NBA Offseason

[Floatyworm]

Bad trade by Thunder, they could have done better

I'm not so sure...they get 2 #1's....and the right to swap 2 more #1's......and they basically ditched 47 million in due salary to Westbrook.

True...they are stuck w/ Paul for this year...or maybe he gets dealt in December as well. I think if he plays out the season...he will force a buy out....saving the Thunder even more money.

On the surface it sure doesn't look like they got much for Russ....but this was always about shedding money...and stockpiling picks for the future.

Question is...will they be able to trade those picks in the future? I think their plan going forward will be to make a trade package so big....a team can't say no...to either move up in the draft or get a player in his prime.

I still think OKC....if they could pick up a wing that could score...they might still surprise some people....not that they are gonna win a title..but they sure could spoil someones path to a title.

Personally...I'd like to see them roll w/ the kids.

PG- Gilgeous-Alexander/ Dennis Schroder

SG-Hamidou Diallo/ Terrance Ferguson

SF- [URL='http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/2595435/abdel-nader']Abdel Nader/Darius Bazley[/URL]

PF- Danilo Gallinari/ [URL='http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/2490089/mike-muscala']Mike Muscala[/URL]

C- Steven Adams / Nerlens Noel

 

[Floatyworm]

You are both wrong

Redick is getting old and I dislike signing old dudes but he averaged the highest point total of his career last year largely because Philly so badly needed his shooting in the offense.
The guy who partially reduced the monstrous need for Redick was Jimmy and now he is gone too.

Redick is special in the area Philly struggles in most. He's a heck of a lot better value at 13 (18pts a game and unlimited range is worth 13m to anyone) than Horford is at 24.

Doubling down on wings that are mediocre shooters but can all take you off the dribble makes no sense to me.

Philly had a ton of talent and still does but it still fits pretty poorly IMO.

76ers are 2nd behind the Bucks in Vegas odds and most people's EC rankings.
Bucks have the best player of the group and the outside shooters around Giannis.

Until Ben learns to shoot they need specialists who can on that roster big time.

Letting guys go... that can shoot...is always a mistake. Guys that can stroke the 3...are like DEs that can get to the QB. You just don't give those away...and Philly did.

 

[darthseinfeld]

I'm not so sure...they get 2 #1's....and the right to swap 2 more #1's......and they basically ditched 47 million in due salary to Westbrook.

True...they are stuck w/ Paul for this year...or maybe he gets dealt in December as well. I think if he plays out the season...he will force a buy out....saving the Thunder even more money.

On the surface it sure doesn't look like they got much for Russ....but this was always about shedding money...and stockpiling picks for the future.

Question is...will they be able to trade those picks in the future? I think their plan going forward will be to make a trade package so big....a team can't say no...to either move up in the draft or get a player in his prime.

I still think OKC....if they could pick up a wing that could score...they might still surprise some people....not that they are gonna win a title..but they sure could spoil someones path to a title.

Personally...I'd like to see them roll w/ the kids.

PG- Gilgeous-Alexander/ Dennis Schroder

SG-Hamidou Diallo/ Terrance Ferguson

SF- Abdel Nader/Darius Bazley

PF- Danilo Gallinari/ Mike Muscala

C- Steven Adams / Nerlens Noel

I think your own picks before those picks start conveying, and then once those picks are ready to convey you figure it out then. At that point you take a look at your young core and judge whether thats what you want to build around. If not that you use your assets (including young players you draft between now and then) to manuever into a contender via trade.

My guess is you guys have at least two trips to the lottery before picks convey. What you end up with out of those lottery picks should tell you what to do with the rest. If in that time you land the next KD, you keep that build around that. If you land the next Brandon Ingram, you package that with some picks. With the picks you got in trades, I think you have enough assets to trade for at least two All Star caliber players. Add in assets you acquire before they convey and you could have even more

 

[darthseinfeld]

I'm not so sure...they get 2 #1's....and the right to swap 2 more #1's......and they basically ditched 47 million in due salary to Westbrook.

