Still irritated at the insistence that 3 QB's are kept

[T-RO]

Is Neal worth losing a year of developing Rush? Because if he's your QB2 everything else goes out the window. I'm not so much arguing for keeping Moore, by the way, as suggesting what I think the team is probably thinking.

There's a Neal in just about every FA class. He might be named Bishop or Coleman or whatever, but those guys are out there. Personally, I wouldn't lose sleep over missing out on them. Especially not with the extra picks we'll have next season. Whatever we can do to develop the QBs, I'm all for.

I don't see keeping Moore as much assistance in developing Rush.

Look at how fast Dak developed? Rush is a super smart, intuitive and hard-working kid.

Neal has been one of our better def linemen and we start the season down in the count there.

 

[Idgit]

Why would developing Rush go out the window if they cut Moore? He would be included in the development of the gameplan every week and taking 2nd team snaps in practice. They could have him do the scout team for the first team too. All they do is read off cards and mime plays. Romo did that last season.

If anything keeping Moore means he gets less of the more meaningful snaps. Learning how to mimic Eli Manning and Carson Wentz is not going to help him nearly as much as studying and practicing what defenses teams are going to be throwing out week after week.

I have zero faith in Moore's ability to win games. I do expect Rush to turn the ball over less. Neither is an ideal backup but Moore has no upside and just as problematic if not more.

And using your thinking there are going to be QBs cut as well. You don't think you can find something the quality of Noodles out there? The bottom line here is that Neal is a better DE than Moore is a QB. Much better now and moving forward.

No matter how you cut it, QB2 prepares the way QB1 does each week. And QB3 doesn't have that responsibility.

Neither backup QB gets many reps. That's the nature of that position. But team's usually want a vet who knows the offense well on the bench as a result. They want a dynamic that's not competitive between the top two QBs. And they want a vet to guide the developmental QB because the starter can't do it.

I don't have much more faith in Moore than you do, but he fits the bill in terms of knowing the offense. He can finish a game for you. And that's all we're really talking about right now.

The bottom line isn't which player is better at their position. The bottom line is which is likely to help the team more. When you're talking about two backups, the question of what they give you when they're not playing becomes more relevant, since that's how they're more likely to contribute. And you get more from a backup veteran QB who knows the offense than you do out of another borderline young DL when your starter at QB is a second year player and you think you've got a young guy waiting in the wings to develop.

 

[Idgit]

I don't see keeping Moore as much assistance in developing Rush.

Look at how fast Dak developed? Rush is a super smart, intuitive and hard-working kid.

Neal has been one of our better def linemen and we start the season down in the count there.

Dak has talked many times about how beneficial it was to have Romo, Moore, and Sanchez to help him along. We even saw Romo coaching him on the sidelines a couple of times.

It's not a given Neal doesn't make the roster anyway. Given the suspensions and the injury to Hitchens, we're really looking for the top 56 to start. When Demontre Moore comes back,we'll have to cut, but you never know what injuries happen the first two weeks.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

No matter how you cut it, QB2 prepares the way QB1 does each week. And QB3 doesn't have that responsibility.

Neither backup QB gets many reps. That's the nature of that position. But team's usually want a vet who knows the offense well on the bench as a result. They want a dynamic that's not competitive between the top two QBs. And they want a vet to guide the developmental QB because the starter can't do it.

I don't have much more faith in Moore than you do, but he fits the bill in terms of knowing the offense. He can finish a game for you. And that's all we're really talking about right now.

The bottom line isn't which player is better at their position. The bottom line is which is likely to help the team more. When you're talking about two backups, the question of what they give you when they're not playing becomes more relevant, since that's how they're more likely to contribute. And you get more from a backup veteran QB who knows the offense than you do out of another borderline young DL when your starter at QB is a second year player and you think you've got a young guy waiting in the wings to develop.

Preparing the same as QB1 is developing. Getting those practice snaps that QB3 doesn't get is developing. Plus he can do the scout team stuff too. If he has the work ethic that he is reported to have then I don't see the downside in terms of developing.

Knowing the offense doesn't matter when you throw under 6 YPA and a couple of picks. You want to pull that not let them finish.

I have zero faith in Moore being able to help at all. I am not sure about Cooper but a bad chance is better than no chance at all. Moore has never won a game in the NFL and really never been close. He dinks and ducks when he is not turning it over. He looks awful in preseason.

And again, if you want a more experienced QB than Cooper then the answer is not Moore. There will be some QB cut like Sanchez was last year that can take that role. Moore is not an NFL quarterback back up or else.

 

[Doomsay]

Moore's retention isn't worth the possible upside of any other player in camp. He can not play at this level and has been given ample opportunity to do so. He's nothing more than a bankie for Scotty.

 

[Idgit]

Preparing the same as QB1 is developing. Getting those practice snaps that QB3 doesn't get is developing. Plus he can do the scout team stuff too. If he has the work ethic that he is reported to have then I don't see the downside in terms of developing.

Knowing the offense doesn't matter when you throw under 6 YPA and a couple of picks. You want to pull that not let them finish.

