Someone Not in Favor of Mayer at 26

[Sydla]

? ? ? ?

I think the point is that there are a lot of "ifs" with Washington.

To me, if I am going TE at 26, he better develop into more than a blocking TE. I think people are trying to justify Washington by underselling his shortcoming - his rawness as a pass catcher - and trying to convince themselves that just being a really good blocker is worth the pick. It's not.

That's not an endorsement of Mayer, or any TE, for that matter, over Washington. But the reality is people are acting like Washington is the no brainer pick over Mayer because he tested better but then trying to create a soft landing for themselves saying, he's still worth the pick if he never develops as a pass catcher because he'll still be the best blocker of the two.

Seems like a flawed analysis to me.

 

[fivetwos]

If you take a TE at 12 and he turns into nothing but a blocking TE and a guy who might get you some TDs in the red zone because he's tall, that's a bust pick.

You take a TE at 12, he better be one of the better TEs in football.

Gotcha, I’m saying worst case he isn’t a total bust because those things won’t go away, so his floor isn’t typically as low as someone with that type of upside.

I want him, but if we were picking 12th, not so much, but I think someone in that range or a little lower actually does it.

 

[fivetwos]

I get too much of a Schultz vibe from Mayer. Sure he’ll contribute earlier than Schultz did, but I don’t think their games are vastly different.

I get the Schultz vibe from Kincade, who I want here under no circumstance.

Mostly a receiver, can’t run block. May as well have resigned Schultz for what he ended up getting in that case. I’d take Mayer over him all day.

Overall we probably need to do better than any of these TEs, even at 26, but we need some things to go well to land one of the tackles. Big demand for those.

 

[Rockport]

I 100% agree and didn’t need analytics to see he is bad value in round 1 and I think the guy has 10 year starter written all over him and will be really good.

If I’m drafting a TE I want a playmaker not some 1990s check down guy.

Yeah, well your record on player judgement is terrible so stick to Madden.

 

[Outlaw Heroes]

Otherwise known as counting on potential to pan out....

Not really. I think today, he's an even swap for Mayer. Gives you a lot more as a blocker (though Mayer is fine) but less as a receiver. Actually, I think what he gives you as a receiver is different, but not necessarily less. 'If' he pans out, it's a far better pick, but I'm not counting on it in taking him over Mayer.

This is not to say that there couldn't be other talent on the board at #26 that I would take over Washington. Just not Mayer.

 

[InPhiltraitor]

The reality is that if Mayer is the selection at 26 we have a guy that I would expect to contribute right away, potentially before the other TE's would be able to given the supposed holes in part/parts of their games.

In today's rent-a-player NFL, If you get a solid consistent performer for a contract cycle you're not doing to bad. He's not sexy, and the comparisons have been made to Witten, and if it were to play out like that we didn't do too bad.

Having said all that, I still want a lineman as our first selection but if it's TE and it's Mayer, I don't hate the pick, but man it's tough not to consider a few of these other guys. You guys o.k. with taking a swing at some of the other fellas in rounds 2 or 3?

 

[RS12]

I get too much of a Schultz vibe from Mayer. Sure he’ll contribute earlier than Schultz did, but I don’t think their games are vastly different.

Schultz was a horrendous blocker. Mayer is a complete Y TE. Mayer gets open makes plays and not a negative in the run game. I don't see the comp at all.

 

[Sydla]

Not really. I think today, he's an even swap for Mayer. Gives you a lot more as a blocker (though Mayer is fine) but less as a receiver. Actually, I think what he gives you as a receiver is different, but not necessarily less. 'If' he pans out, it's a far better pick, but I'm not counting on it in taking him over Mayer.

This is not to say that there couldn't be other talent on the board at #26 that I would take over Washington. Just not Mayer.

A lot depends on your QB too.

Washington may end up being a real seam buster but with Dak, is that a route you are going to take advantage of? Remember, a lot of this offseason has been the Cowboys talking about getting more around Dak. Well a strong argument can be made Mayer is the better fit with Dak. One, he's going to likely to an immediate impact in the passing game compared to Washington. Two, he's better now and may always be better at the passing routes that Dak just is comfortable with his TE running.

Agian, I have no idea what they are thinking and whether they even really want a TE at 26 but a case can be made that despite Washington clearly having the higher ceiling, Mayer just may be a better fit for what Dallas wants over the next 3-4 years.

 

[stilltheguru]

He should've provided analytics for having kelvin joseph a top 20 prospect

 

[Sydla]

He should've provided analytics for having kelvin joseph a top 20 prospect

LOL.

I mean in fairness, he does kind of mock himself early in the video pointing out the mistakes he made.

All that being said, Cavanaugh is entertaining to me and I actually like reading his tweets and reports but he's also not a guy I am looking at for in depth draft/player analysis.

 

[CATCH17]

A lot depends on your QB too.

Washington may end up being a real seam buster but with Dak, is that a route you are going to take advantage of? Remember, a lot of this offseason has been the Cowboys talking about getting more around Dak. Well a strong argument can be made Mayer is the better fit with Dak. One, he's going to likely to an immediate impact in the passing game compared to Washington. Two, he's better now and may always be better at the passing routes that Dak just is comfortable with his TE running.