True...they are stuck w/ Paul for this year...or maybe he gets dealt in December as well. I think if he plays out the season...he will force a buy out....saving the Thunder even more money.

On the surface it sure doesn't look like they got much for Russ....but this was always about shedding money...and stockpiling picks for the future.

Question is...will they be able to trade those picks in the future? I think their plan going forward will be to make a trade package so big....a team can't say no...to either move up in the draft or get a player in his prime.

I still think OKC....if they could pick up a wing that could score...they might still surprise some people....not that they are gonna win a title..but they sure could spoil someones path to a title.

Personally...I'd like to see them roll w/ the kids.

PG- Gilgeous-Alexander/ Dennis Schroder

SG-Hamidou Diallo/ Terrance Ferguson

SF- Abdel Nader/Darius Bazley

PF- Danilo Gallinari/ Mike Muscala

C- Steven Adams / Nerlens Noel

Id trade Adams and Schroeder too if they can move Paul. Schroeder mighy be tricky because of his contract, but 15 million per for him on a good team in the type he had last year might be doable. He is a good player, you probably just dont want him as your main PG

 

[jterrell]

Letting guys go... that can shoot...is always a mistake. Guys that can stroke the 3...are like DEs that can get to the QB. You just don't give those away...and Philly did.

Yup. And it's about design and spacing.
The PG has zero range. The 4 and 5 are solid as a rock but not stretch guys.
The 2 is a great young athlete but mediocre shooter.

Redick and Covington were the top guys for volume 3PT shooting and accuracy.
Muscala was a long range guy too before being dealt.
Jimmy had legit 3PT range.

They've really dropped off in that area to where the only true shooter is a part-time stretch 4, 31 year old career back up ,Mike Scott.

 

[jterrell]

I'm not so sure...they get 2 #1's....and the right to swap 2 more #1's......and they basically ditched 47 million in due salary to Westbrook.

True...they are stuck w/ Paul for this year...or maybe he gets dealt in December as well. I think if he plays out the season...he will force a buy out....saving the Thunder even more money.

On the surface it sure doesn't look like they got much for Russ....but this was always about shedding money...and stockpiling picks for the future.

Question is...will they be able to trade those picks in the future? I think their plan going forward will be to make a trade package so big....a team can't say no...to either move up in the draft or get a player in his prime.

I still think OKC....if they could pick up a wing that could score...they might still surprise some people....not that they are gonna win a title..but they sure could spoil someones path to a title.

Personally...I'd like to see them roll w/ the kids.

PG- Gilgeous-Alexander/ Dennis Schroder

SG-Hamidou Diallo/ Terrance Ferguson

SF- Abdel Nader/Darius Bazley

PF- Danilo Gallinari/ Mike Muscala

C- Steven Adams / Nerlens Noel

They almost certainly will do everything they can to tank including shipping off vets for anything they can get.
The way they handled PS13 and Russ will bode well for them with vets in FA once they are competitive again.
I am guessing being bad next year will grow to be more important to them then winning trades so they may give up guys for next to nothing just to shed salary and wins.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

Yup. And it's about design and spacing.
The PG has zero range. The 4 and 5 are solid as a rock but not stretch guys.
The 2 is a great young athlete but mediocre shooter.

Redick and Covington were the top guys for volume 3PT shooting and accuracy.
Muscala was a long range guy too before being dealt.
Jimmy had legit 3PT range.

They've really dropped off in that area to where the only true shooter is a part-time stretch 4, 31 year old career back up ,Mike Scott.

Lol this guy..

Their starting 3 has been a 40% or above 3pt shooter for 3 straight seasons now. Starting 4 is 40% 3pt shooter last 2 years. Starting 5 can come out and hit one occasionally. Starting 2 hits them at 37% past two years.

One shooter..lol

 

[CowboysRock1980]

Spurs have hired Duncan as assistant coach, Duncan will do well

Wizards are going to offer Beal 3 year 111 million extension, I told you Beal is not getting traded

 

[RoyTheHammer]

Spurs have hired Duncan as assistant coach, Duncan will do well

Wizards are going to offer Beal 3 year 111 million extension, I told you Beal is not getting traded

Excited to see Tim back on the sideline!

