Roy covering Shockey-->>Whose Idea?

[dcowboysfan76]

:starspin

We are off to the best season since 95, and people want to argue about Roy Williams coverage on a TD play against a perennial TE who used his 6'5" frame to catch a ball that was thrown on his left outside shoulder when Roy was playing the inside......go figure

 

[TVMan]

We are off to the best season since 95, and people want to argue about Roy Williams coverage on a TD play against a perennial TE who used his 6'5" frame to catch a ball that was thrown on his left outside shoulder when Roy was playing the inside......go figure

Exactly.

 

[khiladi]

We are off to the best season since 95, and people want to argue about Roy Williams coverage on a TD play against a perennial TE who used his 6'5" frame to catch a ball that was thrown on his left outside shoulder when Roy was playing the inside......go figure

So people can say it's good coverage, but not that it was bad coverage? Being 8-1 and happy with the team and arguing that Roy played bad coverage on that play are mutually exclusive arguments. Nor does pointing out Roy played bad coverage, mean Roy sucks. Your logic needs work. Further, the sarcastic cheerleader game is for little children. It doesn't add anything of significance to the 'argument'.

And simply asserting Roy was playing inside does not make it true. I asked you to do a simple thing for me, which you never did.

Tell me where Roy is when Shockey makes the break in Picture 1...

Tell me where Roy is in Picture 2...

How is Roy playing the inside route, when, in picture 1, Shockey makes his break close to the goal-line, and Roy is standing by the goal-line? Roy, in snap 2, is at least 4 feet back in the end-zone, and BEHIND Shockey. If Roy was playing the inside route, considering that he had the position close to the goal-line when SHockey made his break, no way Shockey would have gotten that far into the end-zone, with Roy close to 3 feet behind him, while the ball is closer to Shockey than Roy is...

It's that simple, and there is nothing that complex about it.

At least other people have the sense to argue that Bradie James was taken out of the play. But this ultimately means that the Giants got the man coverage they wanted with Shockey on Roy, and Shockey plain beat Roy, who didn't play that good of coverage.

 

[TVMan]

It's that simple, and there is nothing that complex about it.

If that were the case, why do we need umpteen threads with 100's of pages just to arrive at a simple conclusion?

It's Commander week. That should be our focus.

 

[dcowboysfan76]

So people can say it's good coverage, but not that it was bad coverage?

BTW, the sarcastic cheerleader game is for little children. It doesn't add anything of significance to the 'argument', and also,
simply asserting Roy was playing inside does not make it true. I asked you to do a simple thing for me, which you never did.

Tell me where Roy is when Shockey makes the break in Picture 1...

Tell me where Roy is in Picture 2...

How is Roy playing the inside route, when, in picture 1, Shockey makes his break close to the goal-line, and Roy is standing by the goal-line? Roy, in snap 2, is at least 4 feet back in the end-zone, and BEHIND Shockey. If Roy was playing the inside route, considering that he had the position close to the goal-line when SHockey made his break, no way Shockey would have gotten that far into the end-zone, with Roy close to 3 feet behind him, while the ball is closer to Shockey than Roy is...

Dude it's a pointless discussion. This isn't like electric football (you know with the little plastic men with the green bases) where you can place a player in a position to where you feel he will be successful. I've looked at the picture and I've given my opinion. I'm not going to open an argument with you over something that seems to be rock, paper, scissors. Roy had good position on Shockey, but Manning made a good throw that could not be defended. In regards to the sarcasm how is that childish. Childish is allowing a little cartoon figure like this one to get under your skin because the majority of the posters in this thread disagree with you. I've stated many times that Roy has issues in coverage, but on this play he had no chance of making the play because of the pass. Furthermore, by looking at the pic it could also be argued that Roy forced Shockey to go inside because he cut off the outside route, but like I said that's an opinion because we don't know what Roy was thinking. It could also be argued that Roy anticipated the inside route because it appears he planted his left foot versus the right foot.

