Russia invades Ukraine *** READ RULES IN POST 6 BEFORE POSTING ***

[Roadtrip635]

Russian crematoria operating in Mariupol: 'This is the new Auschwitz,' mayor says

The Mariupol City Council on Wednesday accused Russian forces of relying on a mobile crematorium to cover up their alleged war crimes in the southeast port city of Ukraine.

Mariupol, which has been partially occupied for weeks, has been the target of one of the most brutal Russian offensives in Ukraine since the invasion began in February.
"The killers are covering their tracks," the city council said in several social media posts, adding that the Russians have set up "mobile crematoriums."

"Russia’s top leadership ordered the destruction of any evidence of crimes committed by its army in Mariupol," the council added in a translated statement, accusing Moscow of reacting to widespread condemnation over mass civilian killings in Bucha.

The city council further claimed that Russian forces are removing potential witnesses to "filtration camps" – a claim echoed Tuesday by U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Linda Thomas-Greenfield, who said she has seen "credible reports" supporting such accusations.
https://www.foxnews.com/world/russian-crematoria-mariupol-new-auschwitz-mayor

 

[Roadtrip635]

 

[Roadtrip635]

Russian tanks are death traps.

Big lesson from this war: drones > tanks

 

[Roadtrip635]

 

[Roadtrip635]

 

[Roadtrip635]

Putin's decision to invade Ukraine is backfiring in so many ways..........

Finland to clarify next steps on possible NATO entry within weeks

Finland will clarify next steps regarding a possible decision to seek NATO membership in the coming weeks, Foreign Minister Pekka Haavisto told reporters after attending a NATO foreign ministers' meeting in Brussels on Thursday.

He said the government will next week give the Finnish parliament a review on how Russia's decision to attack Ukraine has changed Finland's security. But he added the government was prepared to quickly propose joining NATO if there was sufficient support from parliament.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europ...try-within-weeks-foreign-minister-2022-04-07/

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Interesting piece of footage...

A Ukrainian BTR-4, which is an armoured personnel carrier– but also carries some anti-tank weaponry... Comes up behind two Russian tanks and starts firing its 30mm autocannon.

A 30mm round wouldn't do squat to the if it was shooting at the front hull of those tanks–But the rear of those tanks are a totally different matter as you see the first tank stopping pretty quickly while the second tank attempts to get away but it appears the engine compartment catches fire and the tank halts.

The "laser light" shots are tracer rounds...



Another good example of what happens when unsupported armour gets caught in an urban area without infantry support.

 

[triplets_93]

Hundreds of American tanks and armored cars arrive in Vlissingen

https://www.europereloaded.com/thou...anks-and-armored-cars-arriving-in-vlissingen/

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

I remember when I was in Basic at Fort Bliss in El Paso.
That installation was for the 56th ada Air Defense and we would occasionally see soldiers from different countries training there.

Have to wonder if they will be getting an influx of Ukranian soldiers as of late.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

 

[JJHLH1]

Why Ukraine is winning.

 

[RJ_MacReady]

Why Ukraine is winning.

I keep reading that Ukraine has been winning and kicking so much butt, that Russian is simply outclassed, etc.... so I have to ask the obvious:

Then why is Zelensky still begging for the West to get involved further than what we have (supplies/munitions)?

 

[JJHLH1]

I keep reading that Ukraine has been winning and kicking so much butt, that Russian is simply outclassed, etc.... so I have to ask the obvious:

Then why is Zelensky still begging for the West to get involved further than what we have (supplies/munitions)?

I think the answer is that even though the Ukraine military is defeating the Russian military on the battlefield, causing Russia to retreat in many places, Russia is taking their frustrations out on innocent Ukrainian civilians who have no way to defend themselves from the atrocities being committed.

Zelensky wants more help to defeat Russia sooner, as opposed to a years-long war of attrition where neither side can gain much ground and thousands more civilians are murdered.

Now is a particularly important time to get help while the Russian military is back on its heels, before they have time to regroup.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I keep reading that Ukraine has been winning and kicking so much butt, that Russian is simply outclassed, etc.... so I have to ask the obvious:

Then why is Zelensky still begging for the West to get involved further than what we have (supplies/munitions)?

It's a good question...

The Ukraine army held the advantage on the attacks coming from the north. The Russian army had few roads to travel on and their columns were subsequently ambushed and easily assaulted in urban areas due to the lack of Russian infantry on the ground.

It was a "perfect storm" where small unit tactics combined with high-powered weaponry were able to defeat vast armoured columns.

The battle in the east and south feature territory that is much more open.

I've heard the phrase "Will be more like WWII tanks battles" where wide, sweeping attacks can occur. Ukraine is looking for more equipment in order to "even the playing field" in those types of engagements. Even though the Russian army has taken a beating it still has quite a bit of equipment in the south and east.

I give the Ukrainians all the credit in the world for what they accomplished in the north. And if they can start moving the Russians back in the south & east I will be double impressed because that will be a tall-order indeed.

So anyway, that's why additional military equipment is being asked for by Zelensky.

 

[RJ_MacReady]

I think the answer is that even though the Ukraine military is defeating the Russian military on the battlefield, causing Russia to retreat in many places, Russia is taking their frustrations out on innocent Ukrainian civilians who have no way to defend themselves from the atrocities being committed.

