Tate's Catch v. Dez's Non-catch Catch

[KJJ]

Sorry, I could not figure out how to freeze the shots and copy/paste them. I guess I'm just missing a lot and you aren't. maybe I'll somehow manage to go on with life.

Save yourself the trouble we've seen every shot of the play in explicit detail. You admitted you're not up on this topic like so you're wasting your time continuing with it. You sound like a reasonable guy no need getting yourself all tangled up in this mess.

 

[KJJ]

Show where being upright was part of the rule in 2014.

No, you tell me what league you officiated in and stop dancing around it. I've been asking you since January when we started arguing the Dez play and you keep diverting. You claimed you were a ref so what league did you officiate in?

 

[KJJ]

Here are all the going to the ground casebook plays:

A.R. 8.8 GOING TO THE GROUND—COMPLETE OR INCOMPLETE PASS Second-and-5 on A35. A1 throws a forward pass to A2 at the A40. A2 dives for the ball and controls the ball in the air. The first thing to hit the ground is the point of the ball. a) A2 briefly loses control of the ball when it hits the ground; or b) A2 never loses control of the ball. Rulings: a) Third-and-5 on A35. Incomplete pass. b) First-and-10 on A40.

Note: Only the control aspect of the process met...needs to maintain control through ground.

A.R. 8.9 GOING TO THE GROUND—INCOMPLETE PASS First-and-10-on A30. A1 throws a pass to A2 who dives and controls the ball while airborne at the A38, but the ball comes out as he hits the ground. Ruling: Second-and-10 on A30. The pass is incomplete, as the receiver went to the ground in the process of making the catch and did not maintain possession of the ball throughout the process of contacting the ground. 33

Note: Same as A.R.8.8

A.R. 8.10 GOING TO THE GROUND—INCOMPLETE PASS First-and-10-on B25. A1 throws a pass to A2 who controls the ball and gets one foot down before he is contacted by B1. The contact by B1 sends him across the goal line and to the ground in the end zone. The ball comes out as he hits the ground. Ruling: Second-and-10 on B25. The pass is incomplete, as the receiver went to the ground in the process of making the catch and did not maintain possession of the ball throughout the process of contacting the ground.

Note: One foot down so still in receiver status.

A.R. 8.11 GOING TO THE GROUND—COMPLETE PASS First-and-10-on A30. A1 throws a pass to A2 at the A45 who controls the ball and gets one foot down before he is contacted by B1. The contact by B1 causes A2 to go to the ground where he maintains control of the ball. Ruling: First-and-10 on A45. The pass is complete, as the receiver went to the ground in the process of making the catch and maintained possession of the ball throughout the process of contacting the ground.

Note: 3 steps not met, needs to maintain control.

A.R. 8.12 GOING TO THE GROUND—COMPLETE PASS First-and-10-on B25. A1 throws a pass to A2 who controls the ball and gets one foot down before he is contacted by B1. He goes to the ground as a result of the contact, gets his second foot down, and with the ball in his right arm, he braces himself at the three-yard line with his left hand and simultaneously lunges forward toward the goal line. When he lands in the end zone, the ball comes out. Ruling: Touchdown Team A. Kickoff A35. The pass is complete. When the receiver hits the ground in the end zone, it is the result of lunging forward after bracing himself at the three-yard line and is not part of the process of the catch. Since the ball crossed the goal line, it is a touchdown. If the ball is short of the goal line, it is a catch, and A2 is down by contact.

Note: Player completes the 3 part process thus removing himself as a receiver going to the ground.

A.R. 8.13 GOING TO THE GROUND—COMPLETE PASS First-and-10-on B25. A1 throws a pass to A2 who is contacted by a defender before he completes the catch at the three-yard line. Despite B2’s contact, A2 keeps his balance, gets both feet down, and lunges over the goal line. The ball comes out as he hits the ground. Ruling: Touchdown Team A. Kickoff A35. The receiver went to the ground as the result of lunging for the goal line, not in the process of making the catch.

