SC Pass Defenses

[ThreeSportStar80]

I'll agree with that ranking largely due to the fact there's question marks at safety. Roy Williams is a great hitter and tackler but after that he's average, he needs to add that Ronnie Lott dimension to his game. Keith Davis and the rest will have to step it up big time. Newman is one of the premiere cover corners in the league without a doubt, Henry is the best all around corner because he's a gambler and Glenn just has a nose for the ball.

 

[yennor24]

Im a Cowboy fan, Sean Taylor is better than Roy......

 

[skinsfunguy]

you should have looked up their 40 times, since Roy ran faster than AA I am trying to figure out how AA is "a lot" faster.



Taylor is not as great in coverage as you are spewing, even Commander fans can acknowledge this when they are being honest



You realize of Course Newman had a better rookie year right? Pro Bowl alternate, runner up for DROY man you really stink at this whole forum thing.





Now try again with some true statements instead of made up BS

Dont talk about made up BS if you are the one spewing it. Look up Archiuleta and RW's times and you will see that Archuleta is indeed faster.

Even HeavyHitta31 acknowledged this

" Archuleta runs a 4.42, Roy runs 4.51. That's hardly "a lot" by any standard."

Now if you want proof from me, I'll be glad to help you out.

"Working out in front of NFL scouts in Indianapolis this past February, St. Louis Rams first-round draft pick Adam Archuleta posted some of the most impressive results for a safety in the 17-year history of the NFL Draft Combine. The 6-foot, 211-pound Archuleta ran a 4.42 40, had a 39-inch vertical jump and bench-pressed 225 pounds 31 times."
http://archive.profootballweekly.com/content/archives2001/features_2001/nawrocki_061901.asp
4.53 in the 40-yard dash … 2.67 20-yard dash … 1.62 10-yard dash … 30.5-inch vertical jump … 9'7" broad jump … 10.9 100-meter dash … Bench presses 225 pounds 13 times … 32½-inch arm length … 10 1/2-inch hands.
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2002/profiles/williams_roy.htm#agility

 

[superpunk]

Those stats are all fine and dandy except when you take into account Rogers rarely saw the field until midway thought the season.(not because he wasn't ready, but because Williams does this with all his rookies. See Sean Taylor)

Good thing he didn't start full time. In 5 starts he had 1 INT and 2 PDs. Even with all his playing time - and he did get significant playing time from week 3 on - his stats were mediocre and not even close to approaching Newman's DROY-runner up year.

Now if you really want to talk about a bad season, go ahead and look at Newman's second season.

Hell, extrapolated out, Rogers didn't even come close to Newman's "terrible" second season, while Newman was playing on one of the most terrible defenses I've ever seen.

Maybe if you're lucky, next year ONE of your two supposedly rock-solid corners will approach Newman's level of productive consistency.

But I doubt it - since neither of them have ever even come close.

 

[superpunk]

I also can't fathom the entire ranking system. There seems to be absolutely no rhyme or reason to their method.

For example, last year two of the most maligned pass defenses were those of the New York Giants, and the San Diego Chargers. Their defensive pass rankings were almost identical. San Diego, however, produced more sacks with their front seven than the Giants. The Chargers were ranked next to last, I believe, and the Giants were ranked 11th. Now, are Sam Madison and LaVar Arrington worth 20 spots in the rankings? Maybe 3 years ago.

This only perpetuates my idea that the media is always a good 2 to 3 years behind the actual developments in the NFL. They still believe Arrington is a good player, they still believe the NBA's Western Conference is far superior to the East, and they still believe the AFC is dominant of the NFC.

Give 'em time.

When we're hoisting that championship banner next September, they'll catch up.

 

[Manster68]

Must I need to remind you that Newman played that second season with a bad leg?

 

[CrazyCowboy]

I cannot believe some of this stuff.....well see.

 

[Gamebreaker]

Hell, extrapolated out, Rogers didn't even come close to Newman's "terrible" second season, while Newman was playing on one of the most terrible defenses I've ever seen.

Maybe if you're lucky, next year ONE of your two supposedly rock-solid corners will approach Newman's level of productive consistency.

