especially with the initial reports right after Bill left.

Again, Jones is not an 'idiot'. But after what he did pre-Parcells I think some "show me" is warranted here before folks will be comfortable with him calling the shots again.

 

[Doomsday101]

Where do you draw the line though?

At what point is it just "making mistakes", which obviously everyone does, versus it becoming "hrmm, I don't think you are very good at this."

His post-Jimmy track record was abysmal - not just a 'few mistakes'. Just about every decision he made contributed to driving a Dynasty team into the ground. That's like saying Ghengis Khan was just a little cranky.

To his credit, he (finally) figured that out and hired Parcells. But with his presence in VR gone I think the fear that Jerry returns to his ways was and is a legitimate one, especially with the initial reports right after Bill left.

Again, Jones is not an 'idiot'. But after what he did pre-Parcells I think some "some me" is warranted here before I'm comfortable with him calling the shots again.

Jones is a strong willed man if he wanted to run things he would have done it even when Parcells was here. The fact Jerry did give more athourity to Parcells shows me Jerry is intent on doing what ever has to be done to win. He will be involved but I think Jerry has learned from past mistakes and showed that the day he hired a coach like Parcells.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Where do you draw the line though?

At what point is it just "making mistakes", which obviously everyone does, versus it becoming "hrmm, I don't think you are very good at this."

His post-Jimmy track record was abysmal - not just a 'few mistakes'. Just about every decision he made contributed to driving a Dynasty team into the ground. That's like saying Ghengis Khan was just a little cranky.

To his credit, he (finally) figured that out and hired Parcells. But with his presence in VR gone I think the fear that Jerry returns to his ways was and is a legitimate one, especially with the initial reports right after Bill left.

Again, Jones is not an 'idiot'. But after what he did pre-Parcells I think some "show me" is warranted here before folks will be comfortable with him calling the shots again.

True True True.

Post Jimmy and Prior to Bill...it seemed like no matter how hard he tried, and I have NEVER questioned he tried to do what HE thought was the best and would help the cowboys win, he just made bad decision after bad decision.

His best decisions was to hire Bill. Now I know many out there will say bill was bad and terrible or a failure and blah blah blah. But it really has helped turned this team around talent wise and I am hoping it has Turned Jerry around in some ways.

Although the rumor that Lacewell is coming back, even if Ireland is still in charge of scouting, is a little concerning.

On a side note..that Ghengis Khan line gave me a good laugh.

 

[BulletBob]

In the last couple of days. A week ago he was giving every signal that he was back to his old self, and that is what people reacted to.

No, wilee, he was not giving every signal that he was back to his old self, the press, a lot of posters, and you were drawing conclusions from what was being reported that he was back to his old self.

Truth be told, I'm not sure there are very many people floating around this board who know exactly what the strategy is, what was said in the interviews, or what the criteria are for the new head coach.

Do the names Quincy Carter, Chad Hutchinson and Drew Henson ring a bell?

How long will you continue to crucify Jerry for this?

Let me ask you a question, actually two questions ...

1. Which owners and or GMs have operated in this league for the last two decades and have not made any mistakes?
   
   
2. Which owners and/or GMs would you rather have had lead the Dallas Cowboys over the past two decades?

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Jones is a strong willed man if he wanted to run things he would have done it even when Parcells was here. The fact Jerry did give more athourity to Parcells shows me Jerry is intent on doing what ever has to be done to win. He will be involved but I think Jerry has learned from past mistakes and showed that the day he hired a coach like Parcells.

But here is the catch IMO.

He knew in order to get Bill here, in order to work with Bill and have a good working relationship, he would have to give up some of that Control. Let's make no mistake Jerry was not the only one with a big ego in that relationship and I would also say that Bill gave up a little as well to make it work.

However what Jerry gave up or was willing to do/not do with a future HOF coach does not necessarily mean he would be willing to do that to the same extent with a coach like Norv or a young coach.

We have to realize this next coaching hire is not going to be someone with Bill's history and stature (no not talking about his physical man boob stature :laugh2: ).

 

[DC Cowboy]

Clearly too much jumping to conclusions....too many insults of the owner and gm, Jerry Jones, because fans think they know what's better for the team than the owner. I really don't understand fans thinking JJ would hire someone comfortable just because he knows them...the man wants to win.

More and more, it's looking like JJ is being very thorough and that he has a plan, probably put together in discussion with Parcells and others, for what he wants the next staff to look like, where he wants experience and where he wants youth.

