Next Time we Discuss Dak's Stats

gjkoeppen

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you take two play out of 400 passes to make a case..... where we can give 100 throws from Dak regarding his down field inaccuracy....

yet all dak lovers also confirm that he needs to work on his accuracy....yet they also defend him at the same time....

consecutive throws are meaningless....we scored 13 points...had 250 yards against a team that's ranked 30th I the league against the pass and gives up on average about 290......

may I say whoopdie dee doo

Gee how is that different than those that cherry pick plays to whine about Prescott. People bring up those things to show that he's not as bad as the Prescott haters TRY to paint him. BTW, just about all players need improvements at something so admitting that isn't wrong. One last thing, the almost pick and the actual pick were throws of less than 10 yards down field so I don't know where your whine about 100 throws down field comes from.
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America's Cowboy

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What a moronic response. Why does someone have to be female to say fans are not the dating police for players. Are you also the Cowboys political police too. Do you get to decide who players can vote for to? How about do you decide what kind of cars they have to buy or what foods they can eat? All of those things are just as ridiculous as someone questioning who a player dates.
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Fans are the consumers. They have every right to question what may be causing the results on the field, even if it includes off-the-field decisions.
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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Gee how is that different than those that cherry pick plays to whine about Prescott. People bring up those things to show that he's not as bad as the Prescott haters TRY to paint him. BTW, just about all players need improvements at something so admitting that isn't wrong. One last thing, the almost pick and the actual pick were throws of less than 10 yards down field so I don't know where your whine about 100 throws down field comes from.
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its not cherry picking. its multiple plays during a game, game to game, season to season....that's consistently having the same flaw....and there are more of those...with that said, Dak is one of the better game managers in the game....he doesn't have to win games for cowboys and hasn't really...... just let zeke and defense do it...
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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Give me a hundred throws....lol one thing we do know is he can make them, we defend him from you over the top haters, knowledgeable fans know a young Qbs are going to have growing pains.
he is way behind the curve in learning..this is his 3rd year in the league with the same flaws as you just said he is learning so he has flaws.....he hasn't improved....... he is what he is.... a game manager. a bus driver....nothing wrong with that....don't get offended
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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Please enlighten us with all the things you do in 2/10ths - 3/10ths of a second. Remember Romo took 3 - 4 seconds quite often and spots showsd and still show Romo when he held the ball for 7 and 8 seconds before throwing strikes.
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and you know romo took 3 to 4 second because you had a timer and timed his throws, tracked it and averaged it out!!!!
 

Roadtrip635

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and you know romo took 3 to 4 second because you had a timer and timed his throws, tracked it and averaged it out!!!!


Actually the broadcast would frequently put a stopwatch on the screen to show how much time he had in the pocket. It was a common gripe about Romo, holding the ball too long. Romo was a master at eluding the rush and sometimes that confidence in his ability did cost us in sacks or untimely INTs. Most people marveled at how much time he had to throw, but it made me wonder why he had to wait so often. Guys not getting open and going to scramble drills, defense sitting on routes, slow developing routes. This team's passing philosophy has always been based on slower developing routes versus short, quick passes which is always going to affect time to throw type stats. That was one of the reasons to improve the OL, give Romo time within this system to make those throws.
 

risco

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This might be the best way to look at it. We might be able to win with Dak but he's never going to be that guy that can overcome crap breaking down all around him like other top QBs can and have.
I hope i don't have to witness things breaking down and Dak having to pull off a comeback... I rather take things they way they are now... and be happy with winning.
 

Dre11

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he is way behind the curve in learning..this is his 3rd year in the league with the same flaws as you just said he is learning so he has flaws.....he hasn't improved....... he is what he is.... a game manager. a bus driver....nothing wrong with that....don't get offended

Are you serious with this b's, this is why you fools get called out. His damn rookie season was better than any other rookie ever, he's managed his team in his first 2 3/4 years to a 29-15 record, don't say it was all Zeke, this kid has made plays as well in those 29 wins, when he has time his throws are accurate, he gets his feet set , and he makes the right reads. He came into the league as a 4th rounder. 3 years for a qb is nothing when and have said it could takes up to 6 years for a qb to get it. Your expectations are on par with 1st rounder, yet the wonder not in Philly makes the same damn mistakes. ****.
 

Dre11

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I hope i don't have to witness things breaking down and Dak having to pull off a comeback... I rather take things they way they are now... and be happy with winning.

"Top" ? Is that what you're comparing him to.
 

Dre11

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Actually the broadcast would frequently put a stopwatch on the screen to show how much time he had in the pocket. It was a common gripe about Romo, holding the ball too long. Romo was a master at eluding the rush and sometimes that confidence in his ability did cost us in sacks or untimely INTs. Most people marveled at how much time he had to throw, but it made me wonder why he had to wait so often. Guys not getting open and going to scramble drills, defense sitting on routes, slow developing routes. This team's passing philosophy has always been based on slower developing routes versus short, quick passes which is always going to affect time to throw type stats. That was one of the reasons to improve the OL, give Romo time within this system to make those throws.