Note: Again the player completes the 3 step process and is a runner.

Send it to NFL Network and ESPN and have them look at it and tell them to confront Blandino with it if you think you have it all figured out.

 

[KJJ]

I don't claim anything I WAS AN OFFICIAL.

All you've done is make a claim what league? Unless you can prove it, it's a claim.

 

[Kevinicus]

Oh, I realize I'm only an ignorant fan...hell, I openly admit it. That said, I have looked at that play dozens of times and have managed to stop the video at various points in the catch sequence. Every time, I have come to the same conclusion: Dez doesn't go down on his own on that play, in all likelihood. I wish someone else would watch that sequence (and look at Dez's body position frame by frame) and tell me what they see. (I'm basing my opinion on looking at it from a point of what would happen if the defender weren't in the position to trip him.)

I (and many others) see the same thing you do. It's possible that he still falls, but I think it's likely, especially considering his athletic ability, that he walks into the end zone. Even if he did fall, it wouldn't have been until he was well into the end zone after stumbling.

 

[KJJ]

I (and many others) see the same thing you do. It's possible that he still falls, but I think it's likely, especially considering his athletic ability, that he walks into the end zone. Even if he did fall, it wouldn't have been until he was well into the end zone after stumbling.

If he would have been stumbling well into the endzone he still would have had to hang onto the ball through the contact of the ground because he was "going to the ground." Some of you can't comprehend the RULE.

 

[blindzebra]

If he would have been stumbling well into the endzone he still would have had to hang onto the ball through the contact of the ground because he was "going to the ground." Some of you can't comprehend the RULE.

Show proof of that then.

You have yet to defend your stance with an actual rule book reference or casebook play to support your claims. All it is is blah, blah, blah Blandino says. Well since you want to paint me with an officiating where brush, just where has your boy Blandino officiated?

For the record, and several people on this board can substantiate it including several staff members, I have officiated high school and small college basketball in Kansas and Arizona. That includes multiple state tournament assignments and a state championship game. I even taught the beginning officials classes in Arizona...you know how to read and apply rule and casebooks. I will gladly put my officiating resume up against Blandino's any day of the week and 1,000,000 times on Sunday.

 

[Kevinicus]

If he would have been stumbling well into the endzone he still would have had to hang onto the ball through the contact of the ground because he was "going to the ground." Some of you can't comprehend the RULE.

And you can't comprehend anything. I wasn't even talking about the "RULE" that you don't understand. Go away, Troll.

 

[KJJ]

Show proof of that then.

You have yet to defend your stance with an actual rule book reference or casebook play to support your claims. All it is is blah, blah, blah Blandino says. Well since you want to paint me with an officiating where brush, just where has your boy Blandino officiated?

For the record, and several people on this board can substantiate it including several staff members, I have officiated high school and small college basketball in Kansas and Arizona. That includes multiple state tournament assignments and a state championship game. I even taught the beginning officials classes in Arizona...you know how to read and apply rule and casebooks. I will gladly put my officiating resume up against Blandino's any day of the week and 1,000,000 times on Sunday.

Officiating small college basketball has nothing to do with football so you're wasting your time throwing your officiating career in anyones face. My stance is defended by Blandino and the rest of the league while your stance is defended by a bunch of homers on an online FAN board. LOL I have solid backing and you don't.

 

[KJJ]

And you can't comprehend anything. I wasn't even talking about the "RULE" that you don't understand. Go away, Troll.

You don't know the RULE you just proved it you've just been dusted away. LOL

 

[KJJ]

I will gladly put my officiating resume up against Blandino's any day of the week and 1,000,000 times on Sunday.

Now let's see your resume?

A native of Bellmore, N.Y., Blandino has spent his entire professional career in football officiating. After graduating in 1993 from Hofstra University, Blandino joined the NFL for the 1994 season as an officiating intern. Following the 1994 season, he was hired full-time as an officiating video assistant and then was promoted to special projects coordinator.