I have zero faith in Moore being able to help at all. I am not sure about Cooper but a bad chance is better than no chance at all. Moore has never won a game in the NFL and really never been close. He dinks and ducks when he is not turning it over. He looks awful in preseason.

And again, if you want a more experienced QB than Cooper then the answer is not Moore. There will be some QB cut like Sanchez was last year that can take that role. Moore is not an NFL quarterback back up or else.

I didn't say QB2s don't get a chance to develop. I suggested it's easier to develop QB when he's not counted on to be the backup. Which is why teams often carry a developmental player in that third QB role, and why Dallas appears to be leaning towards doing just that with the guys we have on the roster.

It's possible that Rush convinces them to do otherwise. But neither decision is a big deal. Replacing Moore won't bother me, either, though I think there's almost no chance of that happening. Either way, there's nobody on the bottom of this roster I care all that much about losing if we go deep at QB. Whatever they decide to do, they've got leeway at QB in my book given all the rabbits they've pulled out of hats at that position the last two years.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I didn't say QB2s don't get a chance to develop. I suggested it's easier to develop QB when he's not counted on to be the backup. Which is why teams often carry a developmental player in that third QB role, and why Dallas appears to be leaning towards doing just that with the guys we have on the roster.

It's possible that Rush convinces them to do otherwise. But neither decision is a big deal. Replacing Moore won't bother me, either, though I think there's almost no chance of that happening. Either way, there's nobody on the bottom of this roster I care all that much about losing if we go deep at QB. Whatever they decide to do, they've got leeway at QB in my book given all the rabbits they've pulled out of hats at that position the last two years.

I got that. Basically you are saying that QB3 develops better than QB2. That is why I was talking about the responsibilities. When reduced to what they actually do it doesn't bear out. As QB2 Rush would get more practice snaps, more involvement in gameplans, and just more attention from the coaching staff overall. QB3 basically sits in meetings and might run the scout team depending on how things are run.

That is why when teams draft a top 100 QB and sit them for a year, they put them as the backup and don't bury them as the third guy. The more practice reps, the more you are involved in the meetings and the more overall attention a player gets the faster they are going to develop.

And I know you keep labeling him as a developmental QB but as far as rookies go he is about as prepared as one can be. He started 50 games at CMU. I have a feeling if he was a top 100 pick we wouldn't even be having this conversation yet he has outplayed all of the top 100 picks by a mile.

He has a shot to succeed. Noodles does not.

 

[Idgit]

I got that. Basically you are saying that QB3 develops better than QB2. That is why I was talking about the responsibilities. When reduced to what they actually do it doesn't bear out. As QB2 Rush would get more practice snaps, more involvement in gameplans, and just more attention from the coaching staff overall. QB3 basically sits in meetings and might run the scout team depending on how things are run.

That is why when teams draft a top 100 QB and sit them for a year, they put them as the backup and don't bury them as the third guy. The more practice reps, the more you are involved in the meetings and the more overall attention a player gets the faster they are going to develop.

And I know you keep labeling him as a developmental QB but as far as rookies go he is about as prepared as one can be. He started 50 games at CMU. I have a feeling if he was a top 100 pick we wouldn't even be having this conversation yet he has outplayed all of the top 100 picks by a mile.

He has a shot to succeed. Noodles does not.

I'm saying a developmental QB has different things to work on than a sixth year vet. And that not having to prepare for the games with significantly limited reps gives him time to work on those things. The guy does have mechanics that can be improved.

And I'm saying, if Noodles makes Dak a better player than he could in another capacity, and can help make Rush a better player, then his presence on the roster is justified. Moore having a shot to succeed as a starter isn't the primary objective. And it's an open question what the team might do if they needed a replacement to do anything more than finish out a game.

Rush wasn't a top-100 pick, and his 50 games were at CMU. He's not as prepared as a rookie QB can be. I'd grant you he's as prepared as a MAC QB can be.

And I'm referring to him as a developmental QB because that's what he is. He's not even used to the speed and sophistication of a regular SEC schedule, much less professional defenses.

Tony Romo developed for two years at QB3. It's not like it's something team's just don't do. With a second year starter, rolling with three QBs is more sensible than rolling with only a rookie from the MAC on the roster. And if something were to happen to Dak, god forbid, we'd have a mad scramble to add a veteran to the position group to help out Rush, anyway.

 

[cwbyfan72]

Kellen is just stealing money and a roster spot at this point. It's gonna be a shame that some player that's showing promise will not make the team for some noodlearm that reached his very low peak two years ago.

That sig is priceless!!!!

 

[fredp22]

Has anyone said he will make the final 53?
If Dak goes down for more than a game or 2 Romo will prob get a call. That's like carrying 4.
I don't think he's going to make the cut.

 

[Alexander]

Umm, when has Moore shown the ability to play in the NFL

Uhave 400+ yards against Washington? Scoreboard!

