News: Some details on the procedure LVE will have

[Kaiser]

This is what I don't get. What changed? It was the same injury a month ago. He could be rehabbing right now.

Because he could have come back for the playoffs if needed. Once the odds of making the playoffs went down, the safe route was to get on the procedure and rehab.

 

[perrykemp]

This is what I don't get. What changed? It was the same injury a month ago. He could be rehabbing right now.

Because surgery on your neck is something that is absolutely positively a last resort -- there are no guaranteed outcomes and MANY people who have neck surgeries are never the same again.

It's for that reason they decided to put football aside and see if the swelling would go down on it's own -- even if it took 4-6 weeks. It didn't. Hence the need for the surgery.

 

[Pantone282C]

“Vander Esch will have his surgery in a few weeks. The Cowboys had been hoping medically treating his cervical herniation of the disk between the fifth and sixth vertebrae would reduce the swelling. The most recent examination reveals no herniation reduction.

Vander Esch will now undergo an anterior cervical discectomy with fusion procedure. This entails removing the herniated disk and using bone from the hip to fuse into the space between the two vertebrae.

Typically full recovery takes four months. This is not expected to be career threatening, and know several former Cowboys players underwent this procedure and continued their careers: Daryl Johnston, Rocket Ismail, Chad Hennings and Izell Reese to name a few.”

Read the rest here: https://www.dallascowboys.com/news/merry-shots-of-lve-worst-fears-and-gifts

Sometimes, they use titanium with screws.

 

[windward]

Because he could have come back for the playoffs if needed. Once the odds of making the playoffs went down, the safe route was to get on the procedure and rehab.

Plus getting surgery on your neck is pretty big life decision.

Prophylactic surgery isn’t typically considered without a period of observation.

 

[Pantone282C]

That doesn’t sound minimally invasive at all

If they use titanium instead of bone, he can be in a better recovery mode. I had the same procedure - three months recovery and minimal rehab. I don't play football anymore, but I do some fairly rigorous work related stuff at the hospital full time shifts, ride my bicycle 10-30 miles at a time, and play golf at 68 y/o.
Even if he has the bone graft, the recovery and prognosis is not as bad as it might seem. Especially for someone as young as he is.
I would be more concerned if he had lumbar or thoracic vertebrae surgery.

 

[Pantone282C]

All I read is that they are dissecting his cervix.

Medical miracle.

 

[Pantone282C]

I have a few thoughts on this. First, I read an article that Vander Esch was examined by draft combine doctors who did not find anything seriously wrong with his neck. They gave him a 4 out of a possible 5 which usually means there are no chronic medical conditions to be concerned about when drafting a player. I hear people talking about stenosis and I wonder if this is true or if the doctors missed that at the combine. If the latter that who the heck does the NFL use as doctors to examine the players? In any case, given the hit LVE took and the way his neck bent forward and to the side, it is entirely possible this injury was just the result of that impact and not from a previous condition.

This procedure sounds bad, but medicine today is so advanced compared to even 10 years ago, particularly when it comes to spinal procedures, that it does not have to be as serious as it sounds. I wish LVE the best and I am not saying that because I want him playing football again. I trust the doctors know more than we do about both the injury and the procedure he will have.

If it is just stenosis, the recovery will be even better.

 

[Pantone282C]

I have had the exact procedure done..the very same. Same c-spine level too. Its no guarantee ANYONE is the same afterwards. I have been disabled for years because my surgery was a very short term fix. It lasted about 2 years..then all hell broke loose. Numb areas all over my hands,shoulders, feet...muscle atrophy, weakness. The rehab will be key. Its no cake walk, I assure you. Bottom line, we better address that position in the offseason.

You're right, there are no guarantees. But, there are successes. I had the same surgery, but my outcome is much better. Sorry to hear yours wasn't. Have to wonder about some doctor's assessments and skills. Not to mention all the other variables.

 

[perrykemp]

If it is just stenosis, the recovery will be even better.

Spinal Stenosis makes the outcome from a fusion better?

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Oh, so his career isn't over and *shocker* the people playing doctor here should stick to picking scabs.

People said his career was over lol? But you know how this place is...they barely made it out of high school but somehow are licensed doctors because they got a paper cut when they were a child lol.

 

[Kaiser]

You're right, there are no guarantees. But, there are successes. I had the same surgery, but my outcome is much better. Sorry to hear yours wasn't. Have to wonder about some doctor's assessments and skills. Not to mention all the other variables.

That's a great point posters here are missing. Just like the situation with Jaylon Smith, the skill level of the surgeon makes a huge difference.

I have a surgeon friend that retired and now mostly does expert witness testimony in med mal cases here in LA. He always says "Never leave the Westside" (meaning Cedars-Sinai, UCLA and USC Hospitals) because the skill level drops off dramatically from those top Hospitals when you go to other areas.

 

[1972COWBOY]

The problem I see is the disk hardware of plates and screws. Take a bas hit and break a screw, its going to be a major issue.

Here is what Im talking about: https://radiologykey.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/image00854.jpeg

 

[TheHerd]

Because he could have come back for the playoffs if needed. Once the odds of making the playoffs went down, the safe route was to get on the procedure and rehab.

With that injury there was zero percent chance he's playing. We could still make the playoffs, so that argument doesn't seem to be strong.

 

[TheHerd]

Because surgery on your neck is something that is absolutely positively a last resort -- there are no guaranteed outcomes and MANY people who have neck surgeries are never the same again.

It's for that reason they decided to put football aside and see if the swelling would go down on it's own -- even if it took 4-6 weeks. It didn't. Hence the need for the surgery.

ok, this one I'll buy. See if anything resolves on its own. At last we're not waiting all off season.

 

[Kaiser]

With that injury there was zero percent chance he's playing. We could still make the playoffs, so that argument doesn't seem to be strong.

Disagree. If there was a zero percent chance of him playing they would have moved him to IR like Conner Williams. And they could still make the playoffs, but after the Philly game the chances went from something like 70% to like 10%.

 

[Pantone282C]

Again, a few points:

1. Successful Outcome is defined differently as far as medical literature is concerned. It doesn’t mean, for spinal fusion surgery, one can play football, it simply means the surgery had an outcome as expected and was a success, at least as far as the short term. This also doesn’t mean one will not lose flexibility and range of motion because of the surgery being a ‘success’.

2. Minimally invasive refers to the cut, meaning it lessens healing time. A smaller cut means less chance for doing more damage, which require Ls longer healing times. The bigger the cut, the larger the inflammatory response, which can create more issues on u to a surrounding tissues. It doesn’t mean the procedure itself changes. The fusion surgery with bone, still impacts the biomechanics the same way, because the disk is replaced by bone.

3. The newer procedure is a disk is not fused with bone, but an artificial disk. Peyton Manning had his bone fused, so this is still standard operating procedure. The point is, the only way a procedure can truly change is of one can substitute the removed disk with a like substance.

This is what the whole premise of stem cells is about. Use cells to produce like organs in a specific environment and then introduce them into the body hoping the latter accepts it.

The outcomes for a lot of people are much better these days. Prognosis is, of course, dependent on other conditions and variables. Discs merely keep the nerves from being squashed by the vertebrae

Spinal Stenosis makes the outcome from a fusion better?

It's not clear to me about the extent of his condition. Stenosis is narrowing of the spinal vertebrae, which can snag or pinch nerves. The type of narrowing or enlargement of the vertebrae matters - that is, which part of the vertebrae is narrowing. They initially talked about stenosis, and now they are saying both? If the disc is ruptured, it pushes on nerves must come out and a fusion becomes necessary. If it's just stenosis, the surgery might possibly be limited to removal of the excess bone.

 

[perrykemp]

The outcomes for a lot of people are much better these days. Prognosis is, of course, dependent on other conditions and variables. Discs merely keep the nerves from being squashed by the vertebrae

It's not clear to me about the extent of his condition. Stenosis is narrowing of the spinal vertebrae, which can snag or pinch nerves. The type of narrowing or enlargement of the vertebrae matters - that is, which part of the vertebrae is narrowing. They initially talked about stenosis, and now they are saying both? If the disc is ruptured, it pushes on nerves must come out and a fusion becomes necessary. If it's just stenosis, the surgery might possibly be limited to removal of the excess bone.

I think it’s the double whammy — it’s a fusion (using bone from his hip) and separately from that he has spinal stenosis.

 

[Chrispierce]

Not good at all..Stenosis is one thing but Cervical Fusion for a LB is another. Can't see him being the same player, hope I'm wrong.

Yeah he’s a LB it’s like being a RB,come on man.Remove his herniated disk and fuse his vertebrae with hip bone and everything’s fine? Sure for us at home it is...but he’s a NFL crash test dummy. That’s crazy Romo stuff...I have to go on record as being more than a little uncomfortable with this.

 

[Qcard]

“Vander Esch will have his surgery in a few weeks. The Cowboys had been hoping medically treating his cervical herniation of the disk between the fifth and sixth vertebrae would reduce the swelling. The most recent examination reveals no herniation reduction.

Vander Esch will now undergo an anterior cervical discectomy with fusion procedure. This entails removing the herniated disk and using bone from the hip to fuse into the space between the two vertebrae.

Typically full recovery takes four months. This is not expected to be career threatening, and know several former Cowboys players underwent this procedure and continued their careers: Daryl Johnston, Rocket Ismail, Chad Hennings and Izell Reese to name a few.”

Read the rest here: https://www.dallascowboys.com/news/merry-shots-of-lve-worst-fears-and-gifts

I hope more Chad and Daryl than Ismail and Izell

 

[Pantone282C]

I think it’s the double whammy — it’s a fusion (using bone from his hip) and separately from that he has spinal stenosis.

Got bad then. The bone is pressing against the disc, which presses against nerves.