RB debate continues, R Rice vs. Felix Jones

[gimmesix]

So what is the write-up on Tashard Choice?

From what I've seen, it's between him and Rice for me. I think they both show excellent vision and the ability to quick-cut and find a hole when nothing is there.

 

[This is Our Year]

I'd prefer Felix Jones but if we get Ray Rice I won't be that mad this guy is going to be a player I have a feeling. Plus RB is probably the easiest position to translate to the pro's who ever we get in the draft is probably going to have a very big impact next season.

 

[marchetta]

I wonder if it was rays mom that wrote that report on him? Whoever wrote that is on alot of drugs!! Doesnt need to improve on anything? give me a break! I have seen him play alot of games because I live in New York State,(which I am not proud of living here but anyways..) and hes not that fast for one and he is not a great receiver outta the backfield either. Ill take felix,but id rather have chris johnson especially when he runs a sub 4.3 at the combines

What Drew meant by "he doesn't need to improve on anything," is that RR does the things that make a NFL RB great. Drew has spent decades analyzing what goes into making a RB effective at the NFL level, and he's determined that the attributes that a college RB needs to make a successful transition are speed to the LOS, vision, instincts, and lateral agility. RR has ALL these attributes and knows exactly how to use them. That's why he said he doesn't need to improve anything. Also, he specifically says repeatedly that a NFL RB does NOT need speed to be great, but a RB has to have most of the aforementioned attributes to be effective. He says that if you can find a RB with ALL those attributes, and speed also, he will be a 1 in a million player like B.Sanders. But those players come along once in a lifetime. Every time someone wants to slam RR they talk about his lack of speed. Heck, how fast was Emmitt? RR is faster than Emmitt! He may not run a 4.4 40, but you don't need speed to be a great RB. If you're offered Emmitt Smith to pair with MBIII how many of you would take it (rhetorical question)? Everyone of you. The thought of having an Emmitt Smith type RB sharing the backfield with MBIII would make most Dallas fans drool at the mouth. Well, if Dallas is smart enough to chose RR, you better have your bibs ready.

 

[tomson75]

So what is the write-up on Tashard Choice?

From what I've seen, it's between him and Rice for me. I think they both show excellent vision and the ability to quick-cut and find a hole when nothing is there.

I'd like to see more of him. He does seem to have excellent vision, but I'm not sold on his foot speed. He seems to plod along a bit.

 

[Woods]

So what is the write-up on Tashard Choice?

From what I've seen, it's between him and Rice for me. I think they both show excellent vision and the ability to quick-cut and find a hole when nothing is there.

That one is not prepared as of yet either.

 

[tomson75]

So what is the write-up on Tashard Choice?

From what I've seen, it's between him and Rice for me. I think they both show excellent vision and the ability to quick-cut and find a hole when nothing is there.

I'd like to see more of him. He does seem to have excellent vision, but I'm not sold on his foot speed. He seems to plod along a bit.

Or, maybe i was hung over, and my head was plodding along. Not sure.

 

[sago1]

I'd rather use our first 2 round picks on a CB like Rodgers-Cromertie and BPA at WR. In 2nd round I'd hope that RB Chris Johnson is available when we draft. He's got great speed and really good WR. He's already a good return man which helps us at a deficient position.

 

[Portland Fanatic]

That one is not prepared as of yet either.

I tell ya the two backs I like a lot and may be there at #22 are Stewart and Mendenhall...these two IMO are the two best all around backs in the draft. I think Rice is up there, but I think both of these guys are franchise type backs.

I like Stewart of course coming from Oregon...he has all the tools, but Mendenhall has impressed me a ton as well.

Just my simple opinion...if we grabbed either in round 1 I'd be happy.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Something to consider with Felix Jones and that is JERRY Jones.

You can bet money that if Jerry is not trying to get D-Mac he has already made his mind up one way or the other about Felix.

He will either feel he is worth the pick and take him or he will pass on him. I know that is pretty cut and dry, but I think Jerry already has the choice in his mind.

Personally...gotta love Felix Jone's speed but at the same time I would rather have the more well rounded running back in Ray Rice. Of course I have seen more of rice than jones so I have that bias.

I just think you always go with the more well rounded back over someone that is mainly known for his speed.

I have no way of checking this but I am curious to see if there is some report, article or source that has shown the comparisons of RBs coming out of the draft.

