Rookie Preseason Passing Brilliance (Revisited)

[Idgit]

We're both talking about what DID happen. I'm making a distinction between the team and the individual player in an effort to help you understand WHY it happened. Romo's 8 consecutive top 10 seasons in passer rating DID happen. Staubach, Aikman, and Favre combining for 2 playoff wins in 18 seasons without a top 10 defense DID happen.

You don't see any connection between having a complete team and playoff success? Be honest.

On top of the informative posts you always make, dude, you have a knack for handling disputes that I have to say I envy. I'd have written and deleted a half-dozen replied to that post, all of which would have gotten me into hot water with the site staff.

 

[DogFace]

On top of the informative posts you always make, dude, you have a knack for handling disputes that I have to say I envy. I'd have written and deleted a half-dozen replied to that post, all of which would have gotten me into hot water with the site staff.

I'll second this. What many of us perceive as total ignorance and utter stupidity does not even phase him.
I'd love to know how to do that. Not getting emotionally involved when dealing with people like this seems impossible to me.

Is it possible Percy is a supercomputer and is immune to the affects of this unintelligent argument?

 

[ufcrules1]

We're both talking about what DID happen. I'm making a distinction between the team and the individual player in an effort to help you understand WHY it happened. Romo's 8 consecutive top 10 seasons in passer rating DID happen. Staubach, Aikman, and Favre combining for 2 playoff wins in 18 seasons without a top 10 defense DID happen.

You don't see any connection between having a complete team and playoff success? Be honest.

As far as what HAS happened, that would be Romo folding right along with the rest of the team in the win/in/playoff games. You want to blame that on the defense not being good enough and not assign any blame to Romo.

We don't fully know what would have happened had he had several top 10 ranked defenses throughout his career. You can't take what hasn't happened and assume what would have happened and have anyone care... outside of this forum anyway. Do you think Romo will make the HOF? Honestly? Well, why not? Oh, because those who vote will be doing so based on what HAS happened. Not hypotheticals or "what if's". Sorry.

To your question. Yes, I do see a connection but without those circumstances actually playing out, we don't honestly know what would have happen. All we can do is assume if we wanted to play that game. I don't care to do it because I feel it is pointless. You are trying to talk about it as if it is a certainty and it isn't. History will judge Romo based on certainties not what could have been if XYZ was in place.

 

[JDSmith]

On top of the informative posts you always make, dude, you have a knack for handling disputes that I have to say I envy. I'd have written and deleted a half-dozen replied to that post, all of which would have gotten me into hot water with the site staff.

You can post whatever you want, just don't be shocked when the mods delete them without a word. What hurts is that, if it were to hypothetically happen, I lose all the likes from those posts when they get deleted. At least let me keep my likes people.

 

[Idgit]

You can post whatever you want, just don't be shocked when the mods delete them without a word. What hurts is that, if it were to hypothetically happen, I lose all the likes from those posts when they get deleted. At least let me keep my likes people.

If we let you keep your likes, people would post all sorts of horrible things just to get likes, and we'd have to run around deleting them all and going crazy.

You earn your likes on an even playing field like the rest of us. By making the random fart or poop joke every now and then that skids up to, but not over, the line and leaves it's mark.

 

[JDSmith]

If we let you keep your likes, people would post all sorts of horrible things just to get likes, and we'd have to run around deleting them all and going crazy.

You earn your likes on an even playing field like the rest of us. By making the random fart or poop joke every now and then that skids up to, but not over, the line and leaves it's mark.

Even without the likes, it's cathartic.

 

[percyhoward]

To your question. Yes, I do see a connection but without those circumstances actually playing out, we don't honestly know what would have happen. All we can do is assume if we wanted to play that game. I don't care to do it because I feel it is pointless.

I'm not asking you to speculate about anything. I'm just trying to get you to see the difference between a player and a team.

 

[ufcrules1]

I'm not asking you to speculate about anything. I'm just trying to get you to see the difference between a player and a team.

I do see it and have never denied it. With that said, I'm trying to get you to recognize that said player in question has had his warts too right along with the rest of the team. Would he have won some of those games with a better defense despite playing under his regular season stats? Very possible. But we are then dealing with uncertainties, not facts.

I think Romo will go down in history as what might have been. Sort of like Danny White.

 

[ufcrules1]

You can post whatever you want, just don't be shocked when the mods delete them without a word. What hurts is that, if it were to hypothetically happen, I lose all the likes from those posts when they get deleted. At least let me keep my likes people.

I don't care about the likes. If a mod could tranfer mine to you, I would be fine with that.

 

[jobberone]

As far as what HAS happened, that would be Romo folding right along with the rest of the team in the win/in/playoff games. You want to blame that on the defense not being good enough and not assign any blame to Romo.

We don't fully know what would have happened had he had several top 10 ranked defenses throughout his career. You can't take what hasn't happened and assume what would have happened and have anyone care... outside of this forum anyway. Do you think Romo will make the HOF? Honestly? Well, why not? Oh, because those who vote will be doing so based on what HAS happened. Not hypotheticals or "what if's". Sorry.

To your question. Yes, I do see a connection but without those circumstances actually playing out, we don't honestly know what would have happen. All we can do is assume if we wanted to play that game. I don't care to do it because I feel it is pointless. You are trying to talk about it as if it is a certainty and it isn't. History will judge Romo based on certainties not what could have been if XYZ was in place.

