Stephen Jones gives updates on Alfred Morris, Patrick Robinson

[casmith07]

I think that's a matter of individual opinion and perspective.

Of course...but I think I've got a right to wonder what the heck's going on if someone is disappointed or feels it a failure we didn't sign someone like Chris Long, lol.

The wailing and gnashing of teeth over a mediocre CB in Patrick Robinson doesn't make sense - he's still a free agent. They could still be working numbers.

I'll say this though - if he's not immediately signed on the visit, that tells me the Cowboys think he's significantly worth less than what his agent thinks.

 

[Bleu Star]

Of course...but I think I've got a right to wonder what the heck's going on if someone is disappointed or feels it a failure we didn't sign someone like Chris Long, lol.

The wailing and gnashing of teeth over a mediocre CB in Patrick Robinson doesn't make sense - he's still a free agent. They could still be working numbers.

I'll say this though - if he's not immediately signed on the visit, that tells me the Cowboys think he's significantly worth less than what his agent thinks.

There are no blue chip FAs out there. No one here is acting as if there are. That said, there are guys that can help our team... and our hitting percentage is about .200 right now.

 

[casmith07]

There are no blue chip FAs out there. No one here is acting as if there are. That said, there are guys that can help our team... and our hitting percentage is about .200 right now.

The only guy that I think would really help our team is Alfred Morris from the stock of 2nd wave guys we've been interested in. Everyone else is a push.

Robinson is about on par with Sterling Moore. Good depth, not someone you want starting. Chris Long would've been Nick Hayden 2.0, and we know how people feel about that.

But it's also like everyone just forgets Cedric Thornton was signed to an amazingly good deal. We went from "lol" at 1T to actually having the kind of player we need there, and for cheap. I guess some fans want us to be the Giants and spend $155M on three guys in free agency.

 

[Stash]

Of course...but I think I've got a right to wonder what the heck's going on if someone is disappointed or feels it a failure we didn't sign someone like Chris Long, lol.

When the team has no projected starter for the first four weeks of the season, I don't think anyone can "lol" about Chris Long. A far more successful franchise than this one thought he was a worthwhile signing.

The wailing and gnashing of teeth over a mediocre CB in Patrick Robinson doesn't make sense - he's still a free agent. They could still be working numbers.

I'll say this though - if he's not immediately signed on the visit, that tells me the Cowboys think he's significantly worth less than what his agent thinks.

And what's your position then? He's not worth signing? That he's mediocre and the Cowboys shouldn't bother pursuing him?

Or is it that no matter how this works, whether he's signed or not, that it's ultimately the right move? Because that's how some fans want it, if this team signs him, "great add", and if they don't, "not worth it anyway".

Some people try to have it both ways, and they can't.

 

[casmith07]

When the team has no projected starter for the first four weeks of the season, I don't think anyone can "lol" about Chris Long. A far more successful franchise than this one thought he was a worthwhile signing.

I don't think the Cowboys are going to go out and spend $2M plus on a player with an eye towards only the first 4 weeks of the season. Especially not if there are players that are better on an exponential scale in the draft.

And what's your position then? He's not worth signing? That he's mediocre and the Cowboys shouldn't bother pursuing him?

Or is it that no matter how this works, whether he's signed or not, that it's ultimately the right move? Because that's how some fans want it, if this team signs him, "great add", and if they don't, "not worth it anyway".

Some people try to have it both ways, and they can't.

I don't think he's not worth signing at all - I think he would be good, quality, veteran depth. I think that adding him with the expectation of cutting Brandon Carr and starting him is a mistake. I believe at the absolute high end you would be getting a push in production, which could be good if everything works out perfectly considering the cap numbers. For it to be a good move, you'd have to get a huge upgrade in overall production, much of it not measurable to the average fan -- not just interceptions, the Madden/fantasy favorite stat of fans everywhere.

I've explained multiple times, though, that Brandon Carr only counts 8.8% of the total cap number this season, same as 2015, although with a modest savings of $6M. If you sign Robinson to a Nolan Carroll style deal ($2.4M), your opportunity cost is hoping for drastic improvement at the position for a meager $3.6M in cap savings. It doesn't make sense, not when a 1-year, $2.4M contract is not cost prohibitive with the defensive backfield as constructed.

In short, why waive a guy when you don't have to, and BOTH can contribute? Unless, like many, your hate for a player is so blind that you don't care about smart business or smart football.

 

[Fletch]

This argument is stale. Patrick Robinson specifically would be a strong signing at a position of need. Chris Long would have been the same.

Stale and yet still an accurate assessment of this board.

 

[Stash]

I don't think the Cowboys are going to go out and spend $2M plus on a player with an eye towards only the first 4 weeks of the season. Especially not if there are players that are better on an exponential scale in the draft.

So $2 million is what you consider a lot of money to pay for Chris Long.

I don't think he's not worth signing at all - I think he would be good, quality, veteran depth. I think that adding him with the expectation of cutting Brandon Carr and starting him is a mistake. I believe at the absolute high end you would be getting a push in production, which could be good if everything works out perfectly considering the cap numbers. For it to be a good move, you'd have to get a huge upgrade in overall production, much of it not measurable to the average fan -- not just interceptions, the Madden/fantasy favorite stat of fans everywhere.

I've explained multiple times, though, that Brandon Carr only counts 8.8% of the total cap number this season, same as 2015, although with a modest savings of $6M. If you sign Robinson to a Nolan Carroll style deal ($2.4M), your opportunity cost is hoping for drastic improvement at the position for a meager $3.6M in cap savings. It doesn't make sense, not when a 1-year, $2.4M contract is not cost prohibitive with the defensive backfield as constructed.