Agian, I have no idea what they are thinking and whether they even really want a TE at 26 but a case can be made that despite Washington clearly having the higher ceiling, Mayer just may be a better fit for what Dallas wants over the next 3-4 years.

The thing with Washington though is he is probably the best blocking TE in the NFL the moment he steps onto the field and with a guy like Tony Pollard who like to get the edge a player like Washington really helps the run game.

 

[Stash]

Schultz was a horrendous blocker. Mayer is a complete Y TE. Mayer gets open makes plays and not a negative in the run game. I don't see the comp at all.

I feel that Schultz’ blocking continued to improve. To the point that in year five it was close to Mayer.

 

[stilltheguru]

LOL.

I mean in fairness, he does kind of mock himself early in the video pointing out the mistakes he made.

All that being said, Cavanaugh is entertaining to me and I actually like reading his tweets and reports but he's also not a guy I am looking at for in depth draft/player analysis.

That's a first. That's the reason I stopped watching anything with him. Smug attitude like many have on here about their opinions. Good to know he is finally owning up

I was really done when he kept repeating Gregory Rousseau couldn't play football. Just amazing ego

 

[CATCH17]

LOL.

I mean in fairness, he does kind of mock himself early in the video pointing out the mistakes he made.

All that being said, Cavanaugh is entertaining to me and I actually like reading his tweets and reports but he's also not a guy I am looking at for in depth draft/player analysis.

His logic is sound though.


The best TEs in football are legit athletes. Mayer is a poor athlete.

Also, most of the TEs that are legit aren’t round 1 guys.

Mayer is nearly a finished product. There is guys already close to him with more upside.

 

[Sydla]

The thing with Washington though is he is probably the best blocking TE in the NFL the moment he steps onto the field and with a guy like Tony Pollard who like to get the edge a player like Washington really helps the run game.

I suspect the Cowboys, if they are taking a TE at 26, want someone that is going to be more than just a blocker for a few years. If they do take Washington, they clearly feel he can be an immediate impact guy in the passing game too. Whether they are right, who knows.

But again, a case can be made that while Washington has the higher ceiling, Mayer just makes more sense for what they want out of their TE now. I believe even you admitted in other threads that Mayer is probably more likely to be able to make in impact earlier on short routes, dump offs (things Dak loved to do wth Schultz) than Washington early.

And note, I am not suggesting taking a guy like Mayer becuase he may fit better is smart logic either. But people are acting like taking Washington over Mayer is some no brainer for Dallas. It's not.

 

[CATCH17]

I suspect the Cowboys, if they are taking a TE at 26, want someone that is going to be more than just a blocker for a few years. If they do take Washington, they clearly feel he can be an immediate impact guy in the passing game too. Whether they are right, who knows.

But again, a case can be made that while Washington has the higher ceiling, Mayer just makes more sense for what they want out of their TE now. I believe even you admitted in other threads that Mayer is probably more likely to be able to make in impact earlier on short routes, dump offs (things Dak loved to do wth Schultz) than Washington early.

And note, I am not suggesting taking a guy like Mayer becuase he may fit better is smart logic either. But people are acting like taking Washington over Mayer is some no brainer for Dallas. It's not.

Yeah I see Washington as a guy that can make contested catches.

Problem is we have a QB that doesn’t allow his WRs to go make a play on the ball. If they’re covered then he won’t throw.

Mayer is also a guy that doesn’t get the best separation and that’s something to keep in mind but he is a leverage king and gets open that way.

 

[CATCH17]

I get the Schultz vibe from Kincade, who I want here under no circumstance.

Mostly a receiver, can’t run block. May as well have resigned Schultz for what he ended up getting in that case. I’d take Mayer over him all day.

Overall we probably need to do better than any of these TEs, even at 26, but we need some things to go well to land one of the tackles. Big demand for those.

Yeah but Kincaid is like a legit WR. Like a bigger faster stronger Kelce.

Schultz is just kinda whatever.

 

[fivetwos]

Yeah but Kincaid is like a legit WR. Like a bigger faster stronger Kelce.

Schultz is just kinda whatever.

Agreed, but I don’t see Kelce type of mismatches with Kincaid. Maybe with who Utah played, but not in the NFL.

I don’t want Mayer for the same reasons you dont, but I’d take him all day over Kincaid.

Either way, one important factor is neither Kelce or Kittle were the player they eventually became at draft time. There’s upside to consider and why Washington is my choice if TE is taken early.

Maybe we get lucky and all three are gone, which maybe pushes a stud OL to 26. Even better IMO.

 

[4lifecowboy]

If you take a TE at 12 and he turns into nothing but a blocking TE and a guy who might get you some TDs in the red zone because he's tall, that's a bust pick.

You take a TE at 12, he better be one of the better TEs in football.

That really depends on how good a blocker he is. A legitimate 6th lineman is a hellava weapon to have, then add redzone impact, I think I would disagree, that would be a bust.

 

[fivetwos]

Problem is we have a QB that doesn’t allow his WRs to go make a play on the ball. If they’re covered then he won’t throw.

That’s a very good point that I hadn’t considered. He is used to dumping to Schultz.

Sort of negates a Washington strength.