 

[CowboysRock1980]

Excited to see Tim back on the sideline!

Me too, he is one of my favorite players

 

[darthseinfeld]

Spurs have hired Duncan as assistant coach, Duncan will do well

Wizards are going to offer Beal 3 year 111 million extension, I told you Beal is not getting traded

All time greats typically dont make good coaches, but there are some exceptions like Kidd. Tim was such a cerebral player, I think he would do well as a coach ala Kidd

 

[darthseinfeld]

Spurs have hired Duncan as assistant coach, Duncan will do well

Wizards are going to offer Beal 3 year 111 million extension, I told you Beal is not getting traded

And a great culture move. You want a team to know how to win championships the Spur way, bring in the guy rhat lead them to 4 championships

 

[jterrell]

Lol this guy..

Their starting 3 has been a 40% or above 3pt shooter for 3 straight seasons now. Starting 4 is 40% 3pt shooter last 2 years. Starting 5 can come out and hit one occasionally. Starting 2 hits them at 37% past two years.

One shooter..lol

thats just spin....

Ben shoots at a 0 clip. 0.
JRich 37%
Tobias was 40% for 2 seasons in LAC. Fell to 32% in PHI. Was under 35 in the playoffs.
Horford is NOT a shooter, lol. He is at 36% for his career and last yearbut he doesn't shoot much period.
Embiid shoots 30%.

But again none of these guys are stretch the floor players.
The 3 most common lineups for Philly last year included Wilson Chandler then JJ Redick then Robert Covington at SF.
Those were for floor spacing.
Playing a PG like Ben creates very specific needs around him.

The Sixers were in the bottom 3rd last year in 3PT makes per game.
HOU, MIL and GSW led.
Sixers than lost their most frequent 3PT shooters.
Bury your head in the sand all you want it won't change that the issue is very real and a lot other people will be talking about it by Christmas.
Starter 3pt makes:
Ben -0
JRich -2.2
Tobias -1.9
Horford -1.1
Embiid -1.2

Thats a sad 6.4 makes per game. A bottom 10 figure.
Redick was at 3.2 by himself or half this team's starting total.

Compare to MIL
Bledsoe -1.6
Wes -2.2
Khris -2.3
Giannis -.7
Brook -2.3

9.1 by starters....

 

[CowboysRock1980]

And a great culture move. You want a team to know how to win championships the Spur way, bring in the guy rhat lead them to 4 championships

You mean 5 championships

 

[RoyTheHammer]

thats just spin....

Ben shoots at a 0 clip. 0.
JRich 37%
Tobias was 40% for 2 seasons in LAC. Fell to 32% in PHI. Was under 35 in the playoffs.
Horford is NOT a shooter, lol. He is at 36% for his career and last yearbut he doesn't shoot much period.
Embiid shoots 30%.

But again none of these guys are stretch the floor players.
The 3 most common lineups for Philly last year included Wilson Chandler then JJ Redick then Robert Covington at SF.
Those were for floor spacing.
Playing a PG like Ben creates very specific needs around him.

The Sixers were in the bottom 3rd last year in 3PT makes per game.
HOU, MIL and GSW led.
Sixers than lost their most frequent 3PT shooters.
Bury your head in the sand all you want it won't change that the issue is very real and a lot other people will be talking about it by Christmas.
Starter 3pt makes:
Ben -0
JRich -2.2
Tobias -1.9
Horford -1.1
Embiid -1.2

Thats a sad 6.4 makes per game. A bottom 10 figure.
Redick was at 3.2 by himself or half this team's starting total.

Compare to MIL
Bledsoe -1.6
Wes -2.2
Khris -2.3
Giannis -.7
Brook -2.3

9.1 by starters....

He calls actual stats "spin"..lol

 

[John813]

Spurs have hired Duncan as assistant coach, Duncan will do well

Wizards are going to offer Beal 3 year 111 million extension, I told you Beal is not getting traded

Well, it's up to Beal to sign the extension. If he does, obviously he's part of their long term plans.