Blandino was an NFL instant replay official from 1999-2003 and was selected to work as the replay official for two Super Bowls and two conference championship games. He managed the NFL instant replay program from 2003-2009, including oversight of the system’s upgrade to high definition in 2007. From 2007-2009, he was director of officiating and the number-two person in the department, supervising day-to-day operations, including managing the support staff and the game officials' schedule, under Mike Pereira.


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...ndino-named-nfl-vice-president-of-officiating

 

[percyhoward]

I was pointing out that KJJ said in one post that going to the ground trumped a football move (and everything else), but then in another post said he wasn't saying that going to the ground trumped a football move. That's what I was referring to.

I know, I did the same thing. LOL Anyway, I thought you really were unsure.

 

[jobberone]

C'mon people.

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Knock off the personal stuff

 

[blindzebra]

Officiating small college basketball has nothing to do with football so you're wasting your time throwing your officiating career in anyones face. My stance is defended by Blandino and the rest of the league while your stance is defended by a bunch of homers on an online FAN board. LOL I have solid backing and you don't.

Answer the question...what has Blandino officiated?

Another little tid bit for you. Advancing to work at the state tournament and small college level is no small feat. Instructing other officials on rules, mechanics, and game management requires advanced knowledge of those things. All sports are different but the rule book and casebooks are not in how they are constructed and how one goes about applying that information to the field or court.

I am willing to bet you have not even read a rule book let alone held one in your hands, reading it so much it becomes worn and spending the time needed to understand and apply its contents in real action with crowds screaming, coaches being coaches, and keeping up with players up and down the court.

It is easy to sit back and belittle people when you can hide behind a keyboard. I know what I have done, what I know about rules, and how those rules are meant to be applied. I don't need to prove any of that to anyone, especially someone like you.

 

[blindzebra]

Now let's see your resume?

A native of Bellmore, N.Y., Blandino has spent his entire professional career in football officiating. After graduating in 1993 from Hofstra University, Blandino joined the NFL for the 1994 season as an officiating intern. Following the 1994 season, he was hired full-time as an officiating video assistant and then was promoted to special projects coordinator.

Blandino was an NFL instant replay official from 1999-2003 and was selected to work as the replay official for two Super Bowls and two conference championship games. He managed the NFL instant replay program from 2003-2009, including oversight of the system’s upgrade to high definition in 2007. From 2007-2009, he was director of officiating and the number-two person in the department, supervising day-to-day operations, including managing the support staff and the game officials' schedule, under Mike Pereira.


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...ndino-named-nfl-vice-president-of-officiating

So he was in the AV room while I was on the court. He has no officiating experience, he has never been on the field or applied rules in real time. He was in tech support, he wasn't an official.

 

[jobberone]

One or two are going to be benched if this continues. No more warnings.

 

[KJJ]

Blandino has officiated you don't have to be on the field to officiate.

Blandino was an NFL instant replay official from 1999-2003 and was selected to work as the replay official for two Super Bowls and two conference championship games. He managed the NFL instant replay program from 2003-2009, including oversight of the system’s upgrade to high definition in 2007. From 2007-2009, he was director of officiating and the number-two person in the department, supervising day-to-day operations, including managing the support staff and the game officials' schedule, under Mike Pereira.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...ndino-named-nfl-vice-president-of-officiating

 

[percyhoward]

Sorry, I could not figure out how to freeze the shots and copy/paste them. .

 

[LandryFan]

Thanks for doing that. Picture 1 is what I was referring to in my earlier post. Dez's right foot (on the ground) is his second step. His body position is about as upright as can be given that he is running. How can one surmise, with 100% certainty, that a normal person, much less an athlete of Dez's caliber, would fall if not tripped here? I can understand a fan coming up with that conclusion, but not a professional official.
At any rate, thanks again for posting that!