 

[khiladi]

If that were the case, why do we need umpteen threads with 100's of pages just to arrive at a simple conclusion?

It's Commander week. That should be our focus.

Was I speaking on every single one of these pages. Was every single page of this thread dedicated to the TD pass? I was having a discussion with Adam on this thread in the midst of the typical Roy-bashing, and we disagreed. He was kind enough to provide the pictures last night about our dispute, and I saw what he wrote about our discussion today.

That is why I commented on them. I wasn't commenting on every single Roy related portion of this thread.

 

[TVMan]

Was I speaking on every single one of these pages. Was every single page of this thread dedicated to the TD pass? I was having a discussion with Adam on this thread in the midst of the typical Roy-bashing, and we disagreed. He was kind enough to provide the pictures last night about our dispute, and I saw what he wrote about our discussion today.

That is why I commented on them. I wasn't commenting on every single Roy related portion of this thread.

I realize that and I wasn't pointing that in your direction at all.

The truth of the matter in my opinion, is Roy had good coverage. His only option was to go through Shockey to make a play on the ball. He chose not to.

 

[khiladi]

Dude it's a pointless discussion. This isn't like electric football (you know with the little plastic men with the green bases) where you can place a player in a position to where you feel he will be successful. I've looked at the picture and I've given my opinion.

And I've given my opinion, and my reasoning for it. If Roy took the inside route, why was he so far back, considering Shockey made his break when Roy was at the goal-line. Your first comment of the day is why this thread has continued, considering it is obvious that Roy was playing the inside route, and your saying I have no right to dipsute that?

And then you make 'emphatic' rock, paper, and scissors comments, coupled with the sarcasm in statements such as the following:

We are off to the best season since 95, and people want to argue about Roy Williams coverage on a TD play against a perennial TE who used his 6'5" frame to catch a ball that was thrown on his left outside shoulder when Roy was playing the inside......go figure

But yeah, continue on with your cheerleading and giving each other hi-fives...

 

[dcowboysfan76]

I realize that and I wasn't pointing that in your direction at all.

The truth of the matter in my opinion, is Roy had good coverage. His only option was to go through Shockey to make a play on the ball. He chose not to.

Exactly, that would have been an obvious PI call....had the ball been thrown on the inside Roy could've easily defended the play. Now hypothetically if it were thrown to the inside and Roy allowed it, could've made for a better argument....

 

[dallasfaniac]

I'm done arguing with people who have the veil of anonymnity and for all I know could be blind in their left eye, 8 years old and retrieving the tee on kickoffs in Pop Warner was the extent of their football experience.

For me it all comes down to two people. Aikman said Roy had good coverage but a better throw that Roy wouldn't have been able to defend and Wade who said Roy had a good game, that the linebackers messed up on some coverages.

 

[dcowboysfan76]

And I've given my opinion, and my reasoning for it. If Roy took the inside route, why was he so far back, considering Shockey made his break when Roy was at the goal-line. Your first comment of the day is why this thread has continued, considering it is obvious that Roy was playing the inside route, and your saying I have no right to dipsute that?

And then you make 'emphatic' rock, paper, and scissors comments, coupled with the sarcasm in statements such as the following:



But yeah, continue on with your cheerleading and giving each other hi-fives...

And yet you are the only one who's blind to the fact that Roy had good coverage for once, but was disadvantaged by a good throw....You know these are the kinds of plays that get so-called experts on the Roy Bash wagon and will have them showing this play over and over. However, for once I have to disagree with them.

Ok

 

[dcowboysfan76]

I'm done arguing with people who have the veil of anonymnity and for all I know could be blind in their left eye, 8 years old and retrieving the tee on kickoffs in Pop Warner was the extent of their football experience.

For me it all comes down to two people. Aikman said Roy had good coverage but a better throw that Roy wouldn't have been able to defend and Wade who said Roy had a good game, that the linebackers messed up on some coverages.