 

[jterrell]

Well, it's up to Beal to sign the extension. If he does, obviously he's part of their long term plans.

Not necessarily.
Ultimately extension or not he could be traded.
Extension protects his money and the team buying in trade. Especially a small market team might overpay for a freshly extended Beal.

As we saw with russ, cp3 and pg13 contract status is fluid.

But it does make it more likely the plan is to keep him.
The challenge is how long does Beal want to be in WAS losing and WAS want Beal hampering their re-build efforts.
I saw the 538 projection which had then at 50 losses and 5th worst record.
That's not ideal in anyway.
You'd rather finish bottom 3 and play all kids with upside collected around the league's recent drafts or be competitive for a playoff spot.

So most still kinda hold Beal out as that guy a good team could get to become a title contender.
He's always been a guy that would have really elevated the Lakers but they don't have anything to trade atm.
He'd be a really nasty final piece in MIL but those would be some really low draft picks.
As a Mavs fan we'd love him and he'd fit in nicely w Luka/KP but also lack trade pieces/assets aside from those 2.
MINNY/PHI lots of teams could really use him.

So I think short term this makes sense but him in WAS may not in a year's time. I'd guess at trade deadline first real forays happen and by this time next year he is elsewhere.

 

[John813]

Not necessarily.
Ultimately extension or not he could be traded.
Extension protects his money and the team buying in trade. Especially a small market team might overpay for a freshly extended Beal.

As we saw with russ, cp3 and pg13 contract status is fluid.

But it does make it more likely the plan is to keep him.
The challenge is how long does Beal want to be in WAS losing and WAS want Beal hampering their re-build efforts.
I saw the 538 projection which had then at 50 losses and 5th worst record.
That's not ideal in anyway.
You'd rather finish bottom 3 and play all kids with upside collected around the league's recent drafts or be competitive for a playoff spot.

So most still kinda hold Beal out as that guy a good team could get to become a title contender.
He's always been a guy that would have really elevated the Lakers but they don't have anything to trade atm.
He'd be a really nasty final piece in MIL but those would be some really low draft picks.
As a Mavs fan we'd love him and he'd fit in nicely w Luka/KP but also lack trade pieces/assets aside from those 2.
MINNY/PHI lots of teams could really use him.

So I think short term this makes sense but him in WAS may not in a year's time. I'd guess at trade deadline first real forays happen and by this time next year he is elsewhere.

I agree. Just guessing if he declines the extension then it could make Washington wonder if they should start looking into moving him by the offseason to maximize their potential return.
But they are still stuck with that Wall deal.

 

[jterrell]

I agree. Just guessing if he declines the extension then it could make Washington wonder if they should start looking into moving him by the offseason to maximize their potential return.
But they are still stuck with that Wall deal.

I'm sure he'd accept tbh.
I think WAS would be willing to trade him if he asks regardless and the extension just guarantees him more money and the team more return.
Teams seemingly have accepted that players wield all the power right now and the reality is guys can and should get max money where offered then simply ask to be moved if fit worsens.

AD and Klutch handled that mess all wrong. Had they extended with NOP first then was traded he'd have made A LOT more money. I think they saw the 4M trade kciker as a key short-term piece but then had to waive it for cap space reasons.
Nerlens Noel turning down 70m from the Mavs has been insanely bad.
Always get your guaranteed money!!!

 

[Vintage]

That totally fair just odd to sign a guy over 30 in that scenario.
Stealing someone like Oubre would've appealed more to me.
Then again maybe Thad becomes a value asset at trade deadline.

I just hate improving 2-3 games on poor teams with no upside to it.

The Bulls has one of the youngest rosters in the league last year.

Up front, WCJ is 20. Lauri is 22. Gafford is 20. Feliciano isn’t good (27). Kornet is 24.

They needed a reliable veteran upfront. He’s going to get plenty of playing time. Might not be a major needle mover, but will provide consistency with a largely unproven frontcourt.