Percy's Stats on Dak

[khiladi]

And again, nobody has defined what constitutes pressure..

 

[xwalker]

Frame rate is useless as far as determine the ball in a QBs hand that doesn’t even come on the screen.

Players are tracked if I read correctly every 15 seconds..

I doubt they are being used to track release times of QBs, even if we assume ‘integrity of data’ in other areas that it’s used for, otherwise they would be using it to confirm whether the ball crossed the plane:

https://www.___GET_REAL_URL___/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/13382443



Thus is not like looking at the yardage a RB averages and charting that. This is a ball in a QBs hands down to microseconds..

They weren’t even sharing certain data as if 2016:

https://www.___GET_REAL_URL___/s/www.wired.com/2016/01/the-nfls-impending-data-revolution/amp

The coaches film shows the QB from snap to release.

Ball velocity would require sensor updates much faster than 15 seconds.

 

[khiladi]

The coaches film shows the QB from snap to release.

Ball velocity would require sensor updates much faster than 15 seconds.

Do you have access to this coaches film?

Ball velocity can more accurately be captured simply by charting distance a ball was thrown. Even a 5 yard throw is not the same thing as ‘inches’.

And that’s even if we assume ‘integrityof data like I said, with all the moving parts on a football field..

 

[xwalker]

Do you have access to this coaches film?

Ball velocity can more accurately be captured simply by charting distance a ball was thrown. Even a 5 yard throw is not the same thing as ‘inches’.

And that’s even if we assume ‘integrityof data like I said, with all the moving parts on a football field..

Yes, the coaches film is available with an NFL Gamepass account.

It has two views (All-22 and one focused on the Line and QB).

 

[khiladi]

Yes, the coaches film is available with an NFL Gamepass account.

It has two views (All-22 and one focused on the Line and QB).

And, does it show his hands?

The fact that your making analogies with ball velocity thrown over distances makes me question reliability of certain facts being relayed..

 

[khiladi]

What were his stats last week? This week? Next week?

Protecting the QB is why LT is considered a franchise position and RT is no where near that.

Dak didn’t get injured with his LT out nor have you proven he even got injured because of the LT.. Your argument makes no sense..

 

[khiladi]

And as I said, none of these stats regarding ‘pressure’ versus ‘non-pressure’ are normalized for pass attempts.

Dak throws a hell of a lot less than a lot of these other QBs so a single pass ‘successfully’ under what they qualify as pressure would jump his percentage up way more significantly than than a QB that throws the ball more.

Another interesting stat would be how many INTs he threw versus pressure this year and against it. He had like four pick 6s that I remember off the top of my head where there was no pressure. So his unsuccessful attempts would be more disastrous than another.

 

[xwalker]

And as I said, none of these stats regarding ‘pressure’ versus ‘non-pressure’ are normalized for pass attempts.

Dak throws a hell of a lot less than a lot of these other QBs so a single pass ‘successfully’ under what they qualify as pressure would jump his percentage up way more significantly than than a QB that throws the ball more.

Another interesting stat would be how many INTs he threw versus pressure this year and against it. He had like four pick 6s that I remember off the top of my head where there was no pressure. So his unsuccessful attempts would be more disastrous than another.

It's 40% of pass attempts, not 40% of all snaps.

 

[percyhoward]

And again, nobody has defined what constitutes pressure..

"Pressured dropbacks" are those that result in a hurry, a hit, or a sack.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

It's 40% of pass attempts, not 40% of all snaps.

Nor does it identify who is responsible for the pressure. The QB or the blocking.

 

[percyhoward]

And as I said, none of these stats regarding ‘pressure’ versus ‘non-pressure’ are normalized for pass attempts.

Dak throws a hell of a lot less than a lot of these other QBs so a single pass ‘successfully’ under what they qualify as pressure would jump his percentage up way more significantly than than a QB that throws the ball more.

Dak has over 600 career attempts in games when he's pressured on less than 40% of his dropbacks.

 

[xwalker]

And, does it show his hands?

The fact that your making analogies with ball velocity thrown over distances makes me question reliability of certain facts being relayed..

