My case for Suh

[ccb04]

Do they really think they can spend that much to franchise him? That would be crazy. Especially when the have other big contracts with Stafford and Megatron.

Not sure? But they've put it on the table as an option: http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/1...s-team-open-using-franchise-tag-ndamukong-suh

 

[MichaelWinicki]

That is one reason I'm not a big believer in numbers. Teams don't game plan against Paea. Re-watch what Suh did against our all-pro G and our whole offensive line. He may not get the sacks but he COMMANDS a double team and still makes his way into the backfield.

Paea would still be nice don't get me wrong.

But here's another problem with signing either Suh or Paea... where do you play them?

Right now you already have a decent and getting better #3 DT in Crawford.

You aren't going to sign Suh to play the #1 DT spot... that not going to get you the best bang for your buck.

Crawford isn't large enough to be a #1 DT... and again you're misusing his talents by placing him in that spot that gets constant double teams. And Crawford is miscast as a DE in this system.

Really what the Cowboys need is the best #1 type DT available in free agency.


One other point is the snap count. Suh had 875 snaps last season and in the Cowboys system a starting DT is going to get closer to 600 snaps.

To pay a king's ransom for a guy to only get 600 snaps doesn't sound like a good idea either.

 

[Texas_Pete]

Suh isn't Haynesworth. Haynesworth was lazy and had a terrible work ethic, and once he got paid he basically retired.

Suh's always mentioned as one of the hardest working guys on the team, and he's already made an absolutely ridiculous amount of money and still brings his lunch pail to work every day.

You can compare their "on the field" issues all you want, but the dude has the work ethic of 10 Haynesworth's. If you take off the disciplinary stuff, he's absolutely the RKG.

He's going to cost a ton though, and he's going to get McCoy money. However, our 1-tech usually takes a ton of snaps and Suh's perfectly capable of playing there and even backing up the 3.

Realistically, you could get Suh + Sheard/Graham while franchising Dez if you wanted too. You'd have to get creative with the contracts to sign the other FA players we want to bring back but it's possible.

This might be the show stopper. In my eyes he's better than McCoy to begin with. How much did McCoy get?

 

[Vegas_Cowboy]

Who are those 3 good players??

My point went right over your head, I guess. Just trying to point out that multiple needs could be filled with that money.
But to answer your question anyway, nobody knows who's going to be available come free agency yet as some of them will re-sign with their current teams before free agency begins.
I'm sure you already knew that but just wanted to call me out anyway.

 

[xwalker]

But here's another problem with signing either Suh or Paea... where do you play them?

Right now you already have a decent and getting better #3 DT in Crawford.

You aren't going to sign Suh to play the #1 DT spot... that not going to get you the best bang for your buck.

Crawford isn't large enough to be a #1 DT... and again you're misusing his talents by placing him in that spot that gets constant double teams. And Crawford is miscast as a DE in this system.

Really what the Cowboys need is the best #1 type DT available in free agency.


One other point is the snap count. Suh had 875 snaps last season and in the Cowboys system a starting DT is going to get closer to 600 snaps.

To pay a king's ransom for a guy to only get 600 snaps doesn't sound like a good idea either.

In Marinelli system you basically need 3 starting type DTs. Two 3-techs and a 1-tech or 1 each of a 3-tech, 1-tech and 3/1 tech combo player.

Suh played both the 1-tech and 3-tech in Detroit.

Also, on obvious passing situations both DTs play like a 3-tech with a big gap in the middle of the DLIne. They play Nickel more than 50% of the snaps for the season.

The issue of snap count is a consideration. If the Cowboys played him for less snaps than Detroit played him would they be getting less value from him? My guess is that he would play more snaps than most players in Marinelli's defense. Sapp played a lot of snaps in Tampa back in the day. This season Mincey played a large percentage of the snaps. Probably too many.

If you put Suh on just about any 4-3 team in the NFL, he would be the best player at his position at either the 1-tech or the 3-tech.

 

[Nirvana]

If we sign Suh I want him and Crawford on the field at the same time for as many snaps as possible - that would be all nickel formations and some base. Brent/Bishop/Hayden/TBD could fill in some. Suh is a workhorse.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

In Marinelli system you basically need 3 starting type DTs. Two 3-techs and a 1-tech or 1 each of a 3-tech, 1-tech and 3/1 tech combo player.

Suh played both the 1-tech and 3-tech in Detroit.

Also, on obvious passing situations both DTs play like a 3-tech with a big gap in the middle of the DLIne. They play Nickel more than 50% of the snaps for the season.

