Roster Mismanagement

[Stash]

My mistake he had 11 sacks in 2015, not 2016. But in his 3 years in the league he's collected two 1st team All Pros, 3 Pro Bowls and D Rook of the League.

In 3 years he's averaged 9.5 sacks:

2014 9 Sacks
2015 11 Sacks
2016 8 Sacks

He's done all this and more, do not discount the knockdowns, pressures and takeaways while being the focal point of opposing defenses and double teams. He's also a beast against the run. Comparing Maliek to Aaron Donald is inane. Malik would be lucky to be the next Geno Atkins.

Let's revisit this after this season, when Collins is either earning or being mentioned for Pro Bowl consideration.

He'll end up getting Crawford's money, not Aaron Donald.

 

[Stash]

Rather have best interior defender in the game, Aaron Donald. The 3 tech is what makes Marinelli's D hum, this known.

Maliek Collins helped Dallas finished 1st in the league against the run.

How did Donald and the Rams do there?

 

[BAT]

Let's revisit this after this season, when Collins is either earning or being mentioned for Pro Bowl consideration.

He'll end up getting Crawford's money, not Aaron Donald.

That money is only going to go up, not down. Nothing personal against Maliek, he's a Cowboy so will cheer him on just want the best for the Cowboys. And the best is Aaron Donald, who's as close to being moved as he ever will be.

 

[jday]

He's a great player BAT... No question.

Just not worth the combined salary + the resources that would need to be invested in order to acquire him.

On top of that the sitting out thing just rubs me the wrong way... Screams "selfish".

Ordinarily, I'd agree on the "selfish" part, but it is a two-way street. If he hadn't performed up to his first round status, there's a good chance they would have cut him. So, in my mind, if teams can cut players that underperform, players should be able to ask for more money when they clearly over-perform. If anyone has done that, Donald has.

That said, I do agree it would cost too much to go get him and rather spend those resources on something considered more of need. Maliek Collins is not Donald and he may never be, but he is the strongest link on our line. Seems kind of wasteful to waste all the resources Donald would demand to get him to replace our strongest link. We should be looking for upgrades to our weakest links, if we are going to spend draft capital in particular.

 

[BAT]

Maliek Collins helped Dallas finished 1st in the league against the run.

How did Donald and the Rams do there?

Maliek is poor to,average against the run, it's been his weakness since Nebraska. Maliek had less than half of Donald's total tackles in 2016 (23 vs. 48). Maliek would give up his first born to even sniff Donald's 69 total tackles in 2015.

You would have done better not to even go there.

 

[Stash]

That money is only going to go up, not down. Nothing personal against Maliek, he's a Cowboy so will cheer him on just want the best for the Cowboys. And the best is Aaron Donald, who's as close to being moved as he ever will be.

Sorry, but I'm looking at a potential Pro Bowl player in the second year of his rookie contract in Maliek Collins making $800,000 vs paying Aaron Donald $16 million-plus and handing over a 1st round pick for the privilege of doing it.

No thanks.

 

[Stash]

Maliek is poor to,average against the run, it's been his weakness since Nebraska. Maliek had less than half of Donald's total tackles in 2016 (23 vs. 48). Maliek would give up his first born to even sniff Donald's 69 total tackles in 2015.

You would have done better not to even go there.

So how did it happen that Collins and the Cowboys finished #1 in the league against the run?

And where again did Donald and the Rams finish?

 

[BAT]

So how did it happen that Collins and the Cowboys finished #1 in the league against the run?

And where again did Donald and the Rams finish?

Football is a team sport Stash, you know that. Maliek is nowhere near the run stopper that Donald is. But Rams as team aren't as good as Cowboys as team against the run, no one disputing that.

Maliek's strength is his pass rush, but even there he's still not nearly as good as Donald. You hope Maliek is in pro bowl consideration for 2017. We all know that Donald is a lock for All Pro.

 

[Verdict]

He had 11 last season compare to Maliek's 5. But it's the pressures and knockdowns that tell the bigger story. Donald is who opposing offenses game plan against, he is a legit game changer. Cowboys have no such player on entire D.

Comparing Donald to Maliek is very unfair to Maliek. Maliek is nowhere near the player.

Collins doesn't have the reputation Donald does ....yet. He also doesn't have the salary cap hit Donald does. Level of play is fluid, not staic. Collins may end up being all that and a bag of chips. Time will tell.

 

[Stash]

Football is a team sport Stash, you know that. Maliek is nowhere near the run stopper that Donald is. But Rams as team aren't as good as Cowboys as team against the run, no one disputing that.

Oh, so now it's a team game, when Collins and his team are putting up better numbers. That seems a bit of a double standard, don't you think?

Maliek's strength is his pass rush, but even there he's still not nearly as good as Donald. You hope Maliek is in pro bowl consideration for 2017. We all know that Donald is a lock for All Pro.

True. But at 1/20th of the salary, and no draft pick cost, I'm more than happy to take my chances.

I'd gladly give up a 1st round pick for a pass rusher like Danielle Hunter from the Vikings. That's still this team' so higgest need. And he has two years left at a rookie salary.

But I'm not giving up draft picks to then have to make Donald among the highest paid in the leagu, if not the highest.