The coaches film shows everything about the QB.

The ball velocity would be if they use sensor data. It's not related to the film method.

Getting the times from the film is a very simple concept and is probably accurate to 100th of a second but the times are just listed to an accuracy of 1/10th of a second. Hand timed forty yard dashes are timed to 100th of a second.

 

[xwalker]

Nor does it identify who is responsible for the pressure. The QB or the blocking.

How is that relevant to the discussion?

Dak is great with less than 40% pressure regardless of who is at fault for the pressure.

 

[xwalker]

Do you have access to this coaches film?

Ball velocity can more accurately be captured simply by charting distance a ball was thrown. Even a 5 yard throw is not the same thing as ‘inches’.

And that’s even if we assume ‘integrityof data like I said, with all the moving parts on a football field..

It would have to be timed accurately regardless of whether it is average velocity (time over the total distance) or if the velocity is calculated dynamically such that you determine the peak velocity.

 

[khiladi]

It would have to be timed accurately regardless of whether it is average velocity (time over the total distance) or if the velocity is calculated dynamically such that you determine the peak velocity.

I said even if we assume that ball velocity is accurate, it’s not even close to ball release measurements and 3.6 versus 3.1 or 3.2 as regards ‘pressure’ is statistically meaningless..

 

[khiladi]

The coaches film shows everything about the QB.

The ball velocity would be if they use sensor data. It's not related to the film method.

Getting the times from the film is a very simple concept and is probably accurate to 100th of a second but the times are just listed to an accuracy of 1/10th of a second. Hand timed forty yard dashes are timed to 100th of a second.

You are clearly confusing the two, because you brought up ball sensors to argue that it was possible to determine ball velocity.

And if your taking about film capture, no way the release of the ball leaving the hands can be measured accurately given all the variables. And no way do they capture ‘everything’.

We watch replays all the time..

Just stop with the obfuscation....

 

[Toruk_Makto]

How is that relevant to the discussion?

Dak is great with less than 40% pressure regardless of who is at fault for the pressure.

Because a QB who gets the ball out quickly isn't pressured as often. But to get the ball out quickly you need to be able to adjust the playcall, protection, see the play as it develops, quickly process where to go with the ball based on a 100 variables post snap and then deliver the ball accurately and with appropriate velocity. If Dak can't consistently do this unless he has impeccable blocking....well that's a problem and you don't have a franchise QB.

 

[khiladi]

"Pressured dropbacks" are those that result in a hurry, a hit, or a sack.

Which can be a result if a QB running toward a defender because of horrible pocket presence. It could be because the QB held it but had an open receiver downfield.

and a QB hurrying could be because he imagined a defender running at him.. so what qualifies as hurried? How many feet away from the QB?

Who determines pressure?

That’s not defining pressure that is defining the ‘end result’ of what one may call pressure, but it doesn’t prove there was ‘true pressure’ in the first place..

 

[xwalker]

Because a QB who gets the ball out quickly isn't pressured as often. But to get the ball out quickly you need to be able to adjust the playcall, protection, see the play as it develops, quickly process where to go with the ball based on a 100 variables post snap and then deliver the ball accurately and with appropriate velocity. If Dak can't consistently do this unless he has impeccable blocking....well that's a problem and you don't have a franchise QB.

He did it last season.

Regardless the pressure stats based on more or less than 40% shows that he has the physical ability to be really good but must improve in regards to being affected by pressure.

If part of the reason for pressure is from holding the ball too long or other QB related issues then that's what he needs to focus on. That is much different than people that claim he can't make the throws or needs to completely rework his mechanics.

Percy posted some info about how long he holds the ball and I don't think there was any indication of that being a problem.

 

[percyhoward]

Which can be a result if a QB running toward a defender because of horrible pocket presence. It could be because the QB held it but had an open receiver downfield.

and a QB hurrying could be because he imagined a defender running at him.. so what qualifies as hurried? How many feet away from the QB?

Who determines pressure?

That’s not defining pressure that is defining the ‘end result’ of what one may call pressure, but it doesn’t prove there was ‘true pressure’ in the first place..

OK.