Prescott drops to 7th highest paid QB

[MountaineerCowboy]

He was. No denying at times he was bad last year. I’m just stuck trying to figure out if the first half of the season him or the later half….hopefully his first priority is getting healthy this offseason..

Imagine being "stuck trying to figure out" if 2021 first 6 games is the "real Dak" over the other 78 game sample size we have from Dak.

Go find me another 6 game stretch like the first 6 games of 2021 in Dak's career. You can't do it. Because it's an anomaly. It's an outlier. It's a mirage.

Do you think Tampa Bay fans are wondering if the first 3 games of 2017 for Ryan Fitzpatrick is the real Ryan Fitzpatrick? When he threw for over 400 yards all 3 games and had 11 TD passes to boot.

No, they're not. Because they're not delusional and willfully blind.

You admittingly are confused at what the real Dak is when we have SIX SEASONS worth of evidence. Instead, you chose to focus on the 6 game outlier that he has NEVER been able to reproduce in his entire career.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Not winning a Super Bowl with a 40 million a year QB or not winning a Super Bowl with a 5 million a year QB?

I know which one I'd take.

I'd take that one that will give us the higher draft pick and use that to draft an actual 1st round talent at QB instead of wasting time on these undrafted/4th round QBs like we have for about 15 straight years now.

You seem to have forgotten the 2000 - 2006 years.

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

You seem to have forgotten the 2000 - 2006 years.

We've made the playoffs 6 times since 2006. That's it. 6 times out of 16 which is 37.5% of the time.

We made the playoffs 2 times between 2000-2006 which is 33.3% of the time.

There is not enough of a difference there to act like we're somehow doing something better now.. The Romo and Dak years are not as great as you guys like to pretend they are. They are just 4.2% better than when we had Quincy Carter and Chad Hutchinson.

The last 1st round QB we took was Troy Aikman. It's time to start taking the most important position on the team seriously again.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

We've made the playoffs 6 times since 2006. That's it. 6 times out of 16 which is 37.5% of the time.

We made the playoffs 2 times between 2000-2006 which is 33.3% of the time.

There is not enough of a difference there to act like we're somehow doing something better now.. The Romo and Dak years are not as great as you guys like to pretend they are. They are just 4.2% better than when we had Quincy Carter and Chad Hutchinson.

The last 1st round QB we took was Troy Aikman. It's time to start taking the most important position on the team seriously again.

Yes, we made it in 2003 and 2006. 2006 mainly because Parcells and Sean Payton turned Romo from an undrafted QB that nobody had heard of into a very good QB who turned us into a bit of a Cinderella story that year. However, before that, with the exception of 2003, we were a bit hopeless. Especially the 3 5-11 years. I don't want to go back to the 5-11 days. Now, what would be smart is next year, if nothing urgent happens, is take a 1st round QB and let the QB sit for a couple seasons. If Dak is still going to stay after 2024, then trade that QB for extra 1sts.

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

Yes, we made it in 2003 and 2006. 2006 mainly because Parcells and Sean Payton turned Romo from an undrafted QB that nobody had heard of into a very good QB who turned us into a bit of a Cinderella story that year. However, before that, with the exception of 2003, we were a bit hopeless. Especially the 3 5-11 years. I don't want to go back to the 5-11 days.

I'd go back to the 5-11 days right now if I knew we'd be trying to get the next Burrow, Allen, Mahomes, or Herbert instead of wasting on time on QBs.

I'd be happy signing or trading for a real QB also.

Just because a low drafted/undrafted QB overachieved does not mean you found the next Tom Brady and you should hitch your wagons to him. Tom Brady is the outlier.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

I'd go back to the 5-11 days right now if I knew we'd be trying to get the next Burrow, Allen, Mahomes, or Herbert instead of wasting on time on QBs.

I'd be happy signing or trading for a real QB also.

Just because a low drafted/undrafted QB overachieved does not mean you found the next Tom Brady and you should hitch your wagons to him. Tom Brady is the outlier.

