so no brewster and Bright either.

burmafrd

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Joe Rod;4008667 said:
I think you forgot Al Johnson (2nd round)!!!

Yeah. Wow did forget about him. But you could say he was not bad. He did start for us for a couple of years. His problem was that he was too light and could not keep his weight up; got blown off the ball too much. Didn't he get caught doing roids?
 

speedkilz88

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burmafrd;4008640 said:
I think they did try him there for a while; at least I think they did.
Nope, they tried him at LT and RT.

burmafrd;4008671 said:
Yeah. Wow did forget about him. But you could say he was not bad. He did start for us for a couple of years. His problem was that he was too light and could not keep his weight up; got blown off the ball too much. Didn't he get caught doing roids?
Johnson had microfracture surgery and although it was considered a success he never seemed to have much strength in it.
 

TellerMorrow34

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The Giants have cut a couple of veteran O-Lineman that you could bring in, if they're willing of course, at the right price to add depth to the team.
 

AmishCowboy

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I had high hopes for Brewster,Goose had him in his top 100 the year he came out.
 

JohnnyHopkins

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burmafrd;4008671 said:
Yeah. Wow did forget about him. But you could say he was not bad. He did start for us for a couple of years. His problem was that he was too light and could not keep his weight up; got blown off the ball too much. Didn't he get caught doing roids?

Nah, that was another ex-Cowboy (Lehr maybe?). I would say he was a poor scouting job more than poor developing, but perhaps they thought they could put the weight on him when he got here. Either way he was a JAG.
 

AbeBeta

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burmafrd;4008671 said:
Yeah. Wow did forget about him. But you could say he was not bad. He did start for us for a couple of years. His problem was that he was too light and could not keep his weight up; got blown off the ball too much. Didn't he get caught doing roids?

hard to call him a bust. his microfracture surgery really screwed his career as he ended up losing considerable weight to rehab the knee. then he just couldn't get it back on.
 

speedkilz88

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Joe Rod;4008713 said:
Nah, that was another ex-Cowboy (Lehr maybe?). I would say he was a poor scouting job more than poor developing, but perhaps they thought they could put the weight on him when he got here. Either way he was a JAG.
Maybe you missed my post but Johnson ended up having a degenerative knee from college that nobody knew about until he had problems in camp and had a scope. Then had microfracture surgery when it was really new. That was his problem. On Lehr, yeah he was the one who got caught for steroids, I think with Atl.
 

AbeBeta

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AmishCowboy;4008711 said:
I had high hopes for Brewster,Goose had him in his top 100 the year he came out.

You reflect a common misconception about Goose's top 100. He isn't ranking the best guys, he is projecting who gets picked top 100. Goose clearly had information that we were taking Brewster so he put him in the top 100. He did the same think with Arkin this year.
 

CCBoy

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Nightshade;4008580 said:
I kinda see Hos's point. Our problem is we don't draft O-linemen high enough. Not we don't develop them Well enough. Not sure why we dont spend higher pics on them more often when they're obviously breaking down and getting older ie Colombo, Bigg, Kosier. I think it's Jerry's own personal bias. Just Jerry. I hope T Smith is the beginning of a new trend. A Jerry revelation.

ala "Wow. We really need to have high quality offensive and defensive linemen on the Cowboys. I thought we could get by just drafting low and developing these guys but NO. That philosophy slowly erodes the quality of the team overall. I've learned the error of my ways."

Now wouldn't that be great if he started drafting like the Steelers, Giants and the Packers, etc.. from the inside out? instead of vice versa?

Very good post, here.

In baseball, one had one of two approaches to success. One either built his foundation upon pitching or hitting. During the steroid times, pitching suffered. But today, it is a good way to the playoffs and beyond. Atlanta stuck with pitching. Had a great and long run, and now has returned.

In the NFL, it seems that it is either a top rated offense, or a stick in the mud defense. Dallas chose with the offensive production and building up first, the skill players to mount a high scoring return.

Right now, the surplus of offensive and special skills players is maximized. With a new element of development added to the receiver's group.


This season, there seems to be a cap and and positional void on the defensive side. This paired with age and cap room values causes a problem in the offensive line as well.

Naturally, the focus is upon the offensive line and the defense. The need was so pointed, as Burma noted, that the Cowboys, and Jerry just could not ignore it.

The draft is somewhat of a target of opportunity affair. But when reviewing it, one goes to what affect is brought into the team.

Change today, is limited by cost effectiveness as well as player value, in transitioning.

The most stability for an offensive line, is on the outside, the tackles. Dallas has on the onset, solved that deficiency. Having both Doug Free and Tyron Smith solves that, and at a very cost effective manner for the quality of talent there.

Inside, with Andre Gurode at center, and possibly Kyle Kosier at left guard, the interior stability is preserved. At the least, Montrae Holland preserves an interior stability and actually is pretty strong as a collective group here.

This allows for more cost effective and younger players to rise up and develop up to pressure for time at these positions as well. David Arkin, Bill Nagy, and Travis Bright look to have much more practice time. Then with the Exhibition Games, much more molding in game conditions. This is at the least, a respectable group for depth.

The view now shifts to that of the defense. As things stand right now, there is an up the middle weakness shown. Dallas is missing both starting quality safeties. Then it has a need of no less than two defensive ends to provide an ability to defend and keep from being abused up the gut of their own defense.

There are right now, four positions of high need to the success of this year's team. That is two defensive ends and two safeties.

Above that, an defineable quality added to cornerback is shown as well. As the two junior members, Orlando Scandrick and Mike Jenkins, have not to date shown they can handle the task. Without a strong set at the corners, the strength of a supportive pair of safeties is diminished.

This provides a pretty wide group and number of players that have to be shorn up right now.

Two defensive ends and a safety may well return and be resigned. But that still leaves a cornerback and safety that well would be needed to field an adequate defense to balance what should be a strong offense.

This is where Jerry Jones, the GM, is at present. Attempting to forge these strengths for his team, in the midst of chaos and deep flows of money and advantages. This is a crucial part for Jerry to succeed at, and gain the six players needed for his team....here, and now.
 

JohnnyHopkins

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speedkilz88;4008730 said:
Maybe you missed my post but Johnson ended up having a degenerative knee from college that nobody knew about until he had problems in camp and had a scope. Then had microfracture surgery when it was really new. That was his problem. On Lehr, yeah he was the one who got caught for steroids, I think with Atl.

I missed it, but yes, I'm aware of Johnson's situation. I never thought he would be a good fit for Dallas when they drafted him, even without the injury. But, I figured Bill Parcells knew something, so what the heck. Injury aside, he was never going to be anything but a JAG with Dallas. He was too light when they drafted him and he stayed too light.
 

Yakuza Rich

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burmafrd;4008651 said:
We got Hotel and LA from basically the staff and scouts that we used to build the team to begin with. But after that they were gone. Since then we have developed a grand total of two starters in Gurode and Free. Has any other team done that poorly?

So how do you explain guys like Kosier and Colombo who we got cheap because nobody wanted them and overall have done a good job for us.

It's the thing that has been talked about for awhile now, the organization's unwillingness to draft O-Linemen high. We are usually more interested in getting veterans off of free agency.

Also remember that we have gone thru different scouts over the years and when Parcells was here, he looks for a very different style of O-Lineman. In fact, Broaddus said it was difficult to scout for that because more often than not, the agile O-Linemen with good technique usually wound up not being physical enough to play in the league with success.

Al Johnso had microfracture surgery his rookie year. It's still an injury that can easily ruin careers today despite the advancements they've made in treating it. So when it was his rookie year, the treatment for it was not nearly as good as it is today.

Stephen Petermann starts for a team. Jacob Rogers was a 2nd rounder. Brewster and Marten were 3rd round pics.

Is it great? Absolutely not. But, to act like we are the only team that goes thru this and no other good teams go thru this is asinine.

And I'm actually more disappointed in our safety play over the years than anything. And it's not a coincidence that....we haven't drafted safeties very high lately.

More often than not...you get what you pay for in the NFL draft.








YR
 

TNCowboy

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Yakuza Rich;4008424 said:
A 3rd rounder, 7th rounder, and another UDFA
Brewster was a fat slug who the homers on this board kept propping up, pretending as though they had inside knowledge that the coaching staff really liked him. It was painfully obvious his first time out there he was a long way from having the conditioning to play in the NFL, much less give the team a chance to evaluate his actual talent. Homers even pretended as though it was no big deal when he was cut last year, because hey, we can re-sign him and/or put him on the practice squad. Or that his conditioning was poor because he'd been hurt. Some of them kept up the "coaches like him" fascade even then.

Brewster was a horrible pick and most people knew it immediately. . The real issue is that they missed on a guy that was an obvious joke with a 3rd rounder, and that they were - evidently - investing significant hope in a "3rd rounder, 7th rounder, and another UDFA".

Parcells said it takes 3 years to see if a guy can play or not, but Jimmy Johnson said you can usually tell if a guy can't play from his very first practice. I'd say the Cowboys saw there wasn't much there the first time they got him out there healthy.

The one positive of it all is they finally got rid of another sluggard in Davis and drafted an elite young OL prospect.
 

TNCowboy

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Yakuza Rich;4008874 said:
So how do you explain guys like Kosier and Colombo
Pretty simple explanation. As is the reason for most of the talent we have remaining. Bill Parcells.
 

speedkilz88

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AbeBeta;4008736 said:
You reflect a common misconception about Goose's top 100. He isn't ranking the best guys, he is projecting who gets picked top 100. Goose clearly had information that we were taking Brewster so he put him in the top 100. He did the same think with Arkin this year.
No, you are the one confused. I've heard Goose explain that his rankings are based on a consensus of gms and scouts opinions on players. If only one team thinks he's a top 100 player he is not going to make the list.
 

speedkilz88

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Joe Rod;4008776 said:
I missed it, but yes, I'm aware of Johnson's situation. I never thought he would be a good fit for Dallas when they drafted him, even without the injury. But, I figured Bill Parcells knew something, so what the heck. Injury aside, he was never going to be anything but a JAG with Dallas. He was too light when they drafted him and he stayed too light.
He was around 305 which is plenty big, he lost a lot of weight after the surgery.
 

ravidubey

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warrior43;4008213 said:
LT Free
LG Kosier (hopefully)
C Gurode
RG Phil Costa
RT Tyron Smith

Thats our oline this year

Only hope for the running game is the rookies playing beyond expectations. Kosier and Gurode will be a year weaker and were nothing special as run-blockers to begin with. Costa is average.

We're relying on Smith, Murray, and maybe Arkin to inject some life into what has been an anemic rushing attack the last decade.

In 2010 opponents totally caught onto the Razorback formation and draw play between the 20's that gimmicked up the 2009 stats. This team is in great need of youth and strength.
 

speedkilz88

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ravidubey;4008903 said:
Only hope for the running game is the rookies playing beyond expectations. Kosier and Gurode will be a year weaker and were nothing special as run-blockers to begin with. Costa is average.

We're relying on Smith, Murray, and maybe Arkin to inject some life into what has been an anemic rushing attack the last decade.

In 2010 opponents totally caught onto the Razorback formation and draw play between the 20's that gimmicked up the 2009 stats. This team is in great need of youth and strength.
Kosier and Gurode grade out very well in run blocking.
 

realtick

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Where's silverbear, lol.

I remember him arguing incessantly that the Cowboys waiving Brewster mid-season last year was actually "all part of the plan," and that they indeed weren't giving up on him.
 

NoLuv4Jerry

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AbeBeta;4008736 said:
You reflect a common misconception about Goose's top 100. He isn't ranking the best guys, he is projecting who gets picked top 100. Goose clearly had information that we were taking Brewster so he put him in the top 100. He did the same think with Arkin this year.
This^^^
 

Chocolate Lab

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Johnson actually had a discrete injury to that knee when he tore cartilage... I was at the practice when it happened. For the week or whatever it was he practiced before that, Parcells and his old buddy and second pair of eyes Chuck Fairbanks (and maybe Ron Wolf, too) were raving about him.

When an O-lineman can't squat heavy for over a full year, especially if he's not naturally huge like Johnson wasn't, it's almost a death sentence. And that's on top of the longer rehab that procedure took eight years ago. That injury really killed him.
 
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