 

[Pants]

if we cut moore now, don't you think the giants sign him in preparation for the week 1 game? kinda like a spy? moore could give up the game plan

 

[noshame]

If he wasn't Linehan's pet cat, he'd be gone.

 

[PJTHEDOORS]

Has anyone said he will make the final 53?
If Dak goes down for more than a game or 2 Romo will prob get a call. That's like carrying 4.
I don't think he's going to make the cut.

Jerry said they will keep him (Moore). So yes, he's will be on 53. Who knows, maybe he meant PS. As for Rush, he too is on the 53 (said Jerry).

 

[casmith07]

As long as Dak's in the lineup, they want Moore doing the stuff QB2s do, and Rush doing the stuff QB3s do. Those things are pretty different. You definitely need a QB2. The question is, is a guy good enough to use a spot on him as a QB3.

But for a developing rookie at the hardest position in sports, giving him a year to work on form and the playbook without the burden of game plans makes perfect sense.

And for a 2nd year starter who's developing into one of the best players in the league at his position, you want to give him a guy to bang ideas off of who's actually been in the system longer than he has.

Don't look at Moore as a guy who's not as good as either Dak or Rush who's inexplicably on the roster. He's a placeholder for Dak that helps him be a better starter and a guy who frees up Rush so that he can learn the job of NFL QB without the interruptions that come with the QB2 clipboard. Keeping Moore for one more year is better for both Dak and Rush in the long run, and costs almost nothing. I mean, it'll cost us an Emmit Cleary or whatever.

If Dak gets hurt, it'll probably be Rush getting the starter's reps in practice the next week, either way.

Oh please. If you think Kellen Moore is going to make Dak a better starter you need your head examined. And that goes for everyone in the front office as well.

If Kellen Moore is some QB whispering genius why the **** do we need a coaching staff? This kind of thought is lazy and doesn't make any sense.

 

[CATCH17]

Dak has talked many times about how beneficial it was to have Romo, Moore, and Sanchez to help him along. We even saw Romo coaching him on the sidelines a couple of times.

That is really the only potential beneficial thing about keeping Moore and if it helps Dak play better then it's worth it.

 

[casmith07]

You people have no idea how this coaching staff thinks. It's hilarious.

How was practice today, Kellen?

 

[Idgit]

Oh please. If you think Kellen Moore is going to make Dak a better starter you need your head examined. And that goes for everyone in the front office as well.

If Kellen Moore is some QB whispering genius why the **** do we need a coaching staff? This kind of thought is lazy and doesn't make any sense.

Very convincing.

If there's no sense to it, why do a significant number of teams regularly keep underperforming vets on their rosters and not just roll with their starter and a developmental rookie?

Look around the league. It happens all the time.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I'm saying a developmental QB has different things to work on than a sixth year vet. And that not having to prepare for the games with significantly limited reps gives him time to work on those things. The guy does have mechanics that can be improved.

And I'm saying, if Noodles makes Dak a better player than he could in another capacity, and can help make Rush a better player, then his presence on the roster is justified. Moore having a shot to succeed as a starter isn't the primary objective. And it's an open question what the team might do if they needed a replacement to do anything more than finish out a game.

Rush wasn't a top-100 pick, and his 50 games were at CMU. He's not as prepared as a rookie QB can be. I'd grant you he's as prepared as a MAC QB can be.

And I'm referring to him as a developmental QB because that's what he is. He's not even used to the speed and sophistication of a regular SEC schedule, much less professional defenses.

Tony Romo developed for two years at QB3. It's not like it's something team's just don't do. With a second year starter, rolling with three QBs is more sensible than rolling with only a rookie from the MAC on the roster. And if something were to happen to Dak, god forbid, we'd have a mad scramble to add a veteran to the position group to help out Rush, anyway.

You don't think he could work on mechanics as QB2? And how exactly is he supposed to prepare for the speed and sophistication of the NFL with less reps and less involvement with gameplanning?

He's played as well as any top 100 pick in the last several years.

Another things that teams do particularly in the modern era? Have their rookie QBs as QB2. Oakland did it with Cook last year and he has been better than Cook in a similar role. Hackenburg same deal. Mannion same deal. Lynch, Goff, Garoppolo, Glennon, etc.

Really the question is does he have the work ethic to handle the backup snaps, work with scout team, do the film work, and the gameplanning all the while working on his mechanics. Dak did it last year in the much more onerous starting role. Reports are that he is always working and his ethic is similar to Dak in that regard.

Meanwhile, Noodles gives us absolutely nothing on the field. He cannot even be termed a bus driver because he turns the ball over at a galling rate. Rush is the best shot we have of getting better.

 

[T-RO]

Very convincing.

If there's no sense to it, why do a significant number of teams regularly keep underperforming vets on their rosters and not just roll with their starter and a developmental rookie?

Look around the league. It happens all the time.

Maybe you got it right. If Dak is injured he can still help Cooper on the sidelines. As for Dak...the quarterback coach is there for something, right?

I do concede that perhaps there is more value to the consultative value w/Moore than I'm seeing. (But I'm still not completely seeing it)