I wouldn't want to do 3 straight years of that again. That was torment for me as that was when I was starting my time as a Cowboys fan. I think we have a very good QB in Dak. Sure, he's not Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady, but I think we are fine with him for now. And I've already discussed with you ad nauseam why I think we extended Dak. What I'd do is, if we don't do better than the divisional round, if the QB talent in the draft is good, and if there are no other urgently pressing needs, then I'd probably take a 1st round QB next year and let the QB learn for a couple years behind Dak. As I've said at length on this thread, there's no reason to starts a rookie QB if you don't have to do so. Say 2 years later when Dak's contract expires, you evaluate where things stand. If we're looking good with Dak to the point where the FO wants to resign him, then you trade the QB to try and obtain extra 1sts. If we're not much better off than where we were prior with Dak, then you let Dak walk, collect what'd likely be a high comp pick, and you go with the QB you've developed. Meanwhile, the oline should be better if we go o line this year and the year after we take that other QB. In essence, we'd let that other QB get the Aaron Rodgers treatment behind Favre. You know you have a really good QB in the wings. You're just developing him behind a veteran QB and making sure he's ready.

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

I wouldn't want to do 3 straight years of that again. That was torment for me as that was when I was starting my time as a Cowboys fan. I think we have a very good QB in Dak. Sure, he's not Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady, but I think we are fine with him for now. And I've already discussed with you ad nauseam why I think we extended Dak. What I'd do is, if we don't do better than the divisional round, if the QB talent in the draft is good, and if there are no other urgently pressing needs, then I'd probably take a 1st round QB next year and let the QB learn for a couple years behind Dak. As I've said at length on this thread, there's no reason to starts a rookie QB if you don't have to do so. Say 2 years later when Dak's contract expires, you evaluate where things stand. If we're looking good with Dak to the point where the FO wants to resign him, then you trade the QB to try and obtain extra 1sts. If we're not much better off than where we were prior with Dak, then you let Dak walk, collect what'd likely be a high comp pick, and you go with the QB you've developed. Meanwhile, the oline should be better if we go o line this year and the year after we take that other QB. In essence, we'd let that other QB get the Aaron Rodgers treatment behind Favre. You know you have a really good QB in the wings. You're just developing him behind a veteran QB and making sure he's ready.

I'm on board with this.

My hope is that we draft a QB in the 1st round in the next couple of years that can learn for a year or 2 and then take over. Because we're stuck with Dak for now.

My worry is that our FO is clueless and will continue trying to build things around Dak because of stubbornness and not focus on improving at the QB position.

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

I'm on board with this.

My hope is that we draft a QB in the 1st round in the next couple of years that can learn for a year or 2 and then take over. Because we're stuck with Dak for now.

My worry is that our FO is clueless and will continue trying to build things around Dak because of stubbornness and not focus on improving at the QB position.

That would be my plan if I were in Jerry's position. Cuz I like Dak. However, the reason I supported Dak's extension was because of the mess we had and that Dak gave us the best chance to win while we build areas. However, it also buys us time to find a 1st round QB, especially in a year like this where QBs are awful in the draft. So, giving a 1st round pick next year the Aaron Rodgers treatment would be a good idea if the talent next year is good. If the talent is like this year's, then you draft online next year as well and take a QB the year after. Gives the QB 1 year, maybe 2 if you tag Dak after this contract to try to buy a bit of extra time.

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

That would be my plan if I were in Jerry's position. Cuz I like Dak. However, the reason I supported Dak's extension was because of the mess we had and that Dak gave us the best chance to win while we build areas. However, it also buys us time to find a 1st round QB, especially in a year like this where QBs are awful in the draft. So, giving a 1st round pick next year the Aaron Rodgers treatment would be a good idea if the talent next year is good. If the talent is like this year's, then you draft online next year as well and take a QB the year after. Gives the QB 1 year, maybe 2 if you tag Dak after this contract to try to buy a bit of extra time.