No.

 

[BAT]

Collins doesn't have the reputation Donald does ....yet. He also doesn't have the salary cap hit Donald does. Level of play is fluid, not staic. Collins may end up being all that and a bag of chips. Time will tell.

Tired of a strategies based on HOPE. Give me proven production every time. You get what you pay for, good steak tastes much better than the best ground beef.

 

[BAT]

Oh, so now it's a team game, when Collins and his team are putting up better numbers. That seems a bit of a double standard, don't you think?



True. But at 1/20th of the salary, and no draft pick cost, I'm more than happy to take my chances.

I'd gladly give up a 1st round pick for a pass rusher like Danielle Hunter from the Vikings. That's still this team' so higgest need. And he has two years left at a rookie salary.

But I'm not giving up draft picks to then have to make Donald among the highest paid in the leagu, if not the highest.

No.

Are you going to throw out a TEAM stat when we are talking about individual accomplishments and ability then try to use your tangential argument against me?

I thought you better than that.

 

[LocimusPrime]

IMO

• Devin street should have have been cut earlier
• We should have signed Vernon
• Should have drafted Landon Collins instead of what's his name

Vernon and Collins are probowl type players

 

[Stash]

Are you going to throw out a TEAM stat when we are talking about individual accomplishments and ability then try to use your tangential argument against me?

I thought you better than that.

I'm going to put all of it out there and not just cherry pick the flashy parts because I think they help my case.

Donald had 9 sacks, Collins what? 5.5? As a rookie after missing most of his rookie training camp.

And he also somehow contributed to the league's #1 run defense.

I've never gotten an answer on how Donald and the Rams did there.

But all of those numbers matter for a defensive tackle, and a defense. Not just the flashy ones.

And if I'm not getting 20-times the production, I'm not paying 20-times the cost.

 

[BAT]

I'm going to put all of it out there and not just cherry pick the flashy parts because I think they help my case.

Donald had 9 sacks, Collins what? 5.5? As a rookie after missing most of his rookie training camp.

And he also somehow contributed to the league's #1 run defense.

I've never gotten an answer on how Donald and the Rams did there.

But all of those numbers matter for a defensive tackle, and a defense. Not just the flashy ones.

And if I'm not getting 20-times the production, I'm not paying 20-times the cost.

The pertinent numbers, Aaron Donald had more than twice the total tackles and almost twice the number of sacks. He did so even with consistent double, sometimes triple, teamed.

That Donald's team ranked lower in team defense against the run is only tangentially related to our discussion. That you say you're not going to cherry pick but throw this stat as the most integral to DT production is nonsensical especially because not many teams ran against the Cowboys because they were either behind and had to pass (our run game also forces teams to abandon run because it shortens game) or opposing offenses were specifically targeting our secondary due to all our injuries/inability to sack the passer.

D ranking against the run is a poor argument to determine how important each of the DTs were to their respective teams success. Donald is the better player, by far, and no matter how much you want to spin it, no sane person could argue otherwise.

And 20 times the production is not only unrealistic, it's a ridiculous expectation.

 

[DeaconBlues]

1. Chaz Green is the better player, and it has nothing to do with draft status. I really don't get the uproar over this? Cooper is on what his 4th team? He's not the same guy who was entering the draft. There's no weird conspiracy here about signing him after this season. You think they'd really risk a full season of starting so they won't have to pay him? Highly doubtful. They obviously have concerns over his play.

Nothing more need be said.

 

[DeaconBlues]

The fact the Giants, Igglets, and Deadskins didnt bring this guy in to even pick his brain is pretty telling...let alone all 31 other teams. The only place this kid belongs on Sunday is the booth or on the sideline in a jump suit. Wasted spot where a 25 yr old LB like a Jelani Jenkins could come in.

Pretty sure Moore is a vested player, not subject to waivers. Also sure that the coaches/front office explained that they needed the roster spot so Rico could go to the IR.

 

[Kaiser]

Pretty sure Moore is a vested player, not subject to waivers. Also sure that the coaches/front office explained that they needed the roster spot so Rico could go to the IR.

Also it was on the Dallascowboys.com website that Dallas was going to cut Moore for one day and resign him after the IR'ed Gathers. If guys like Broaddus were writing about it ahead of time the Division opponents had to know as well. And if it was a futile exercise to try, but the attempt would cost you the 53rd player on your roster signing elsewhere, why would teams bother? Even then Moore wouldn't sign with him, Dallas would just up their offer slightly.

 

[big dog cowboy]

Defense looks like a hot mess right now to me.

Good thing the Super Bowl is a few months off then right?

 

[Oh_Canada]

I'm not even mentioning draft pedigree.

I'm talking about visual evidence.

Seeing Cooper play well during his start, and the offense moving the ball up and down the field vs Indianapolis.

And seeing Cooper being graded as the team's best offensive lineman after that game.

If anyone could show me the same visual evidence or grades for Chaz Green, and not simply reprinted talk without actual support, I'd be all in to see it. But, to date, I've seen nothing of the kind, and therefore nothing to support any talk of a competition for the left guard position.

You are using a preseason game against the Colts as evidence. Seriously?