PFT: High-level source says NFL believes Vick is guilty

[juck]

It is hilarious.

"Some of us have accidently stepped on ants or breathed in gnats...."

C'mon.

How is that NOT funny?

Ants? Are you kidding me? Gnats?

I am talking about the fact that it makes u hungry.

 

[AbeBeta]

BS, that is how they make themselves irrelevant by taking extreme stances that even many of their own members do not agree with. I know many folks who were supporters of the NRA but because of some extreme views they no longer want to be part of it. They believe in what the group initially stood for but no longer side with the organization on many issues

You believe that. Activists and examples of effective activism say otherwise.

Every organization does things that members disagree with. Tell me, do you belong to a political party? Do you believe in every last stance that your party takes? Or is it the case that you like most of what your party does but wish a few things would change?

 

[burmafrd]

Ya gotta take the good with the bad

 

[Green28]

he's trash...always has been, always will be...

David

As a UVA graduate, I always love to hear Hokie bashing!

 

[Green28]

Wow. I continue to be amazed that people take what the NY Times says on occassion as the gospel truth. But Pro Football Times ? Are you people nuts ?

Talk radio said... Did you actually say that before you typed it out ?

Here's a tip for you - advertising is aimed at the average person, and the average person has no idea about Mike Vick and dogfighting. Generally speaking, if you don't already hold an opinon that Vick "has always been garbage", then you probably aren't even AWARE of this.

As far as any suspension goes, it will not be when (IF) he is indicted. I mean think about it. First of all, the PA is not going to allow an open ended suspension based on an indictment without a challenge, nor should they when one of the possible outcomes is official exoneration. How bad would the NFL look suspending a player indefinitely and then having them found not guilty ? The NFL is not going to take action until the case is adjudicated, and the the outcome of the case will most definitely impact the action the NFL can and will take.

I am just shocked at the myopia some people are suffering from.

NFL Security is closely following the investigation along with the prosecution. If there is enough evidence for an indictment, I'm sure the NFL will closely follow with an 8-16 game suspension. See Adam Jones.

 

[Concord]

Again -- they aren't spearheading the issue. You don't see them in the press everyday pursuing the issue -- that statement is from OVER a month ago. That's hardly "PETA up in arms" about an issue.

By making this a "PETA issue" it make it far easier for folks to say "oh, them PETAs -- they crazy, they don't want me to eat no hamburger" rather than focusing on the fact that Vick is potentially subject to multiple felony charges.

Exactly. They are talking about it. And want something done about it...Duh.

Of course they're going to want something done about it...After all they are The People For Ethical Treatment of Animals. Dog fighting is against everything they stand for.

But the Truth is when PETA wants to spearhead a issue...you will know beyond a shadow of a doubt that they are the one spearheading it.

PETA is hardly the only ones coming out against this. As we have seen on this board alone.

 

[Doomsday101]

You believe that. Activists and examples of effective activism say otherwise.

Every organization does things that members disagree with. Tell me, do you belong to a political party? Do you believe in every last stance that your party takes? Or is it the case that you like most of what your party does but wish a few things would change?

And the political parties do lose support when people are opposed to issues. People will change sides if they feel their party no longer represent what they believe in or choose not to vote at all which is a pretty large number in this country today. Same for the activist groups, when you start fighting battles that your members do not believe in you start to see a decline in membership and support including funding

 

[AbeBeta]

And the political parties do lose support when people are opposed to issues. People will change sides if they feel their party no longer represent what they believe in or choose not to vote at all which is a pretty large number in this country today. Same for the activist groups, when you start fighting battles that your members do not believe in you start to see a decline in membership and support including funding

But as you've argued that members don't support those issues -- seems clear to me that PETA is probably stronger today and more influential that in has ever been. Do people leave organizations? Sure. That happens all the time. Do others stay because they see the organization as being highly effective, even if they disagree with some of the stands the organization takes -- absolutely -- and that's likely the far larger group.

 

[fortdick]

I really question the idea that you have to start out extreme; I think its better to start out with what you want and stick to it. That way you can say to your supporters that you did not compromise; and to your opponents you say the same thing. Regarding the NRA and armor piercing bulletts- I totally agree that they screwed up there. They seem to forget that the media regards them as evil and will always paint them as the bad guys- therefore they need to show more restraint there and yet at the same time make no compromises on the important areas- which armor piercing bullets is NOT one of.

Armour piercing bullets should be legal for self defense. If someone breaks in and wants to hurt my family, I want to be able to stop him. Even if he is wearing body armour.

Besides, the right to keep and bear arms is a guarantee to all Americans to protect us from the government. Armour peircing bullets are necessary for that purpose.

Read the Circut Court ruling in U.S. v. Emerson.

 

[Doomsday101]

But as you've argued that members don't support those issues -- seems clear to me that PETA is probably stronger today and more influential that in has ever been. Do people leave organizations? Sure. That happens all the time. Do others stay because they see the organization as being highly effective, even if they disagree with some of the stands the organization takes -- absolutely -- and that's likely the far larger group.

People will fight for issue they believe in what people will get turned off by is dealing with issues they do not believe in or extreme views that go against their own belief. I'm not member of PETA but I stand with them on issues like this as do many people. Organization like NOW is not as strong as they once where and the membership not as it was in the past as many women do not agree with certain extreme view point. The NRA has alienated many members by their extreme views and that organization is losing these members.

