Question for the "let's let Lawrence walk" crowd

[buybuydandavis]

We let Lawrence walk.

What do we do at DE? Some seemed to suggest it was OK because we had Irving in the wings. Well, so much for that. You can't head into the season with your DE depth chart being Charlton, Armstrong, Gregory and sometimes Crawford (who is a better interior player than outside player). That would be a bottom half of the league DE group, at best.

If we hadn't had Lawrence this year, we would have missed out on those 5 sacks the last 14 games, 0 in 2 playoff games, but would have had 17 mil more in cap to spend. 2017 it was 7 sacks in the last 12 games, w/o playoffs.

For next year, Gregory and Crawford would be a better pair than we've had most recent years. After being out of football for year and a half, Gregory came in for training camp and had 6 sacks on under 50% use. Full time projects to 9 sacks. With a continuous year of football training, he should be physically much better too. Jaylon can rush. Maybe Maliek stays healthy and can perform at his rookie level.

Here's a question for you.

What if this year's production is typical? Those 5 sacks the last 14 games is the kind of production we see from here to eternity, and we guarantee 60mil for the next 3 years to that production? What then?

Sounds like we're humped to me.

Which scenario is *worse*?

Lawrence has both health and production red flags. Not the kind of guy you build your team around. Not the kind of guy to lock massive cap into. We've got healthy guys spend on.

 

[AmericanCowboy]

If we hadn't had Lawrence this year, we would have missed out on those 5 sacks the last 14 games, 0 in 2 playoff games, but would have had 17 mil more in cap to spend. 2017 it was 7 sacks in the last 12 games, w/o playoffs.

For next year, Gregory and Crawford would be a better pair than we've had most recent years. After being out of football for year and a half, Gregory came in for training camp and had 6 sacks on under 50% use. Full time projects to 9 sacks. With a continuous year of football training, he should be physically much better too. Jaylon can rush. Maybe Maliek stays healthy and can perform at his rookie level.

Here's a question for you.

What if this year's production is typical? Those 5 sacks the last 14 games is the kind of production we see from here to eternity, and we guarantee 60mil for the next 3 years to that production? What then?

Sounds like we're humped to me.

Which scenario is *worse*?

Lawrence has both health and production red flags. Not the kind of guy you build your team around. Not the kind of guy to lock massive cap into. We've got healthy guys spend on.

His end of the years have been really average.

 

[AmericanCowboy]

Trade him to the Jets who will be more than happy to give him that huge contract.

Take their second round pick, their third, and next years second or second third.

Go and sign Jarrett or Clowney or Vernon (after he gets cut)

 

[xwalker]

There are a number of posters that want to let him walk based on what they think he will get contract wise.

This thread was directed at those people.

That seems like an extremely small percentage of posters from what I've seen.

Most of the talk regarding moving on from DLaw has been in connection to the possibility of franchising and trading him.

There is zero reason to just let him walk without franchising him. They could definitely trade him. I can't guarantee what pick(s) they would get, but any team willing to give him the big contract would be willing to give up at least a 5th round pick and possibly much much more.

Even if they can't trade him, the team does not lose anything by franchising him.

 

[btcutter]

The Cowboys had over 19% of their cap invested in the DE position in 2018 - highest in the NFL - and their season ended with the defensive line getting steamrolled. The defensive ends were non-factors, and the Cowboys watched the CCG on TV yet again. So while you're wringing your hands over Lawrence, ask yourself how increasing that number is going to make them play any better?

Another case of not paying a guy like he's the best in the league just because he's the best on your roster. The only presence "Tank" had in the playoffs was when he said things he couldn't back up on the field. No way in the world I'm making him the highest paid DE in football.

Both DT played injured and Rams ran for over 200 yards. DEs never got a chance to rush the passer. Look at KC vs NE. Exactly the same. If you don't stop the run first you can't pass rush.

 

[jsb357]

no sacks against ANY eventual playoffs teams after week 3

no sacks in playoffs

and 3 against Detroit and stills only managed 10.5

D "fade late" Law

not worth breaking the bank over...

 

[Rayman70]

5 yr, 94-96m, 58-60m wouldn't kill the cap and would be a fair deal for both parties. Would make him the highest paid DE and on par with Jones contract he signed in 2017.

Now, if it was my money, and it's not lol, I wouldn't give him that. But knowing how the NFL and NFL contracts work, this would be a fair deal.

Look how baseball has utterly destroyed things, like the other day...a player just signed for 300 million!!! Is this what we want for the NFL...cough cough..Roger Goodell? Baseball will implode under its own weight if they do not have at least, a soft salary cap of some sort. The NFL must do something to reign in the over spending on players.The cap rules, in my opinion, need to be stricter. I want players to get what they deserve,but I also don't want to see teams destroyed. If we pay Lawrence lets say, 100 mil...and then Dak what he wants...THEN ZEKE, someone wont get paid, like Amari Cooper. Is that what we want?

 

[mattjames2010]

no sacks against ANY eventual playoffs teams after week 3

no sacks in playoffs

and 3 against Detroit and stills only managed 10.5

D "fade late" Law

not worth breaking the bank over...

There is nothing to indicate he "faded late" - sacks are not indicative of entire play. He's not going to be paid like a Donald or Mack, and he won't "break the bank" - stop posting crap from your fantasy land.

He's going to get paid like a top tier 4-3 DE, and that's not "breaking the bank" - did some of you stop following football in the 90s? With all the retro football pictures I see on here, I imagine that is the case.

 

[Corso]

yes he is, as are you

Thank you!

 

[Corso]

If we hadn't had Lawrence this year, we would have missed out on those 5 sacks the last 14 games, 0 in 2 playoff games, but would have had 17 mil more in cap to spend. 2017 it was 7 sacks in the last 12 games, w/o playoffs.