Also, Romo said when he retired he was just feeling like he was at the height of his play as a qb . How long was he in the league.
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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Are you serious with this b's, this is why you fools get called out. His damn rookie season was better than any other rookie ever, he's managed his team in his first 2 3/4 years to a 29-15 record, don't say it was all Zeke, this kid has made plays as well in those 29 wins, when he has time his throws are accurate, he gets his feet set , and he makes the right reads. He came into the league as a 4th rounder. 3 years for a qb is nothing when and have said it could takes up to 6 years for a qb to get it. Your expectations are on par with 1st rounder, yet the wonder not in Philly makes the same damn mistakes. ****.
how was his rookie year better than any other rookie ever? he was 20th in passing. the TEAM won 13....so I guess that makes Garrett a genius coach?

and who gives a hoot he came in as a 4th rounder...so did cousin...Brady was a 6th rounder, etc..... at some point if he is a 4th rounder and lacks the skills, then we should go find somebody who is got the skills or can learn it....this is his third year.....3 years for a QB is enough to know what you have..... so do we now have to wait 6 years. waste our time to figure out that oh yeah...this guy is average.... and yes this is all on Zeke. without Zeke day is 3-3..... with zeke this year, when zeke goes for a 100 total yards we are 6-1, wen he doesn't we are 1-4.....dak's been the same average QB regardless ....

my expectations are on par for a QB to show some improvement in his 3rd year instead of making jump ball throws like its a freaking free throw in basketball....
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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Actually the broadcast would frequently put a stopwatch on the screen to show how much time he had in the pocket. It was a common gripe about Romo, holding the ball too long. Romo was a master at eluding the rush and sometimes that confidence in his ability did cost us in sacks or untimely INTs. Most people marveled at how much time he had to throw, but it made me wonder why he had to wait so often. Guys not getting open and going to scramble drills, defense sitting on routes, slow developing routes. This team's passing philosophy has always been based on slower developing routes versus short, quick passes which is always going to affect time to throw type stats. That was one of the reasons to improve the OL, give Romo time within this system to make those throws.
eluding, meaning avoiding sacks, as opposed to pull the ball down and do a reverse pirouette into a defender..... and you still haven't told me how you came up with that average..... a few samples doesn't make an average....
 

Roadtrip635

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eluding, meaning avoiding sacks, as opposed to pull the ball down and do a reverse pirouette into a defender..... and you still haven't told me how you came up with that average..... a few samples doesn't make an average....


I never gave you an average and as far as I'm aware, there were no next gen type stats to throwing time prior to 2016. People like yourself try to make some stats more important, but leave many crucial variables out. The type of scheme, passing system, quality of pass pro and QB style, make a difference in deciphering and trying to put some type of importance to the stats. According to this years NextGen stats all QBs are within a half second of each other. Generally, the QBs with the quickest times are more pocket passers(Brady, Brees, Dalton, Manning etc) and the more mobile QBs have the slowest times(Dak, Wilson, Rodgers, Mahomes, etc), but variables like OL play and scheme still play a part.
https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/stats/passing#average-time-to-throw

Trying to draw a correlation strictly from trying to use time to throw stats will be faulty without taking into account several other variables and the ones that insist that it proves a point is only trying to further an agenda.
 

Dre11

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how was his rookie year better than any other rookie ever? he was 20th in passing. the TEAM won 13....so I guess that makes Garrett a genius coach?

and who gives a hoot he came in as a 4th rounder...so did cousin...Brady was a 6th rounder, etc..... at some point if he is a 4th rounder and lacks the skills, then we should go find somebody who is got the skills or can learn it....this is his third year.....3 years for a QB is enough to know what you have..... so do we now have to wait 6 years. waste our time to figure out that oh yeah...this guy is average.... and yes this is all on Zeke. without Zeke day is 3-3..... with zeke this year, when zeke goes for a 100 total yards we are 6-1, wen he doesn't we are 1-4.....dak's been the same average QB regardless ....

my expectations are on par for a QB to show some improvement in his 3rd year instead of making jump ball throws like its a freaking free throw in basketball....


You are ridiculous, NOBODY CARES ABOUT DAMN PASSING RANKINGS, that tells nothing about a damn qb when offensive philosophies skew them, you want to look at real stats look at his efficiency in 2016, his td to int rate, his completion rate, his overall qb rate in 2017. what freaking jump passes are you talking about, that just shows your ignorance, Rivers throws side arm, who freaking cares. We know what we have Dak in year 3, he's a leader, can manage games to win, can make plays to win games, none of that is more clearer than his 2 minute work, so I guess it was all Emmitt and Irvin in Aikman's era too, because when they were gone Aikman was crap.
 