One studies history to learn what to do and not based on the past. One analyses games, wars, chess games, operations, histories of behaviors just to learn what is likely to happen.

Now if you want to discuss the uncertainty principle at the quantum level then let's do it. Otherwise you are arguing against a vast number of disciplines that utilize the past as well as probabilities in an effort to predict future and even current events as well as make plans for them. Futures are based on probabilities on what has AND will likely happen.

 

[ufcrules1]

One studies history to learn what to do and not based on the past. One analyses games, wars, chess games, operations, histories of behaviors just to learn what is likely to happen.

Now if you want to discuss the uncertainty principle at the quantum level then let's do it. Otherwise you are arguing against a vast number of disciplines that utilize the past as well as probabilities in an effort to predict future and even current events as well as make plans for them. Futures are based on probabilities on what has AND will likely happen.

"Past performance is not indicative of future results" What could have been if XYZ happened or the future itself is nothing more than a mystery. You can base things off of what happened in the past but it will be nothing more than a gamble. It will not be an absolute. So if Romo's career were to end today, he would be known as a very good QB who won 2 playoff games in a decade and played well below his regular season stats in win/in and playoff games. He will be remembered in the Cowboys ring of honor and some fans minds, but he will never be enshrined.

 

[percyhoward]

I do see it and have never denied it. With that said, I'm trying to get you to recognize that said player in question has had his warts too right along with the rest of the team.

If you've "never denied" the connection between having a complete team and playoff success, then you must realize your issue is really not with Romo. He's certainly done more than his part, warts and all.

After all, we don't have any reason to expect the QB to be that much better than the rest of the team.

 

[ufcrules1]

If you've "never denied" the connection between having a complete team and playoff success, then you must realize your issue is really not with Romo. He's certainly done more than his part, warts and all.

After all, we don't have any reason to expect the QB to be that much better than the rest of the team.

I'm not really willing to continue debating this.I have said all I'm going to say. I think we can both agree that Romo will be remembered as a very good QB but not a hall of famer. The reasons why can be debated ad nauseum but as time goes by, less and less people will care. I'm personally ready for a new QB era here and hoping Dak will kick some butt out there. I would love to see this team enjoy more post season success.

 

[Diehardblues]

Wow. That was my sig last year on another forum. Funny

 

[Diehardblues]

Dak had the greatest debut of any QB in Cowboys history preseason.

As a result we are much more optimistic heading into the season without Romo even with a Rookie QB.

 

[jobberone]

"Past performance is not indicative of future results" What could have been if XYZ happened or the future itself is nothing more than a mystery. You can base things off of what happened in the past but it will be nothing more than a gamble. It will not be an absolute. So if Romo's career were to end today, he would be known as a very good QB who won 2 playoff games in a decade and played well below his regular season stats in win/in and playoff games. He will be remembered in the Cowboys ring of honor and some fans minds, but he will never be enshrined.

I'm not discussing HOF, ROH, etc. We're discussing looking at past events and trying to predict future results. No one is saying past football performances predict future wins. I'm saying the past is beneficial to study in looking at probabilities of an outcome. No one can predict the outcome of most future events with 100% certainty. From particle physics to medical surgical outcomes, etc we are looking at probabilities. To even speak of certainties in future athletic competitions/games is absurd. Your argument is faulty.

You continue, as well, to conflate personal performances to team success and failure. And while it is true over the long run you need a good QB to win in this league, it is non-sensical to think a certain QB is going to overcome all other negative performances of a team or even excellent performances of another team. It is unusual for any QB to have excellent stats in a losing performance because of all the other variables outside the control of that QB (or coach) etc.

 

[ufcrules1]

I'm not discussing HOF, ROH, etc. We're discussing looking at past events and trying to predict future results. No one is saying past football performances predict future wins. I'm saying the past is beneficial to study in looking at probabilities of an outcome. No one can predict the outcome of most future events with 100% certainty. From particle physics to medical surgical outcomes, etc we are looking at probabilities. To even speak of certainties in future athletic competitions/games is absurd. Your argument is faulty.

You continue, as well, to conflate personal performances to team success and failure. And while it is true over the long run you need a good QB to win in this league, it is non-sensical to think a certain QB is going to overcome all other negative performances of a team or even excellent performances of another team. It is unusual for any QB to have excellent stats in a losing performance because of all the other variables outside the control of that QB (or coach) etc.

Like I said. I'm done discussing this topic. So you and Percy can have the last word.

 

[jobberone]

Like I said. I'm done discussing this topic. So you and Percy can have the last word.

Fair enough. If you have time later you may consider looking at the stats and records of Fran Tarkenton and Dan Fouts. Fouts had an offense but lacked the defense BTW.

 

[jobberone]

You can post whatever you want, just don't be shocked when the mods delete them without a word. What hurts is that, if it were to hypothetically happen, I lose all the likes from those posts when they get deleted. At least let me keep my likes people.

If you respond to a post that was deleted or in that chain it might get deleted as well.

 

[JDSmith]

If you respond to a post that was deleted or in that chain it might get deleted as well.

Yeah, I had that happen as well - hypothetically.