Zelensky wants more help to defeat Russia sooner, as opposed to a years-long war of attrition where neither side can gain much ground and thousands more civilians are murdered.

Now is a particularly important time to get help while the Russian military is back on its heels, before they have time to regroup.

Got it. Thanks.

So let me ask you a few questions, since you seem to be following all of this through social media:
1. What, exactly, is it that the West should be providing to Ukraine that'll help 'em over the hump? NATO jets engaging Russian aircraft via no-fly-zone? Boots on ground?
2. Are you in any way concerned about the conflict escalation and further response that Russia will take?

 

[Reality]

Got it. Thanks.

So let me ask you a few questions, since you seem to be following all of this through social media:
1. What, exactly, is it that the West should be providing to Ukraine that'll help 'em over the hump? NATO jets engaging Russian aircraft via no-fly-zone? Boots on ground?
2. Are you in any way concerned about the conflict escalation and further response that Russia will take?

Those questions have already been discussed a few times in this thread so you may want to go back and read through some of the older pages if you have time.

As far as I know, most people here are not pushing for direct NATO/US involvement but are behind providing help in other areas such as military equipment, supplies, intelligence, real-time satellite data, etc.

A few members do not want the US helping in any manner but there is civility among those with differing opinions.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

I keep reading that Ukraine has been winning and kicking so much butt, that Russian is simply outclassed, etc.... so I have to ask the obvious:

Then why is Zelensky still begging for the West to get involved further than what we have (supplies/munitions)?

Because their cities are being destroyed at distance. You also can’t account for sheer numbers.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

I keep reading that Ukraine has been winning and kicking so much butt, that Russian is simply outclassed, etc.... so I have to ask the obvious:

Then why is Zelensky still begging for the West to get involved further than what we have (supplies/munitions)?

I think it is fair to give a deal of credit to the Ukranian's President, the people's resolve and other countries providing support through training, logistics, supplies and intel.

However I think it is also fair to say that this Russian invasion and lack of it's success happens to be due to Poor leadership of Putin and his generals.
Some soldiers had no clue they were actually going into battle. They were just being told it was training exercises.
The supply trains to the soldiers were very bad and should cause any military leader his job.
The long convoys of vehicles just going down the road bumper to bumper for easy targets was insane and again should cost a military leader his job.
The idea that huge numbers of russian soldiers were without food and abandoning their vehicles while also not destroying them and the ordiance to keep them out of the hands of the ukranians was crazy. You are handing an opposing army vehicles and ordinance when you have a greater number in the bean count scenario.


So give credit to the Ukranian people, but also at the same time you can blame the invading force for woefully underestimating it's target, for terrible planning and leadership.

It amazes me that a country like russia who has a vastly superior number of ground air and water vehicles, who should at the very least be able to completely control the water and air military is still struggling is why many consider the ukranians winning at this point.

Many believed they might put up a resistance but in no way would be able to compete this long against such a perceived force. I think most believed that Russia was going to make short work of this. I think Putin thought that a former actor who is the current leader of Ukranain would tuck tail, give up and run away. I think Putin thought that the Ukrainians would bow down and give up easily like the chechian situation. Putin thought wrong and it is costing him a lot more soldiers, equipment and time.
I also think he failed to think that the other countries would put as harsh sanctions on him and russia as they did.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Got it. Thanks.

So let me ask you a few questions, since you seem to be following all of this through social media:
1. What, exactly, is it that the West should be providing to Ukraine that'll help 'em over the hump? NATO jets engaging Russian aircraft via no-fly-zone? Boots on ground?
2. Are you in any way concerned about the conflict escalation and further response that Russia will take?

I think it has become even more critical that NATO does not take any part in this as far as NATO affiliated soldiers, sailors or pilots crossing over the border into Ukraine.

Why?

Think of it this way...

If there is anything that can be taken from this war, and that is the Russian military is far less polished than what most experts believed initially.

And the leadership of Russia has seen the same thing.

The result being if there was any direct NATO involvement in this conflict Putin would be even more likely to use tactical nukes because he knows their conventional military would collapse.

 

[MaineBoy]

I think it has become even more critical that NATO does not take any part in this as far as NATO affiliated soldiers, sailors or pilots crossing over the border into Ukraine.

Why?

Think of it this way...

If there is anything that can be taken from this war, and that is the Russian military is far less polished than what most experts believed initially.

And the leadership of Russia has seen the same thing.

The result being if there was any direct NATO involvement in this conflict Putin would be even more likely to use tactical nukes because he knows their conventional military would collapse.

I don’t know anymore. Sitting back and letting Putin massacre and murder innocent woman and children ? It’s Hitler and Stalin all over again. Is this how the world has progressed in the 60ish years since those
monsters ? NATO and the EU have given Putin a red line in regards to using chemical and biological weapons. They should add targeting and murdering civilians to the red line: you massacre civilians and there will be a no fly zone within 48 hours.
Also tiring too of the fear of Putin saber rattling his nukes. Based on his army’s recent performance, he’d be lucky to get a nuke fired successfully - or have it not turn around and land in Moscow. Call the bully’s bluff: I highly doubt that his rich buddies and generals want their families to die to follow this Stalin wannabe. Plus, he and they know the WEST outclasses them militarily - including nukes - and that they would be on the receiving end of an infinitely more devastating response. This appeasement stuff leading to murdering innocents is hard to watch.