Yes, exactly, and if that 1st round pick isn't panning out don't waste time on him either. You move on, try again, make a trade, or sign someone in FA. You don't stick with them just because you drafted them. That's the problem with Jerry. He gets too attached to guys.

 

[RonnieT24]

They got clear boosts from grades of Martin and Tyron. Two good linemen doesn’t make you a great unit.

Yeah the grades for the individuals don't add up to the performance of the unit at all. I have always maintained that PFF is flat out guessing on the grades anyway... and always will. They have no idea what a guy's assignment is on a given play so how in the hell can the accurately assess whether they carried it out or not. The short answer is they can't so paying attention to their grades is a fool's errand.

Still I have often wondered why we don't put Tyron and Zack on the same side. That would give us at least one side of the ball we could always run behind. It would be like having Nate and Tooey back in the day. Defenses would have to counter it by overloading that side.. which means an intelligent OC would simply devise plays to take advantage of that by incorporating misdirection and cutbacks to the side which the defense leaves light. Force them to pick their poison.. Play it straight against two all pros and get mauled or overload against them at let the Cowboys eat on the other side. Either way we win. The only way to lose is to spread them apart and be just okay on both sides..

 

[RustyBourneHorse]

Yes, exactly, and if that 1st round pick isn't panning out don't waste time on him either. You move on, try again, make a trade, or sign someone in FA. You don't stick with them just because you drafted them. That's the problem with Jerry. He gets too attached to guys.

Well, and that's why I'd let the QB learn as well behind Dak. We have a ready made veteran QB. If the QB isn't developing like you want, it's why I'd say then trade that QB, extend Dak for say a 3 year deal after that and take a QB. Why 3 years? Because you usually know in 3 years what you have in a QB. Or, if you decide that you also don't want Dak, then maybe find a Ryan Fitzpatrick at that time. It's why I now understand why Parcells brought in Drew Bledsoe. He was here to buy time for Romo so that, in 2006, we'd be able to know if Romo was ready and we could put him in.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Please do tell.......man I'm excited to find out all his glorious accomplishments.
Please post all his playoff wins and Superbowl wins????
Can't wait......

Just one thing though....

Pappy, pappy, pappy. there is a difference between performance and accomplishments. Marino performed highly, HOFer, never won a superbowl, only appeared in one.
On the other Side Dilfer never performed well, but he won a superbowl.

so are you now saying QB Play = Wins....and that's how you will measure a QB?

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Fear not! Jerry will extend him for 10 years and make him the first billion dollar QB.

we are half way there in the NFL for a Billion dollar QB......salaries are reaching ridiculous levels

 

[G2]

He was. No denying at times he was bad last year. I’m just stuck trying to figure out if the first half of the season him or the later half….hopefully his first priority is getting healthy this offseason..

I look at the entire offense specifically, you could ask the same question about every position.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Realistically he didn't really "feature" Zeke. He kept him in the line up as a 6th offensive lineman basically. I don't think Zeke even got to 15 carries over the last 10 games did he? But we can all agree he should not have been playing. I can't even say for sure it was Moore's decision but whomever made that decision needs to be taken to task for it. Zeke was hurt and needed to sit 3-4 weeks (maybe more) to heal up to where he could get back close to the level he was playing at before he got hurt. When they kept telling us that "he can't do anymore damage to it" they were outright lying because unless the ligament was completely torn you can ALWAYS do more damage if only making the tear bigger. In fact if it WAS completely torn then that places more stress on the other ligaments and you run the risk of turning one torn ligament into 2 or 3 and maybe ending that kid's career. It still angers me how they handled that.

Still when I try and reconcile the offensive "rankings" against what we see on the field something doesn't add up.. Clearly the offense has gone up several notches since Moore took over in several statistical categories. But how much of that is the once inexperienced QB simply improving his mastery of the craft a little more? How much of it is great players doing great things vs scheme? Lots of experts talk about how Moore does not appear to have a plan in his play calling. Most of the big plays come as a result of a guy doing something amazing more so than a great play design getting a back to the second level untouched or a receiver running butt nekked wide open in the secondary. And how "great" was Moore's offense in 2020 after the triggerman went down? I know there is no one answer to any of these questions but obviously we need answers if we don't want to see the offense stumble over the second half of the season again. It happened in 2019.. and in 2020.. and aside from beating up on NFC rivals in disarray, in 2021.. Something has to give.

that is very true. I think the coaches were aware of our OL problems, thus Zeke was the 6th blocker in passing game. that explains a lot about his reduced target and reception rates compared to previous years.

 

[PAPPYDOG]

Pappy, pappy, pappy. there is a difference between performance and accomplishments. Marino performed highly, HOFer, never won a superbowl, only appeared in one.
On the other Side Dilfer never performed well, but he won a superbowl.

so are you now saying QB Play = Wins....and that's how you will measure a QB?

Yes, I apologize as when I see Dak back in the pocket I swear it's Dan Marino!!!

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Yeah the grades for the individuals don't add up to the performance of the unit at all. I have always maintained that PFF is flat out guessing on the grades anyway... and always will. They have no idea what a guy's assignment is on a given play so how in the hell can the accurately assess whether they carried it out or not. The short answer is they can't so paying attention to their grades is a fool's errand.

Still I have often wondered why we don't put Tyron and Zack on the same side. That would give us at least one side of the ball we could always run behind. It would be like having Nate and Tooey back in the day. Defenses would have to counter it by overloading that side.. which means an intelligent OC would simply devise plays to take advantage of that by incorporating misdirection and cutbacks to the side which the defense leaves light. Force them to pick their poison.. Play it straight against two all pros and get mauled or overload against them at let the Cowboys eat on the other side. Either way we win. The only way to lose is to spread them apart and be just okay on both sides..

very true. more than any other unit, the OL is measured as a unit, either it all works, or it doesn't. a single weak link just breaks it apart. all other groups, perform individually and measured individually and they don't impact each other's performance as a group, including the DL. yes, there are always schemes, plans and players have to carry it out, but one individual excelling in their role will help the entire group, but on the OL, one individual excelling and one failing, leads to group failing.

 

[SteveTheCowboy]

well folloing the illogic of a few here last year and as they argue, ...he was second highest paid QB last year and expectations were to be elite. now he is 7th paid (as predicted it would drop) and no longer in elite paid category, should expectations be for not elite level play.

I am sure everyone will say 160M is elite no matter what (moving goal post and changing logic of argument).....

Disclaimer: this doesn't mean I am saying its ok to play bad. this doesn't mean I think he is any good or not good. this doesn't mean I don't expect him to play well. the intent is to only follow up on the logic that was presented by many last year.

It could be you are the one moving goal posts.
The expectations versus salary remain the same from the signing of contract to the end if it.
Unless you want to move the goal post based on following contracts of other players. And you know full well these contracts continously inflate. Your just using....abusing it for confrontation.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

Yes, I apologize as when I see Dak back in the pocket I swear it's Dan Marino!!!

huh?

you are sometimes so confusing.

 

[G2]

Yeah the grades for the individuals don't add up to the performance of the unit at all. I have always maintained that PFF is flat out guessing on the grades anyway... and always will. They have no idea what a guy's assignment is on a given play so how in the hell can the accurately assess whether they carried it out or not. The short answer is they can't so paying attention to their grades is a fool's errand.

Still I have often wondered why we don't put Tyron and Zack on the same side. That would give us at least one side of the ball we could always run behind. It would be like having Nate and Tooey back in the day. Defenses would have to counter it by overloading that side.. which means an intelligent OC would simply devise plays to take advantage of that by incorporating misdirection and cutbacks to the side which the defense leaves light. Force them to pick their poison.. Play it straight against two all pros and get mauled or overload against them at let the Cowboys eat on the other side. Either way we win. The only way to lose is to spread them apart and be just okay on both sides..

It doesn't factor in postseason. If anyone thinks the O line was super vs. the 49ers they can't be taken serious.