But I doubt it - since neither of them have ever even come close.

So neither of our starting corners, including Springs, has ever come close to Terrence Newman? Spare me.

Most of the stats I've seen in this thread don't really show how well a corner plays his position. Tackles is a subjective stat for cornerbacks, the corner could've either been a real force in run support or burnt a whole lot by his man and made alot of tackles after the catch. Interceptions are NEVER a good indicator of who's good or not, especially if a cornerback isn't being tested often. For years I've wished the NFL or other media outlets would choose a new way of collecting stats on defensive backs.

Rogers didn't start from the beginning the same way any rookie doesn't start for Gregg Williams' defense. When he did play, he rarely gave up big plays and was solid in run support. I've seen rookie corners play alot worse. I have never seen or heard of any media outlet in DC calling Rogers "Toast". If they did, I have no idea what games they were watching, or if they were getting Rogers confused with Walt Harris.

I'm not going to back up the assertion that Rogers was the best rookie corner last season. I didn't watch very much of the other rookie corners. I do recall hearing rumors of the Titans coaching staff not being impressed with Pacman Jones, but the best way to know how good a corner is to actually watch the majority of their games. Since there is never a stat that shows how much a corner got beat. Unless someone actually watched the majority of the games both corners performed in, I don't see how anyone can make any assertions for one or the other.

 

[apickmans]

So neither of our starting corners, including Springs, has ever come close to Terrence Newman? Spare me.

Most of the stats I've seen in this thread don't really show how well a corner plays his position. Tackles is a subjective stat for cornerbacks, the corner could've either been a real force in run support or burnt a whole lot by his man and made alot of tackles after the catch. Interceptions are NEVER a good indicator of who's good or not, especially if a cornerback isn't being tested often. For years I've wished the NFL or other media outlets would choose a new way of collecting stats on defensive backs.

Rogers didn't start from the beginning the same way any rookie doesn't start for Gregg Williams' defense. When he did play, he rarely gave up big plays and was solid in run support. I've seen rookie corners play alot worse. I have never seen or heard of any media outlet in DC calling Rogers "Toast". If they did, I have no idea what games they were watching, or if they were getting Rogers confused with Walt Harris.

I'm not going to back up the assertion that Rogers was the best rookie corner last season. I didn't watch very much of the other rookie corners. I do recall hearing rumors of the Titans coaching staff not being impressed with Pacman Jones, but the best way to know how good a corner is to actually watch the majority of their games. Since there is never a stat that shows how much a corner got beat. Unless someone actually watched the majority of the games both corners performed in, I don't see how anyone can make any assertions for one or the other.

Yeah i have never heard the "toast" nickname either, haha maybe something made up by cowboy fans to make Rogers seem bad. I like where the Commanders are with their secondary, ill just leave it at that.

 

[Ren]

Im a Cowboy fan, Sean Taylor is better than Roy......

At what, crime?

 

[Vintage]

Now if you really want to talk about a bad season, go ahead and look at Newman's second season.

This is from AdamJT13. Enjoy.

According to ESPN's KC Joyner, who broke down the tapes of every game, Newman finished that season eighth-best among cornerbacks in completion percentage allowed (46.6), eighth-best in yards allowed per attempt (5.8) and 14th-best in percentage of tight/good coverage. Out of the 70 cornerbacks who played the most in 2004, Newman ranked sixth-best overall, according to those stats by Joyner.

The only place Newman's 2004 season was "horrid" is in the misperception of some fans who remember his few bad games and forget all of the games that season when he completely shut down his opponent.

Care to comment? If Newman was as terrible as you say in 2004.....then a ton of CBs were.

I await your response.

 

[Doomsdayblitz]

I thought our pass defense was higher than 16 last year. If so, then how can they rate us worse than last year, when the defensive rookies, (Ware, Spears, Canty, & Ratliff), have a year under their belt, we brought in Ayodele & Boiman, and two other rookies, Kevin Burnett & Thomas "Pepper" Johnson, are coming back healthy from IR. Add to that the emphasis on defense in drafting Carpenter, Hatcher, & Watkins, and I just can't see how we will be going "backwards" this year on pass defense.