The issue of snap count is a consideration. If the Cowboys played him for less snaps than Detroit played him would they be getting less value from him? My guess is that he would play more snaps than most players in Marinelli's defense. Sapp played a lot of snaps in Tampa back in the day. This season Mincey played a large percentage of the snaps. Probably too many.

If you put Suh on just about any 4-3 team in the NFL, he would be the best player at his position at either the 1-tech or the 3-tech.

No question Suh is a talent.

I just don't think the Cowboys, for one reason or another, would get full value out of the investment.

They would get better value out of a combination of Paea and Sheard and still wouldn't have the same number of $ committed.

 

[xwalker]

No question Suh is a talent.

I just don't think the Cowboys, for one reason or another, would get full value out of the investment.

They would get better value out of a combination of Paea and Sheard and still wouldn't have the same number of $ committed.

I understand the point and in past years (specifically 2014) I wanted more mid-tier players added to the defense instead of expensive top end players because they had so many talent issues; however, this year I have somewhat of the opposite feeling. I feel that they have a good core or reasonable NFL players that now know this defensive scheme, but are lacking in dominant type players.

I pulled up the Cowboys-Bears game and watched Paea. I was not really impressed. I fine with Josh Brent, Ken Bishop and T. McClain. The Cowboys pushed Paea around fairly easily. I almost felt sorry for him on some snaps.

I would like to add Sheard under the right circumstances; although, after watching some of his game footage I would only only rate him as about equal to or slightly better than Mincey.

 

[Texas_Pete]

We need a massive upgrade from Hayden and make T McClain a rotational backup. I'm onboard with getting Suh, but if we can't, there are a few quality DTs and DEs that are FAs we could go get and bolster our front 7:

DTs:

Terrence Cody - 6'4" 349lbs, 26 years old (Ravens)

Kenrick Ellis - 6'5" 330lbs, 27 years old (Jets)

Letroy Guion - 6'4" 303lbs, 27 years old (Packers)

Terrance Knighton - 6'3" 330lbs, 28 years old (Broncos)

DEs:

Corey Wootton - 6'6" 270lbs, 27 years old (Vikings)

Karl Klug - 6'3" 278lbs, 26 years old (Titans)

BTB LINK: http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2015...king-at-mock-drafts-and-potential-free-agents

 

[joseephuss]

We need a massive upgrade from Hayden and make T McClain a rotational backup. I'm onboard with getting Suh, but if we can't, there are a few quality DTs and DEs that are FAs we could go get and bolster our front 7:

DTs:

Terrence Cody - 6'4" 349lbs, 26 years old (Ravens)

Kenrick Ellis - 6'5" 330lbs, 27 years old (Jets)

Letroy Guion - 6'4" 303lbs, 27 years old (Packers)

Terrance Knighton - 6'3" 330lbs, 28 years old (Broncos)

DEs:

Corey Wootton - 6'6" 270lbs, 27 years old (Vikings)

Karl Klug - 6'3" 278lbs, 26 years old (Titans)

BTB LINK: http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2015...king-at-mock-drafts-and-potential-free-agents

They may look at Okoye as their rotational backup.

 

[Texas_Pete]

They may look at Okoye as their rotational backup.

Ahh, forgot about him. Hope he is finally healthy.

 

[joseephuss]

Ahh, forgot about him. Hope he is finally healthy.

I think he is finally healthy, but just wasn't in good enough football shape to get activated this season. An off season of workouts and a full training camp and he may end up as a contributor.

 

[GeorgiaCowboy7]

so rumor is Suh is looking for jj watt money. I'm ok with that, the guy is a game changer. Now I'm not 100% ok with his antics of stomping people, but language to address that in the contract can be implemented.

If we sign Suh that gets Hayden out of there and drastically improves the interior. That leaves one hole on our line at LDE... Or does it. I believe mincey can handle that.

That brings us into the draft able
to draft BPA. Though that still leaves us with CB and FS holes. But in all reality we can't have it all. Suh will demand double teams constantly which will free up Crawford and Lawrence and hopefully create more pressure to mask some secondary weakness.

Scum like that doesn't change just because of contract wording. No, save the big money for someone who actually deserves it.

 

[Cebrin]

JPP is going to command(ask) for just as much as suh...

and we wouldnt get him and McCarty at S from the patriots for the same dollar figure as suh

JPP won't get Suh money and safeties don't get that kind of money period. We likely won't get both, but it's as much a possibility as getting Suh here at all.