 

[L-O-Jete]

Armour piercing bullets should be legal for self defense. If someone breaks in and wants to hurt my family, I want to be able to stop him. Even if he is wearing body armour.

Besides, the right to keep and bear arms is a guarantee to all Americans to protect us from the government. Armour peircing bullets are necessary for that purpose.

Read the Circut Court ruling in U.S. v. Emerson.

I'm really looking for that sarcasm smiley somewhere...

 

[fortdick]

I'm really looking for that sarcasm smiley somewhere...

Nope. Serious on this one. Everyone has a hot button topic, mine is gun control. They can have every registered gun I have. But they best watch their backs walking away with 'em!

I don't trust the government. And, no, I don't belong to any militias.

Again, read the appeals court decision in Emerson. Best explanation of the 2nd Amendment I ever read.

 

[tunahelper]

POSTED 11:30 p.m. EDT; UPDATED 11:59 p.m. EDT, May 30, 2007

HIGH-LEVEL SOURCE SAYS NFL BELIEVES VICK IS GUILTY

A source with direct involvement in league management issues tells us that the NFL believes that Michael Vick had full knowledge of and involvement in the dog-fighting operation discovered last month at his property in Virginia.

Let's repeat that one.

A source with direct involvement in league management issues tells us that the NFL believes that Michael Vick had full knowledge of and involvement in the dog-fighting operation discovered last month at his property in Virginia.

Per the source, NFL Security has been investigating the situation actively, and the information that NFL Security has obtained has resulted in a belief at the upper reaches of the organization that Vick's past denial is untrue.

Another source with knowledge of the situation confirms that, at last week's ownership meetings in Nashville, discussions regarding conversations with NFL Security indicated the league's belief that the evidence points to a conclusion that Vick was actively involved in dogs fighting.

This disclosure explains a lot of things, in our view. It was after last week's ownership meetings that rumors percolated through the league that the Falcons are bracing for a suspension of Vick. It was also after these meetings that reports surfaced of NFL Security's offer of assistance to Surry County, Virginia investigators. And it was after these meetings that ESPN jumped into the fray with a fat-guy cannonball, airing claims from a witness with a shielded face and altered voice who says that Vick is a dog-fighting "heavyweight."

We still don't know whether Vick will ever be convicted. His wealth can purchase the best legal talent in the land, and it's not all that hard to weave reasonable doubt into any set of facts. But the irreparable damage to Vick's football career will be done the moment that charges are filed. We firmly believe that, once indicted, he promptly will be suspended, and the Falcons will eventually cut him.

Since the Raiders have drafted their quarterback of the future, the one team who might be interested in giving him a second chance would have no need for him.

Even if Vick somehow avoids an indictment, his marketability is now shot, and his image is forever tarnished. Plus, his decision to remain silent in the face of day after day of damaging revelations has put his reputation, we believe, beyond the point of no return.

In fact, Vick's best bet at this point might be to cop a plea, testify against others, enter rehab for whatever condition he says contributed to any antisocial behavior to which he admits, and then hope for redemption.

I would love to see this scum bag erased from the earth!

 

[NeonNinja]

Vick deserves to be put in jail and never see the field again. I would literally kill for my dogs if a situation called for it.

 

[AbeBeta]

People will fight for issue they believe in what people will get turned off by is dealing with issues they do not believe in or extreme views that go against their own belief. I'm not member of PETA but I stand with them on issues like this as do many people. Organization like NOW is not as strong as they once where and the membership not as it was in the past as many women do not agree with certain extreme view point. The NRA has alienated many members by their extreme views and that organization is losing these members.

The NRA didn't change stances -- the world changed around them. You can directly track the downturn in NRA membership to events like Columbine. That isn't the organization getting more extreme, it is the country changing.

NOW is still a very powerful organization -- that organization has been less prominent b/c lawmakers for a long time were sympathetic with many of NOW's core issues -- again, world changed, not the organization.

 

[TNCowboy]

I may be wrong, but I think I read that NRA membership is up 1.5 million from a decade ago. If so, they certainly aren't losing members.

 

[fortdick]

I may be wrong, but I think I read that NRA membership is up 1.5 million from a decade ago. If so, they certainly aren't losing members.

NRA membership went sky high after the 1994 mid terms. The Dems ran on strong gun control platform and lost both house in a landslide. The NRA has been strong ever since.

 

[L-O-Jete]

Nope. Serious on this one. Everyone has a hot button topic, mine is gun control. They can have every registered gun I have. But they best watch their backs walking away with 'em!

I don't trust the government. And, no, I don't belong to any militias.

Again, read the appeals court decision in Emerson. Best explanation of the 2nd Amendment I ever read.

So you really think you need armour piercing bullets and automatic weapons, in the odd chance your goverment decides to what "invade" your house, and if so that would allow you to stop them from it? And this outweighs keeping them off the streets and hands of the mass killers, druglords et al?

 

[TNCowboy]

So you really think you need armour piercing bullets and automatic weapons, in the odd chance your goverment decides to what "invade" your house, and if so that would allow you to stop them from it? And this outweighs keeping them off the streets and hands of the mass killers, druglords et al?

I don't think any law will keep a "druglord" from getting armor piercing ammo....but that's just a guess.

 

[AbeBeta]

I don't think any law will keep a "druglord" from getting armor piercing ammo....but that's just a guess.

Less market = less product = less material produced = even less product.....

but that's just a guess based on economic theory