:horse:

 

[khiladi]

I realize that and I wasn't pointing that in your direction at all.

The truth of the matter in my opinion, is Roy had good coverage. His only option was to go through Shockey to make a play on the ball. He chose not to.

So he had good coverage, but the only way to make the play on the ball was to go through Shockey? Logically, this would entail that Roy was behind Shockey, meaning he did not have good coverage, nor did he have the inside route to play the ball, which is exactly what I stated.

 

[Mavs Man]

I realize that and I wasn't pointing that in your direction at all.

The truth of the matter in my opinion, is Roy had good coverage. His only option was to go through Shockey to make a play on the ball. He chose not to.

I don't see why he couldn't. Happens when I'm playing the computer on 2k5 all the time. :laugh2:

 

[TVMan]

So he had good coverage, but the only way to make the play on the ball was to go through Shockey? Logically, this would entail that Roy was behind Shockey, meaning he did not have good coverage, nor did he have the inside route to play the ball, which is exactly what I stated.

OK.

You are right and so am I.

There's no need to get ulcers over this.

:laugh2:

 

[dcowboysfan76]

So he had good coverage, but the only way to make the play on the ball was to go through Shockey? Logically, this would entail that Roy was behind Shockey, meaning he did not have good coverage, nor did he have the inside route to play the ball, which is exactly what I stated.

Ok, Roy Williams is 6'0", Shockey is 6'5". Looking at how the refs allow so many PI calls, what do you think would've happen if Roy was on the inside of Shockey. Also, don't you think the ball would've been thrown to the back of the endzone over Roy's head? Then you would've been arguing that Roy could've cut Shockey off and made him run to the inside....That's why I said it's like rock, paper, scissors...The probabilities are endless.

 

[TVMan]

I don't see why he couldn't. Happens when I'm playing the computer on 2k5 all the time. :laugh2:

:laugh1:, I blame Madden for all of this.

 

[smarta5150]

So he had good coverage, but the only way to make the play on the ball was to go through Shockey? Logically, this would entail that Roy was behind Shockey, meaning he did not have good coverage, nor did he have the inside route to play the ball, which is exactly what I stated.

Its funny because if Roy actually got in FRONT of Shockey and Shockey's pattern was a corner route to the back of the endzone you would be here complainiong how Roy should have been in better position to defend the back of the endzone.

Here's the thing, the offensive player KNOWS the route and the defender must react and even sometimes guess.

Roy was in good position for EITHER pattern making it good coverage.

Unfortunately Eli made a perfect throw to Shockey's back shoulder.

If we could ask Eli about the play he would answer something like this... I saw a Cowboys defender [Roy Williams] on Shockey's inside shoulder so I put the ball in position where only my guy could go get it.

End of strory. Wait till this Sunday so you have some more time to better gameplan your agenda.

Until, do us all a favor and give it a rest.

 

[dcowboysfan76]

:laugh1:, I blame Madden for all of this.

I blame Fantasy Football......or the office football boards

 

[dcowboysfan76]

Its funny because if Roy actually got in FRONT of Shockey and Shockey's pattern was a corner route to the back of the endzone you would be here complainiong how Roy should have been in better position to defend the back of the endzone.

Here's the thing, the offensive player KNOWS the route and the defender must react and even sometimes guess.

Roy was in good position for EITHER pattern making it good coverage.

Unfortunately Eli made a perfect throw to Shockey's back shoulder.

If we could ask Eli about the play he would answer something like this... I saw a Cowboys defender [Roy Williams] on Shockey's inside shoulder so I put the ball in position where only my guy could go get it.

End of strory. Wait till this Sunday so you have some more time to better gameplan your agenda.

Until, do us all a favor and give it a rest.

I wish that Everson Walls could read this post, because the beginning of it reminds me of the Dwight Clark catch in the back of the endzone....:bang2: