Shanahan comment about Romo

[KJJ]

Chiefs are 5-0
49's are the defending NFC Champions

Neither of those QB's are elite yet they both have experienced success.

Now how have they managed to accomplish that?

Manning has played in ONE more SB than Kaepernik and literally threw that one away. Just like he did his team's championship hopes just last season.

Ball control and strong defense still wins when the best are playing the best.

How would you describe the strengths of BOTH SB teams last year?

They've managed success because their QB's are not turning the ball over in critical situations. Smith has added stability to the Chiefs which is something they didn't have at the QB position last season. This is why they traded for him. KC won a close game over the Cowboys partly due to Smith playing very efficiently and not making any critical mistakes. Romo on the other hand made an awful play calling decision inside the Chefs 10 yard line changing the play and going to Williams on a screen who was surrounded by defenders on a 3rd down play. As for Kaepernick he was tremendous last season which is why SF made it to the SB. He hasn't been as good so far this season which is one reason SF has already lost 2 games in which they were dominated. Kaepernick already has 4 int's compared to 3 all of last season. His passer rating last season was 98.3 compared to 81.9 this season.

The strengths of both SB teams last season was the play of their QB's especially Flacco during the postseason. Baltimore won the SB with a defense that ranked 14 spots lower than SF. That was the worst defensive team the Ravens have had in years. They had much better defenses in 08 and 09 but lost the AFC title games those years due to Flacco's poor play and turnovers. Flacco's TD to turnover ratio in the playoffs and SB was 11-0 and his passer rating was 117.2 . He had no running game in the SB Rice averaged 3.0 a carry and his defense gave up well over 400 yards and 31 points almost blowing a 17 point lead. Flacco's improved play in the playoffs proved to be the difference for Baltimore last season. SF had a terrific team in 2011 but couldn't reach the SB because Alex Smith wasn't productive enough in the NFC title game. Eli outplayed him which is why he was eventually replaced by Kaepernick who's a more dynamic player at the position.

 

[jobberone]

Defense wins Super Bowls folks. Top 4 Qb's in the League (and arguably some of the best ever) Peyton, Tom, Drew, Aaron. Only one has more than 1 SB and he had one of the best defenses around when he got all three. Every appearance since he's been beaten by Eli and the Giants then studded defense.

It was a long time axiom that you needed 25+ ppg on offense and 17 or less on defense to be a consistent winner. To have a championship defense you're talking about something like the 2000 Ravens who gave up 168 points at 10.5 ppg. Overall league points have gone up in roughly the last 30 years from a low in 93 of 8377 points to a high of 11651 last year. We have gone from 28 to 32 teams in that time though. Since 2002 (32 teams) the range of the league avg has been 330-364 points per team.

Right now I'd say a more refined winning formula is to play pass defense better than your opponent, have a better scoring% and RZ%, and win the turnover and field position battles. If you want to add in defensive and ST scoring then that's more refined. Of course those include offensive, defensive, and ST efficiency. Rushing stats aren't as predictive but the axiom now is you must be able to rush effectively.

 

[Cebrin]

No one is saying a good defense isn't important but all defenses bend today due to the rule changes that have handicapped defenders. Defenders have to think before they react or it can result in a fine or suspension. The NFL wants to promote safety and scoring. Years ago SB's use to be blowouts now practically every SB is going down to the wire due to the rules and prolific passing attacks. Defenses today have to deal with quick slot receivers and athletic TE's who are like huge WR's. The WR's today are 6' 2" to 6' 5" 210-230 lbs and can run 4.4 40's. They create all kinds of matchup problems along with these quick slot receivers who can find seams. It's a very different game today than when Elway, Aikman and Montana played so it's ridiculous to compare stats of QB's today with QB's from 2-3 decades ago. QB's today are protected more than ever before. You can't hit them high, low or a fraction too late. Everything in todays game has been bent to help offenses and protect players especially the QB which is why QB's efficiency ratings are so high today compared to years ago.

It was hard for QB's to complete 60% of their passes 20 years ago now we're seeing QB's complete 70-80% of their passes. In less than half a season Peyton Manning will surpass Aikman's career best for TD passes in a season. That's where the game is today. If you put every penny you had that Romo would have won the SB with SF last season you would be living in a cardboard box somewhere. Kaepernick is a duel threat QB who looks to throw first run second. Romo could have never made some of the clutch plays he made last season because he's not a clutch performer in spotlighted/elimination games. Romo would have never been able to bring SF back from a 17 point deficit in the SB because he's failed miserably in adverse situations in do or die games which is why he has 12 turnovers in his 6 elimination game losses. He loses his poise in those situations and it leads to multiple turnovers. To say he could win championships with other teams is pure fantasy because in todays game QB's have to be clutch in the playoffs and SB regardless of the team around them. At some point a game is going to be on the QB's shoulders where they have to make a play. The last 4 SB MVP's have all been QB's. Romo has proven time and time again that he is incapable of making plays in critical situations in spotlighted/elimination games especially on the road in a hostile environment.

Of Romo's 12 elimination game turnovers 11 of them have come on the road. In 06 Romo had two 1000 yard receivers and a 1000 yard back. In 07 he was surrounded by a team that went 13-3 and had 13 pro bowlers but in the game that mattered most that season he didn't have it. He's a great statistical regular season QB who can't avoid the big mistake at the worst possible time in the games that matter most. As the years have gone by his choking problem has gotten worse. Practically every big game ends with him turning the ball over. Landry would have never won a championship if Roger Staubach didn't come along. Meredith was good, Morton was good and so was Danny White they all won more playoff games than Romo but they weren't clutch and Staubach was that was the difference. Romo is the greatest statistical QB the Cowboys have ever had but unfortunately he's the worst big game QB in franchise history.

SF 2012 49ers Allowed 273 points (17.1/g), 2nd in NFL. Scored 397 points (24.8/g), 11th of 32 in the NFL. Colin threw a whole 10 TD's on the season. Wow. What a spectacular QB. It must have been him that made them go to the SB.
Dallas 2006 Allowed 350 points (21.9/g), 20th in NFL. Scored 425 points (26.6/g), 4th in NFL. in the NFL. 9-7.
Dallas 2007 Allowed 325 points (20.3/g), 13th in NFL. They were SECOND IN SCORING. Still not a top ten D. That's Tony Romo. They had to play the Giants 3 TIMES. The third time they lost. It's almost impossible to beat a good football team 3 times in a season, let alone a competent a division rival. You don't have to argue with me anymore. You're clearly always going to hate Romo and I'm a Romosexual.

 

[Cebrin]

It was a long time axiom that you needed 25+ ppg on offense and 17 or less on defense to be a consistent winner. To have a championship defense you're talking about something like the 2000 Ravens who gave up 168 points at 10.5 ppg. Overall league points have gone up in roughly the last 30 years from a low in 93 of 8377 points to a high of 11651 last year. We have gone from 28 to 32 teams in that time though. Since 2002 (32 teams) the range of the league avg has been 330-364 points per team.

Right now I'd say a more refined winning formula is to play pass defense better than your opponent, have a better scoring% and RZ%, and win the turnover and field position battles. If you want to add in defensive and ST scoring then that's more refined. Of course those include offensive, defensive, and ST efficiency. Rushing stats aren't as predictive but the axiom now is you must be able to rush effectively.

Agreed. Pass defense is important, but you can't defend the pass well if you can't get pressure on the QB. Every role plays in unison with the other. We've got a lot of defensive holes to fill. Particularly the front 4. You can't expect your secondary to stick to the receiver for that long. We've generated no pass rush since the Rams game. Kiffin needs to blitz or something. It's awful.

 

[KJJ]

SF 2012 49ers Allowed 273 points (17.1/g), 2nd in NFL. Scored 397 points (24.8/g), 11th of 32 in the NFL. Colin threw a whole 10 TD's on the season. Wow. What a spectacular QB. It must have been him that made them go to the SB.
Dallas 2006 Allowed 350 points (21.9/g), 20th in NFL. Scored 425 points (26.6/g), 4th in NFL. in the NFL. 9-7.
Dallas 2007 Allowed 325 points (20.3/g), 13th in NFL. They were SECOND IN SCORING. Still not a top ten D. That's Tony Romo. They had to play the Giants 3 TIMES. The third time they lost. It's almost impossible to beat a good football team 3 times in a season, let alone a competent a division rival. You don't have to argue with me anymore. You're clearly always going to hate Romo and I'm a Romosexual.

That proves it's not all about stats it's about efficiency and not turning the ball over at the worst possible time. The Cowboys have lost a number of winnable games due to Romo's either being totally off his game or committing an ill-timed turnover. Kaepernick only tossed 3 int's last season and he made some big plays in critical games. In the playoffs vs Green Bay he had 444 total yards rushing/passing and 4 TD's. I don't hate Romo just telling it like it is about him not my fault some are in denial. The Cowboys will never win a championship with him and his apologists will continue to claim he's the greatest QB in franchise history due to his regular season stats.

 

[Cebrin]

Chiefs are 5-0
49's are the defending NFC Champions

Neither of those QB's are elite yet they both have experienced success.

Now how have they managed to accomplish that?

Manning has played in ONE more SB than Kaepernik and literally threw that one away. Just like he did his team's championship hopes just last season.

Ball control and strong defense still wins when the best are playing the best.

How would you describe the strengths of BOTH SB teams last year?

Remember these words. Manning will face a defense that's going to hand it to him. People are so enamored with him right now. It's coming.

 

[Cebrin]

That proves it's not all about stats it's about efficiency and not turning the ball over at the worst possible time. Kaepernick only tossed 3 int's last season and he made some big plays in critical games. In the playoffs vs Green Bay he had 444 total yards rushing/passing and 4 TD's. I don't hate Romo just telling it like it is about him. The Cowboys will never win a championship with him and his apologists will continue to claim he's the greatest QB in franchise history due to his regular season stats.

It proves he has the defense to only have to toss the ball a few times. A luxury our QB has never had. GB's defense was awful last year. Just terrible.

 

[jobberone]

Agreed. Pass defense is important, but you can't defend the pass well if you can't get pressure on the QB. Every role plays in unison with the other. We've got a lot of defensive holes to fill. Particularly the front 4. You can't expect your secondary to stick to the receiver for that long. We've generated no pass rush since the Rams game. Kiffin needs to blitz or something. It's awful.

Agreed. Pass defense rating is going to be determined by defensive pressure for sure. I've always thought that was the most important part of the equation. Todays pass offenses play to minimize pass pressure primarily by getting the ball out quickly, having a good enough OL to allow protection, QBs reading the defense well enough to change protection/formation and plays to counteract the defensive look and having enough balance to keep defenses off balance etc.

It's easy to say score 25+ and give up 17 or less but doing it is the hard part.

 

[KJJ]

It proves he has the defense to only have to toss the ball a few times. A luxury our QB has never had. GB's defense was awful last year. Just terrible.

He doesn't have to throw a lot because he also uses his legs to make plays. He puts up passing and rushing yards he provides a duel threat. He scored 3 rushing TD's in the playoffs last season. He had 7 starts last season and put up 415 rushing yards and 5 rushing TD's. You keep focusing on his passing numbers when rushing the ball is a big part of his game. GB's defense was horrible in 2011 ranking dead last and they had no running game but they went 15-1 due to the play of their QB.

 

[Cebrin]

He doesn't have to throw a lot because he also uses his legs to make plays. He puts up passing and rushing yards he provides a duel threat. He scored 3 rushing TD's in the playoffs last season. He had 7 starts last season and put up 415 rushing yards and 5 rushing TD's. You keep focusing on his passing numbers when rushing the ball is a big part of his game. GB's defense was horrible in 2011 ranking dead last and they had no running game but they went 15-1 due to the play of their QB.

He also had a RB who scored 9 Td's. They went 15-1 and were out in the playoffs. Just like Tony's high caliber offense that went 13-3. If the playoffs is all you want, good argument. I want a SB. You need a defense to make the big game and Kaepernick had one.

 

[Brooksey]

A good running game isn't going to prevent Romo from turning the ball over when a significant game is on the line. There's a reason he has 12 turnovers in 7 elimination games it's because he can't handle big game pressure. Big games come down to QB's having to make plays regardless of their running game. You have to pass the ball to win. On Monday Night Matt Ryan led the Falcons to a go ahead TD with about 2 minutes to play. That was a clutch drive. Then Geno Smith a ROOKIE got his chance and showed poise leading the Jets down the field with less than 2 minutes to play and put them in a position to win the game with a FG. He didn't turn the ball over in that situation he made plays.

He completed 4 passes and scrambled for 3 yards giving his team an opportunity to win the game with time running down. You don't see poise like that from Romo in those situations especially on the road. If you don't have a QB who can make plays in critical situations without turning the ball over you're never going to win a championship. The playoffs and SB's are all coming down to QB's having to make plays to win.

Tom Brady also threw a game ending pick last week, as did Russel Wilson and Eli Manning..I guess they are chokers too without poise...just like Peyton Manning in the playoffs last year. They all have no poise and fail at the biggest times. Oh but wait they have superbowl rings, so they get a free pass? Maybe in your world or the in the anti-dallas media that works.

Tony Romo has never had the defense, O-Line or the Running game to compete in 10-15 playoff games or i'm sure he would have a 8-10 wins and a ring. If you can't see that you talked yourself into it and maybe you shouldn't be a fan. Go jump on the Miami Dolphins bandwagon, Tannehill looks great.

 

[Cebrin]

He doesn't have to throw a lot because he also uses his legs to make plays. He puts up passing and rushing yards he provides a duel threat. He scored 3 rushing TD's in the playoffs last season. He had 7 starts last season and put up 415 rushing yards and 5 rushing TD's. You keep focusing on his passing numbers when rushing the ball is a big part of his game. GB's defense was horrible in 2011 ranking dead last and they had no running game but they went 15-1 due to the play of their QB.

I forgot to mention a really important factor for the GB Packers awful defense in 2011. Green Bay led the league with 40 takeaways and 30 interceptions.

 

[EPL0c0]

Let's go to the stats!

Through their first 98 regular season starts
John Elway: 1,665/3,070 (54.2%), 21,195 yds, 120 TDs, 114 Ints; Record: 64-33-1
Tony Romo: 2,232/3,428 (65.1%), 27,260 yds, 190 TDs, 93 Ints; Record: 57-41

 

[starfrombirth]

Elway won a number of playoff games including a clutch performance vs Cleveland in the 86 AFC Championship game (the drive) and played in 3 SB's before finally winning one. He showed he was a clutch performer even during the seasons when Denver kept coming up short. Elways teams got blown out in those SB's it wasn't like they were tight games and he folded in the end when he had to make a play. Denver got so far behind in those games he had to press. Elway played in more SB's than Romo has playoff appearances.

I don't suppose the Orange Crush had anything to do with that right?

 

[KJJ]

I don't suppose the Orange Crush had anything to do with that right?

They were known as the "Orange Crush" back in the late 70's when Roger Staubach handled them with ease in SB XII.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

Remember these words. Manning will face a defense that's going to hand it to him. People are so enamored with him right now. It's coming.

This is very true.


I still want a shot at him in Super Bowl. I think he can fold on the big stage....again.

 

[Cebrin]

I don't suppose the Orange Crush had anything to do with that right?

Your signature is the best, ever.

 

[KJJ]

I forgot to mention a really important factor for the GB Packers awful defense in 2011. Green Bay led the league with 40 takeaways and 30 interceptions.

They got takeaways but they also had a QB who's TD to turnover ratio was 45-6 that season. The Cowboys have had a number of takeaways this season but winning still comes down to offensive efficiency and your QB not committing turnovers at the worst possible time.

 

[Cebrin]

They got takeaways but they also had a QB who's TD to turnover ratio was 45-6 that season. The Cowboys have had a number of takeaways this season but winning still comes down to offensive efficiency and your QB not committing turnovers at the worst possible time.

You are seriously laughable. Agree to disagree on Tony. It was a historical year for Rodgers much less any QB ever. All of that flair and he still didn't make it past the first round of the playoffs. The year he did win a superbowl The Packers defense ranked second in the league in fewest points allowed per game.

 

[dragon_mikal]

That proves it's not all about stats it's about efficiency and not turning the ball over at the worst possible time. The Cowboys have lost a number of winnable games due to Romo's either being totally off his game or committing an ill-timed turnover. Kaepernick only tossed 3 int's last season and he made some big plays in critical games. In the playoffs vs Green Bay he had 444 total yards rushing/passing and 4 TD's. I don't hate Romo just telling it like it is about him not my fault some are in denial. The Cowboys will never win a championship with him and his apologists will continue to claim he's the greatest QB in franchise history due to his regular season stats.

The Cowboys have won more games because of Romo than lost. Simple as that.

The Cowboys can win a Super Bowl with Romo. Not saying they will but he is certainly good enough to get them there if everything falls into place at the right time.

Your points might be taken more seriously if you refrained from using "never" and using Kaepernick as a comparison. He's been bad this season and there is no comparison between him and Romo. ( Romo is the far superior quarterback )