In short, why waive a guy when you don't have to, and BOTH can contribute? Unless, like many, your hate for a player is so blind that you don't care about smart business or smart football.

But $2.4 million is "not cost prohibitive" and $3.6 million is "meager"?

OK.

 

[remdak]

Morris is a Cowboy according to Schefter

 

[BulletBob]

When the player visits, or a visit is planned, that's not the media saying we have interest, it's the team saying it.

And when they don't get the player they very obviously had interest in signing, it's disappointing.

What if the player says things in the meeting that do not line up with the way that the team plans to use him? What if, at the last minute, his agent asks for something stupid to be included in the contract? What if it becomes clear during the interview that the player is just using the team as leverage against another team (possibly his current team)? What if the player does not pass a med check?

I am in no way justifying the seeming lack of activity we have had in free agency.

However, none of us knows what goes on in those meetings. So, I believe it is misleading to paint with a broad brush and say that every player who "gets away" without a contract is a disappointment. It may be a disappointment for us fans, but it also may be viewed as a blessing to the team.

With all that said, given that Stephen Jones went out of his way to inform the fans that the Robinson negotiations were going well, I would agree that in this case, if we do not sign this CB, it will be a disappointment both to the fans (most of them) and the team.

 

[Stash]

What if the player says things in the meeting that do not line up with the way that the team plans to use him? What if, at the last minute, his agent asks for something stupid to be included in the contract? What if it becomes clear during the interview that the player is just using the team as leverage against another team (possibly his current team)? What if the player does not pass a med check?

I am in no way justifying the seeming lack of activity we have had in free agency.

However, none of us knows what goes on in those meetings. So, I believe it is misleading to paint with a broad brush and say that every player who "gets away" without a contract is a disappointment. It may be a disappointment for us fans, but it also may be viewed as a blessing to the team.

With all that said, given that Stephen Jones went out of his way to inform the fans that the Robinson negotiations were going well, I would agree that in this case, if we do not sign this CB, it will be a disappointment both to the fans (most of them) and the team.

Anything can and will happen during the course of negotiations, and I can accept an occasional miss. But the Cowboys have been nothing more than a road bump among the league this year. Players have repeatedly come and gone, or not shown up at all. As a Cowboys fan, I'm not used to them being 'just another team' as they're currently being treated.

That said, it looks like some positive news is happening today. How positive? We'll just have to wait and see.

 

[Bleu Star]

The only guy that I think would really help our team is Alfred Morris from the stock of 2nd wave guys we've been interested in. Everyone else is a push.

Robinson is about on par with Sterling Moore. Good depth, not someone you want starting. Chris Long would've been Nick Hayden 2.0, and we know how people feel about that.

But it's also like everyone just forgets Cedric Thornton was signed to an amazingly good deal. We went from "lol" at 1T to actually having the kind of player we need there, and for cheap. I guess some fans want us to be the Giants and spend $155M on three guys in free agency.

We just signed Alfred!

 

[big dog cowboy]

I guess some fans want us to be the Giants and spend $155M on three guys in free agency.

Not this one.

 

[Bleu Star]

I'll admit it.. I have been a tad cynical and frustrated. The Alfred Morris signing has renewed some faith. I like Thornton and will be interested in seeing how they inspire Mayowa. Add Patrick Robinson and I will be on cloud 9. Filling areas of need.. actively and intelligently. That's impressive. Get Patrick now pls...

 

[superonyx]

I'll admit it.. I have been a tad cynical and frustrated. The Alfred Morris signing has renewed some faith. I like Thornton and will be interested in seeing how they inspire Mayowa. Add Patrick Robinson and I will be on cloud 9. Filling areas of need.. actively and intelligently. That's impressive. Get Patrick now pls...

It's funny how a week of watching us whiff on every free agent (like Weddle) or Watching a back like Lamar Miller sign somewhere else can have your expectation low enough that you get genuinely excited over signing a guy like Thornton (who I never heard of and I live in Philly area) and Alfred Morris.

 

[fortdick]

A lot here think taking a qb at #4, instead of a defensive player, is holding back this team from being a so called SB contender.

I am wondering if we would have been a contender last year if we had Deion on the field? Or wouldhavebeen closer if we had a healthy Romo?

 

[Bleu Star]

It's funny how a week of watching us whiff on every free agent (like Weddle) or Watching a back like Lamar Miller sign somewhere else can have your expectation low enough that you get genuinely excited over signing a guy like Thornton (who I never heard of and I live in Philly area) and Alfred Morris.

This is true man......... But I'm trying to bring out the "glass half full" side of yours truly..lol

 

[RS12]

 

[speedkilz88]

It's funny how a week of watching us whiff on every free agent (like Weddle) or Watching a back like Lamar Miller sign somewhere else can have your expectation low enough that you get genuinely excited over signing a guy like Thornton (who I never heard of and I live in Philly area) and Alfred Morris.

Do you even know that Thornton started for the eagles? He was forced to play 3-4 DE which isn't ideal for big numbers unless you are JJ Watt.

 

[superonyx]

Do you even know that Thornton started for the eagles? He was forced to play 3-4 DE which isn't ideal for big numbers unless you are JJ Watt.

Or Fletcher Cox of the 3-4 Philadelphia Eagles.

You may not like it but the reality is that Philadelphia Eagles fans are not concerned with losing Thornton.
Not expecting Cox for the amount we paid Thornton but also not expecting much either.

 

[Eddie]

We just signed Alfred!

Hope he runs over the Skins like he ran over us. He's young and still have legs. I like the signing.

I still think we should pick up a RB in the 4th round or so.