I think it also sounds like Norv Turner has a very well-thought out plan for what he intends to do and what he demands in order to take a final journey into the HC-ing world of the NFL. If Turner is hired, he may succeed or he may fail, just as Parcells failed to meet his goals, but it won't be because he wasn't totally committed this time nor because he didn't have a very clear plan of what he wants and needs.

It may very well be Turner, Rivera, and Garrett. If Rivera doesn't come on board, it may end up being Phillips, Garrett, and Bowles,etc. Singletary and Rivera as HC may still end up as possibilities, but I'm sort of doubting it.

NO one knows what's going to happen, and certainly no one knows whether it will turn out great or poorly....that first year with JJ and Jimmy sure had Dallas fans everywhere calling it a joke, but it turned out okay.

I just think Jerry Jones deserves a little more credit and benefit of the doubt than what he's being shown. He made some real bonehead decisions for a few years while learning on the job, but he's been doing this for a long time now, and he has learned a thing or two, and most importantly for me, the man loves his Cowboys and wants to win and will do whatever he thinks will make that happen.

i was listening to the John thompson Show here in DC and they had James brown on and he said he has first hand knowledge of an owner that said he would never hire an AA head coach. Wonder if that was JJ!

 

[wileedog]

No, wilee, he was not giving every signal that he was back to his old self, the press, a lot of posters, and you were drawing conclusions from what was being reported that he was back to his old self.

Truth be told, I'm not sure there are very many people floating around this board who know exactly what the strategy is, what was said in the interviews, or what the criteria are for the new head coach.

Its a message board BB. We deal in speculation an whatever tidbits we can glean from a few mediots.

Weren't you the guy who was promoting the "I have no basis for this but Bill has actually been fired" conspiracy thread?

How long will you continue to crucify Jerry for this?

Was merely putting blame where it was due. It was not Bill Parcells decision to eschew drafting a QB - in fact he mentioned numerous times the difficulties he was having getting established at the position and how it was holding the team back over the years. It was the draft strategy of Jones and trying to find a QB without using a 1st round pick.

And I didn't bring it up in the first place.

 

[Doomsday101]

But here is the catch IMO.

He knew in order to get Bill here, in order to work with Bill and have a good working relationship, he would have to give up some of that Control. Let's make no mistake Jerry was not the only one with a big ego in that relationship and I would also say that Bill gave up a little as well to make it work.

However what Jerry gave up or was willing to do/not do with a future HOF coach does not necessarily mean he would be willing to do that to the same extent with a coach like Norv or a young coach.

We have to realize this next coaching hire is not going to be someone with Bill's history and stature (no not talking about his physical man boob stature :laugh2: ).

True but it does not mean he will resort to how it was with Campo and Gailey either. I can understand peoples concerns but I think many are jumping the gun in making claims that if we hire Norv that means Jones will take over, if Jones wants he can take over no matter who the coach is after all he is the Owner of this team. I'm more willing than others to believe that Jones has learned from past mistakes and willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

True but it does not mean he will resort to how it was with Campo and Gailey either. I can understand peoples concerns but I think many are jumping the gun in making claims that if we hire Norv that means Jones will take over, if Jones wants he can take over no matter who the coach is after all he is the Owner of this team. I'm more willing than others to believe that Jones has learned from past mistakes and willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Think of this for a minute though.

Jones has a History of doing it.

Norv has had a history of being in those situations...well at least in Oakland.
While in Washington Danny did not really have official ownership in an offseason until Norvs second year.

Plus you have had multiple players from different teams that basically thinks Norv is just not the type to command respect as an HC.

Now if the rumors are true that Norv has said he wanted say over coaches and some player decisions...than I give credit to norv. If those rumors are true, have to wonder if that kept Jerry from already hiring Norv.

Just some things to consider.

 

[BulletBob]

Where do you draw the line though?

At what point is it just "making mistakes", which obviously everyone does, versus it becoming "hrmm, I don't think you are very good at this."

His post-Jimmy track record was abysmal - not just a 'few mistakes'. Just about every decision he made contributed to driving a Dynasty team into the ground. That's like saying Ghengis Khan was just a little cranky.

To his credit, he (finally) figured that out and hired Parcells. But with his presence in VR gone I think the fear that Jerry returns to his ways was and is a legitimate one, especially with the initial reports right after Bill left.