Ayodele, Carpenter, and Hatcher were all very effective in rushing the passer in college. Ayodele didn't get much of a chance to do that with his former team, but I hope we work him into blitz packages. Same w/Burnett. Too many want to write him off already, when he was picked by many last year to go in the first rd. He is a very athletic player who can be very effective in blitz packages with he speed & intensity.

The Cowboys should end up in the top 10 this year in pass defense, and even better against the run.

 

[The30YardSlant]

Wow, ignorance is bliss.

I agree, you must be one happy camper

 

[cowboyfreak]

Im a Cowboy fan, Sean Taylor is better than Roy......

I'm a Cowboy fan,

At what?

They play different positions.

 

[DCBoysfan]

Sean Taylor
Adam Archuleta
Shawn Springs
Carlos Rogers

All first round talents. Where is the weakness? Tell me please.

Adam Archuleta is not good in coverage, Shawn Springs is over 30 and has injury problems almost his entire career. Carlos Roges has to show he can do it for second season and Sean Taylor is a very good player, I m not going to take any thing away from him. But your secondary does have its share of issues.

 

[The30YardSlant]

So neither of our starting corners, including Springs, has ever come close to Terrence Newman? Spare me.

Most of the stats I've seen in this thread don't really show how well a corner plays his position. Tackles is a subjective stat for cornerbacks, the corner could've either been a real force in run support or burnt a whole lot by his man and made alot of tackles after the catch. Interceptions are NEVER a good indicator of who's good or not, especially if a cornerback isn't being tested often. For years I've wished the NFL or other media outlets would choose a new way of collecting stats on defensive backs.

Rogers didn't start from the beginning the same way any rookie doesn't start for Gregg Williams' defense. When he did play, he rarely gave up big plays and was solid in run support. I've seen rookie corners play alot worse. I have never seen or heard of any media outlet in DC calling Rogers "Toast". If they did, I have no idea what games they were watching, or if they were getting Rogers confused with Walt Harris.

I'm not going to back up the assertion that Rogers was the best rookie corner last season. I didn't watch very much of the other rookie corners. I do recall hearing rumors of the Titans coaching staff not being impressed with Pacman Jones, but the best way to know how good a corner is to actually watch the majority of their games. Since there is never a stat that shows how much a corner got beat. Unless someone actually watched the majority of the games both corners performed in, I don't see how anyone can make any assertions for one or the other.

Ok, I get it....

Numbers only matter when they help prove YOUR point, however when discussing Washington's vastly overrated secondary, they don't mean anything.

Brilliant

Let me ask you something: Were you simply born with this sickening level of ignorance and bias, or did it come about through many years of hard work and dedicated practice?

 

[superpunk]

So neither of our starting corners, including Springs, has ever come close to Terrence Newman? Spare me.

You got it.

 

[Gamebreaker]

Ok, I get it....

After reading your post, evidently, you must not understand english very well. So no, you don't get it at all.

Numbers only matter when they help prove YOUR point, however when discussing Washington's vastly overrated secondary, they don't mean anything.

Hmm, let's see. You want numbers? Our pass defense was ranked higher than yours last season. Happy? How about you stop acting like a buffoon, and counter my statement of traditional statistics not being helpful in ranking or determining the quality of a cornerback instead of writing a whole bunch of nothing.

 

[Vintage]

Again, for whoever said we wished Newman had a rookie year like Carlos Rogers had...

According to ESPN's KC Joyner, who broke down the tapes of every game, Newman finished that season eighth-best among cornerbacks in completion percentage allowed (46.6), eighth-best in yards allowed per attempt (5.8) and 14th-best in percentage of tight/good coverage. Out of the 70 cornerbacks who played the most in 2004, Newman ranked sixth-best overall, according to those stats by Joyner.

The only place Newman's 2004 season was "horrid" is in the misperception of some fans who remember his few bad games and forget all of the games that season when he completely shut down his opponent.

From AdamJT13...

Comments Commander fans?

 

[MossBurner]

I just can't see how we will be going "backwards" this year on pass defense.

Henry and Glenn got older. FS didn't improve. Others got better.