What would be curious to see is how many mainly speed guys do in the nfl vs more well rounded rbs who may not have super speed.

 

[tomson75]

I tell ya the two backs I like a lot and may be there at #22 are Stewart and Mendenhall...these two IMO are the two best all around backs in the draft. I think Rice is up there, but I think both of these guys are franchise type backs.

I like Stewart of course coming from Oregon...he has all the tools, but Mendenhall has impressed me a ton as well.

Just my simple opinion...if we grabbed either in round 1 I'd be happy.

If I thought RB was as big of a priority as CB, I'd agree with you. I just don't think either of them are still there at 28 or in the second round. Rice, Johnson, and Jones just might be.

 

[marchetta]

Personally i want the complete guy. i dont like one dimensional a any point. Now granted Duece/Bush and others have shown the thunder and lightning can work but as has been pointed out if thunder goes down lightning has issues.

i look at SD and see LT/Turner paying dividends and me likee. Thunder and Thunder works well too.

Great comparison. Two runners that could each carry the load if the other went down. I guarantee you, the same guys that are yammering for FJ and CJ type complementary RBs would be screaming bloody murder if MBIII goes down next year and we're dependent on either one to carry the load for the remainder of the season. I guarantee you they'll be watching RR carrying his team into the playoffs, while we're sitting at home wondering what the heck happened to our dynamic, once potent, offense. If anyone wants to look at our offense w/o a running game, just watch the 2nd half of our playoff game against the Giants, because that's exactly what we'd look like if MBIII goes down and we're forced to rely on FJ or CJ to start. With a RB like MBIII, we need another RB that doesn't just complement him, but can replace him if he goes down.

 

[Portland Fanatic]

If I thought RB was as big of a priority as CB, I'd agree with you. I just don't think either of them are still there at 28 or in the second round. Rice, Johnson, and Jones just might be.

I agree with you 100% that RB is not our top priority, however I could live with taking either Stewart or Mendenhall at #22, but without a doubt our biggest need is CB...I hope we get a solid CB in FA, and draft one in rd 1...we need two more quality backs in there.

 

[tomson75]

I agree with you 100% that RB is not our top priority, however I could live with taking either Stewart or Mendenhall at #22, but without a doubt our biggest need is CB...I hope we get a solid CB in FA, and draft one in rd 1...we need two more quality backs in there.

Having this upcoming draft class coincide with or two biggest needs is a godsend. The depth at CB and RB is remarkable this year. I think we're going to walk away from the draft with a measurably better team than when we arrived.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Could you imagine pairing these guys up with O Schmitt at FB?

Now I havent seen this guy play so this is just skepticism but this is reminding me of the hyperbole about Jamar Martin a few years back.

Does he have any receiving skills?

 

[marchetta]

Gross things just happened in my pants.














Not really. I swear.

I was about to reply, "Now I'm going to have to squeegee my monitor." But I like your reply better.

 

[Portland Fanatic]

Great comparison. Two runners that could each carry the load if the other went down. I guarantee you, the same guys that are yammering for FJ and CJ type complementary RBs would be screaming bloody murder if MBIII goes down next year and we're dependent on either one to carry the load for the remainder of the season. I guarantee you they'll be watching RR carrying his team into the playoffs, while we're sitting at home wondering what the heck happened to our dynamic, once potent, offense. If anyone wants to look at our offense w/o a running game, just watch the 2nd half of our playoff game against the Giants, because that's exactly what we'd look like if MBIII goes down and we're forced to rely on FJ or CJ to start. With a RB like MBIII, we need another RB that doesn't just complement him, but can replace him if he goes down.

Excellent post...this is the main reason my focus is on Stewart, Mendenhall, Rice, or Kevin Smith. The way MBIII runs worries me...I love it, but it scares me. He has the potential to go down. My order of choice right now is Mendenhall, Stewart, Rice then Smith...

 

[marchetta]

I'd like to see more of him. He does seem to have excellent vision, but I'm not sold on his foot speed. He seems to plod along a bit.