Again, Jones is not an 'idiot'. But after what he did pre-Parcells I think some "show me" is warranted here before folks will be comfortable with him calling the shots again.

Nice Ghengis Khan reference. I'll play along.

For perspective sake, if you can name me an owner and/or GM who has consistently kept his team in the Super Bowl for the past 20 years, I will concede the point that an owner / GM should be expected to operate mistake-free every year.

We magnify Jerry's mistakes because they happened to our team. Every team has experienced the dark years. On par, I wouldn't trade our last 20 years for any other team's. The only other franchise that is close is the Patriots.

Now, as far as where to draw the line, you can go ahead and think that Jerry is reverting back to moron status every time a new article comes out. I prefer to reserve judgment a little while longer before I'll draw the conclusion that he has gone from genius to moron.

 

[BulletBob]

Its a message board BB. We deal in speculation an whatever tidbits we can glean from a few mediots.

Weren't you the guy who was promoting the "I have no basis for this but Bill has actually been fired" conspiracy thread?

I cannot stand how often you use facts to bolster your argument against me, and point out my hypocracy. Da** you, wileedog!



I did qualify it pretty clearly as a conspiracy theory, though.

:

 

[Doomsday101]

Think of this for a minute though.

Jones has a History of doing it.

Norv has had a history of being in those situations...well at least in Oakland.
While in Washington Danny did not really have official ownership in an offseason until Norvs second year.

Plus you have had multiple players from different teams that basically thinks Norv is just not the type to command respect as an HC.

Now if the rumors are true that Norv has said he wanted say over coaches and some player decisions...than I give credit to norv. If those rumors are true, have to wonder if that kept Jerry from already hiring Norv.

Just some things to consider.

I think Norv does want control hell he is going to deal with TO and Jones better give him some authority if Norv is to control the situation but the same could be said for any of the guys up for the job. I would also add Jones did not run Bill out of town he wanted him to stay on which tells me that Jones is not looking to run rough shot over these candidates heck Jerry did not have to redo Parcells contract last year if Jerry was so intent on getting his hands on things again. I expect business to continue as it has the last 4 years with the HC, Jones and the scouting department working together.

 

[Hunter71]

Interesting...

I'm wondering if person who wrote this thread took the time to consider that maybe, just maybe, JJ had made up his mind as Werder and Mort reported from their sources within the organization but the tide of criticism grew so loud about the hiring of Turner that, according to these same reporters, JJ reevaluated his own "knee-jerk" reaction to Parcells leaving...

JJ made it abundantly clear that he wanted to hire a coach BEFORE the SB...

Now he's deferring to after to interview, I imagine, RR or maybe someone else...

So, based on all we know and the reports we heard, JJ moving a lighting speed to hire someone with all indications being that it was Norv, created a bit of hysteria here...

And rightfully so...

I personally think JJ heard the criticism and took a hard look at what this would really mean for him long-term...

He needs to win, he needs to put arses in the seats and Norv is NOT a winner...

JJ ain't no dummy...

He thinks with his wallet...

If you want to make assumptions about the process, as we must have according to you, then I think it's only fair to assume that JJ had his own rush to judgement which he has since back-peddled from...

 

[DipChit]

Nice Ghengis Khan reference. I'll play along.

For perspective sake, if you can name me an owner and/or GM who has consistently kept his team in the Super Bowl for the past 20 years, I will concede the point that an owner / GM should be expected to operate mistake-free every year.

We magnify Jerry's mistakes because they happened to our team. Every team has experienced the dark years. On par, I wouldn't trade our last 20 years for any other team's. The only other franchise that is close is the Patriots.

Now, as far as where to draw the line, you can go ahead and think that Jerry is reverting back to moron status every time a new article comes out. I prefer to reserve judgment a little while longer before I'll draw the conclusion that he has gone from genius to moron.

Well regardless of whether he does the "right thing" with this hire or not it doesnt change the fact that only the Lions have gone longer without a playoff victory than we have at the moment.

And the one consistent throughout that drought is JJ. That needs to end. Whether JJ has everything to do with it or nothing to do with it.

 

[notherbob]

Good points all the way around.

And you are right about gloating today vs criticism earlier in the week.

We have yet to see the end result.

It may be good, it may not be good.

We just don't know yet.

Furthermore we will have to wait until the season plays out for the results.

Wet blanket. What's logic got to do with it anyway?