For next year, Gregory and Crawford would be a better pair than we've had most recent years. After being out of football for year and a half, Gregory came in for training camp and had 6 sacks on under 50% use. Full time projects to 9 sacks. With a continuous year of football training, he should be physically much better too. Jaylon can rush. Maybe Maliek stays healthy and can perform at his rookie level.

Here's a question for you.

What if this year's production is typical? Those 5 sacks the last 14 games is the kind of production we see from here to eternity, and we guarantee 60mil for the next 3 years to that production? What then?

Sounds like we're humped to me.

Which scenario is *worse*?

Lawrence has both health and production red flags. Not the kind of guy you build your team around. Not the kind of guy to lock massive cap into. We've got healthy guys spend on.

His end of the years have been really average.

Yep... Demarcus Ware Syndrome.
Seen it before.
We should let him go to Denver... wait.

 

[Verdict]

We let Lawrence walk.

What do we do at DE? Some seemed to suggest it was OK because we had Irving in the wings. Well, so much for that. You can't head into the season with your DE depth chart being Charlton, Armstrong, Gregory and sometimes Crawford (who is a better interior player than outside player). That would be a bottom half of the league DE group, at best.

Consider this. WITH LAWRENCE, the Cowboys were middle of the pack in sacks and pressures. They were actually in the bottom third of teams in terms of Football Outsiders sack rate. Where do you think those numbers go with no Lawrence? Or do you just say, "hey, we weren't all that great at getting after the QB with Lawrence, so who cares if we still stink at it in 2019?"

What should Dallas do if Lawrence is not part of this team in 2019?

And note, I am not opposed to letting Lawrence walk............. as long as the franchise has a plan in place to compensate for his loss. They can't pull a WR offseason 2018 ploy where they will get "production by committee."

That's the wrong line of reasoning. First of all I don't think anyone on this entire board has said we don't want Tank around anymore. Second, he has to have enter into a contract that is mutually beneficial to the team and the player.
Third, if he won't do #2 it doesn't matter if you can replace him or not. You do the best you can without him if he is going to wreck the cap.

 

[Verdict]

One thing about the DLaw situation that few here seem to talk about is this: How the team treats him will be watched by all the young talent on this team when it’s time for them to sign a second contract.

What I mean by that is Stephen Jones has been preaching for years how important it is for young players to work hard, play well, and be a leader...then you get rewarded by a big contract. DLaw has done ALL that. He has been the opposite of guys like David Irving who have talent but waste it on the wrong things. You can’t resign everyone of course, but isn’t DLaw a guy this organization can point to and say he’s done things the right way?

I think this team needs to sign him. Some fans act like finding a DE that can rush the passer is as easy as picking the pass rush tree out back. (Right next to the “franchise QB tree”!) We draft and develop this guy, he performs, then we let him go?

That's really irrelevant. It doesn't matter what they offer to pay Tank. All that matters is what the Cowboys offer them when their contract is up.

 

[Verdict]

And wait four more years for a competent DE?

Maybe. If his price is too high, absolutely.

 

[Verdict]

I saw someone put that up here but have not seen anything from him about it and would be surprised if he did. He played this perfectly, even let it be known that he was OK with being tagged before they did it. However, he and his agent are aware of how much space they have and the Joneses were up front about extending the QB who is already under contract. Really stupid for a lot of reasons.

I think the reason they released Bryant was payback for how he handled the tag. He forced their hand coming off a good season and that didn't sit well with the front office.

Actually they got rid of Dez because he sucked and no other reason. It was obvious.

 

[Corso]

Maybe. If his price is too high, absolutely.

I sure do hope it doesn't get to a damned if do, damned if you don't scenario...

 

[Corso]

Actually they got rid of Dez because he sucked and no other reason. It was obvious.

One other reason- he was a distraction and maybe too alpha for the WR room.

 

[DIAF]

DLaw, you gotta sign him at whatever the price. It's hard to get a player of his caliber at that position. If I can only keep one out of DLaw/Zeke/Amari, i choose DLaw every time.

 

[Verdict]

I sure do hope it doesn't get to a damned if do, damned if you don't scenario...

Yeah me too, bro. I have a sinking feeling that is going to be the case. We are probably going to regret it either way.

 

[Verdict]

One other reason- he was a distraction and maybe too alpha for the WR room.

Ok. You got me there bro.

 

[eromeopolk]

We let Lawrence walk.

What do we do at DE? Some seemed to suggest it was OK because we had Irving in the wings. Well, so much for that. You can't head into the season with your DE depth chart being Charlton, Armstrong, Gregory and sometimes Crawford (who is a better interior player than outside player). That would be a bottom half of the league DE group, at best.

Consider this. WITH LAWRENCE, the Cowboys were middle of the pack in sacks and pressures. They were actually in the bottom third of teams in terms of Football Outsiders sack rate. Where do you think those numbers go with no Lawrence? Or do you just say, "hey, we weren't all that great at getting after the QB with Lawrence, so who cares if we still stink at it in 2019?"

What should Dallas do if Lawrence is not part of this team in 2019?

And note, I am not opposed to letting Lawrence walk............. as long as the franchise has a plan in place to compensate for his loss. They can't pull a WR offseason 2018 ploy where they will get "production by committee."

I think Jerry learned that lesson of letting go his best player on offense after a Super Bowl run in 2014. He let RB Demarco Murray go who was the NFC Offensive Player of the Year in 2014. The Cowboys went 4-12 in 2015 earning the right to replace him with a top 5 draft pick choosing another RB Ezekiel Elliott.

You let go your best player on defense and you will be drafting in the top 5 for one the next year.

Repeating the same thing over again expecting different results....that is insanity.