You're seeing the same thing I'm seeing. I like his vision, and he appears to have good lateral agility, but I'm really troubled about his foot speed (not running speed). One of the main criteria a RB needs is quickness to run in spurts. He has to be able to accept the handoff and have the same quickness to the LOS as a speed back. Emmitt couldn't run a sub 4.5 40, but once he saw a hole, he could hit the hole as fast as a 4.4 40 guy. That's what a RB needs. He has to have the foot quickness to get in and out of the hole quickly, and foot speed to make adjustments quickly. Choice just seems to lack in this area, but I haven't seen extensive footage (no pun intended) of him to make this determination.

 

[marchetta]

I agree with you 100% that RB is not our top priority, however I could live with taking either Stewart or Mendenhall at #22, but without a doubt our biggest need is CB...I hope we get a solid CB in FA, and draft one in rd 1...we need two more quality backs in there.

I wrote Drew about Mendenhall and Drew confirmed some of the things that I thought I was seeing. I called Mendenhall a Julius Jones clone, because they ran exactly alike, except Mendenhall is a lot bigger. I couldn't put my finger on why I thought this until Drew told me Mendenhall is overrated because he lacks lateral agility (then the light went off!). He can't make lateral adjustments at the LOS, and he will be a run into the pile runner at the next level. I think all of us have had our fill of a run into the pile runner, that can't make lateral adjustments haven't we (rhetorical)? Furthermore, Drew noted that he thinks Mendenhall is going to have a great deal of trouble learning NFL offenses. I didn't ask him to expand on this observation, but he seemed to be hinting at a lack of football IQ or maybe a learning disability.

 

[ctrous25]

What Drew meant by "he doesn't need to improve on anything," is that RR does the things that make a NFL RB great. Drew has spent decades analyzing what goes into making a RB effective at the NFL level, and he's determined that the attributes that a college RB needs to make a successful transition are speed to the LOS, vision, instincts, and lateral agility. RR has ALL these attributes and knows exactly how to use them. That's why he said he doesn't need to improve anything. Also, he specifically says repeatedly that a NFL RB does NOT need speed to be great, but a RB has to have most of the aforementioned attributes to be effective. He says that if you can find a RB with ALL those attributes, and speed also, he will be a 1 in a million player like B.Sanders. But those players come along once in a lifetime. Every time someone wants to slam RR they talk about his lack of speed. Heck, how fast was Emmitt? RR is faster than Emmitt! He may not run a 4.4 40, but you don't need speed to be a great RB. If you're offered Emmitt Smith to pair with MBIII how many of you would take it (rhetorical question)? Everyone of you. The thought of having an Emmitt Smith type RB sharing the backfield with MBIII would make most Dallas fans drool at the mouth. Well, if Dallas is smart enough to chose RR, you better have your bibs ready.

We need someone to compliment MBIII and someone to be a 3rd down back, also Chris Johnson is a great return man.. Rice aint gonna be a return man in the NFL

 

[marchetta]

Excellent post...this is the main reason my focus is on Stewart, Mendenhall, Rice, or Kevin Smith. The way MBIII runs worries me...I love it, but it scares me. He has the potential to go down. My order of choice right now is Mendenhall, Stewart, Rice then Smith...

I've only watched games of RR, so I can only tell you what Drew has said about the others.

Mendenhall: Overrated. Doesn't have lateral agility. Will be a run into the pile runner. Also, may have trouble learning NFL offense playbook.

Stewart: Drew compares him to Saun Alexander (RB Seattle). Likes him alot, but doesn't think he runs as hard/tough as a RB of his size should do. May not be able to get you the tough yards. Drew said he's great as long as you're not depending on him to get you a 1st down on 4th and 1.

Rice: Drew's favorite RB. He likes DMac better, but thinks RR is the more complete RB. DMac has the higher ceiling, and could develop into the best RB EVER in the NFL, but he has some bust potential because he still has a lot to learn, and his style of running, and body type, lends itself to injury. While RR's ceiling is lower, but his RB skills are so developed, and he's so smart, that he has virtually no bust potential. He's going impact from day 1, while DMac may take more time to develop.

Smith: Overrated, and a bust waiting to happen. Shouldn't be taken in the early rounds. He is severely slow to the LOS, and thus can't run out of a 1 back offense or a spread offense. He can only run with a FB leading him, because w/o a FB he's going to be getting hit in the backfield alot. Speed to the LOS is a crucial skill that a NFL RB has to have in order to be successful. Holes only stay open for an instant, and a RB has to be able to accept the handoff, anticipate the hole, and get through it instantly. A RB that is slow to the LOS, will not be effective in the NFL.