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Dre11

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Gee how is that different than those that cherry pick plays to whine about Prescott. People bring up those things to show that he's not as bad as the Prescott haters TRY to paint him. BTW, just about all players need improvements at something so admitting that isn't wrong. One last thing, the almost pick and the actual pick were throws of less than 10 yards down field so I don't know where your whine about 100 throws down field comes from.
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This dude is qb ignorance is beyond ridiculous
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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You are ridiculous, NOBODY CARES ABOUT DAMN PASSING RANKINGS, that tells nothing about a damn qb when offensive philosophies skew them, you want to look at real stats look at his efficiency in 2016, his td to int rate, his completion rate, his overall qb rate in 2017. what freaking jump passes are you talking about, that just shows your ignorance, Rivers throws side arm, who freaking cares. We know what we have Dak in year 3, he's a leader, can manage games to win, can make plays to win games, none of that is more clearer than his 2 minute work, so I guess it was all Emmitt and Irvin in Aikman's era too, because when they were gone Aikman was crap.
and you have to balance that with yards, pass attempts, etc. as I have repeatedly mentioned, Dak is not a big passer. he is a game manager, expected not to Make mistakes, we don't need him to make big plays. all the stats you outlined matches with that and the total yards further cement that analysis....and the damn QB rating is absolute non-sense at times that Dak lovers use to pump him up....

Grapolo had a better rating than dan and completed 68% of his passes.....he only threw 63. Brees rating was lower, but he threw for 5000 yards.compared to Dak's 3600. which means they were passing more, going down field more and taking more risks and asking the QB to make plays on offense....dak was 23rd in pass attempts.....which tells me they didn't expect him to be the offensive focus. Brees had a lower rating than Dak, no idiot in their right mind would take Dak over Brees. same with Rodgers, Rothlisberger

Rodgers had a lower rating than Dak, but he had 150 more attempts, which is about 10 attempts per game.....which tells me they ask Rodgers to throw more and they run the offense through Rodgers.

you are pretty deaf I think. its been said including by me, that Dak has leadership skills. has desire. has heart. but his skills lack. you even say that yourself....you want to give him another 5 years to grow....I don't think he will be much better skill wise than he is now.. is been the same since his college days......not sure what your personal man crush is on Dak, given in the process you have trashed Brady, Aikman, Rodgers, Brees, Rothlisberger and other top QBs....

now, listen and listen carefully. can we win with Dak? yes. we need to surround him with very strong players, great OL, great RB, great WRs, great TE and ask him to just manage the game and he is really good at that. that would make our offense good. Give me a passing QB and with all those resources our offense would be elite.....we can't put the offense on Dak's shoulder and ask him to throw 40 times a game. when we have , we simply failed.....

and get this through you thick skull...this offense runs through Zeke. when Zeke was out, Dak went 3-3, with Zeke 6-4. this year when zeke goes over 100 total yards, we are 6-1. when he doesn't we are 1-4. everything else being the same....... its that simple.....

in your mind and other Dak lovers, if we don't stand up and shout and clap and scream from top of our lungs that Dak is great, you all get offended. you get offended and angry when we say he is a game manager and his skills are limited. you want everyone to fawn over his 24-28 for only freaking 250 yards, 30 yards below season average against Saints defense and a whopping I mean whopping 13 points.....

sorry, I just don't see what all the fuss is about......he is the QB of my favorite team...I support him. I root for him, but I also see him for what he is. with that said, there are no other QB options at this time. if there was I would drop his arse in a NY minute and not look back. for now he is all we got.
 

CowboysFaninHouston

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I never gave you an average and as far as I'm aware, there were no next gen type stats to throwing time prior to 2016. People like yourself try to make some stats more important, but leave many crucial variables out. The type of scheme, passing system, quality of pass pro and QB style, make a difference in deciphering and trying to put some type of importance to the stats. According to this years NextGen stats all QBs are within a half second of each other. Generally, the QBs with the quickest times are more pocket passers(Brady, Brees, Dalton, Manning etc) and the more mobile QBs have the slowest times(Dak, Wilson, Rodgers, Mahomes, etc), but variables like OL play and scheme still play a part.
https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/stats/passing#average-time-to-throw

Trying to draw a correlation strictly from trying to use time to throw stats will be faulty without taking into account several other variables and the ones that insist that it proves a point is only trying to further an agenda.
I don't deny that looking at a single stat is misleading and you have to take everything into account. but to simply state Dak has no time, when his average time to throw this year is 3rd highest, is absurd.... what he is not getting is the 4 or 5 or 6 seconds he had in 2016. He is not good anticipating. he is not good in reading defenses. he is not very accurate. so having him make quick throws is not his forte..... he needs time, less pressure and survey the field and all WR to fully run through their routes be open before he throws.....2016 he had that and he managed. even then no one asked him to throw much as he was 23rd in the league in pass attempts....even this year he is `7th and mostly because we have been behind in games earlier in the year and forced to throw in the 4th quarter....he is just not a 35 to 45 pass attempt per game type QB....,

now, as you sy you observed, Romo held for too long, moved around and wanted to make plays down field...its obvious that Dak hold on too long, doesn't move around the pocket and pulls the ball too much. when he has had to make quick throws, his fundamentals have been scary bad.....he is slow processing/progression type QB and needs a very strong OL to succeed. IMO, he is better suited to WCO, and getting him on the move where he is more comfortable throwing would probably help him
 
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