The one player missing syndrome v the cap

[Diehardblues]

Jerry traditionally doesn’t extend his coaches until their contract is up. Similar to Garretts contract last time.

Jones has generally defended his head coach, and said he wasn’t “on shaky ground.”

During his interview on 105.3 The Fan , Jones said Garrett was a “great safety net for everything that we’re going to do with a young staff like we’ve got. I think we’re in an ideal position.”

IMO some fans and media are spinning that Garrett is on thin ice because Jerry hadn’t extended him yet but it’s actually normal protocol for Jerry.

 

[DandyDon52]

Well, it could be a fact. I don't think we need to just dismiss that. I don't believe Jones has publicly promised Garrett more than this season, so this could be a make-or-break year. I wouldn't label it lame duck because that indicates, at least to me, that he's gone no matter what.

Here's what Jerry said in January on choosing not to extend Garrett then that I think presents both sides of it, where Jones both praises Garrett, but says the team needs to do better:

"None of that is anything that I would talk about in this forum in any way and so we won't get there," Jones told the station. "I think I've made clear how I feel about Jason in terms of where he is right now as far as our ability to help us win football games. I think if you look at what we've done over the last few years you'll see a pretty good winning record there. [But] it's not enough, not enough."

Now, the question is what is "enough"? Jones doesn't quantify it and I'm not sure it's quantifiable to him. At this point, I think we have to consider the possibilities that we could be worse than we were last year and Garrett could get extended or we could be better and Garrett could still end up being fired. I'm not going to spend too much time trying to puzzle it out because I can't pretend to fully understand Jones logic.

I agree, you / we dont know what jones boys
are thinking, or what they will do, could be anything.
I will remind though that jerry also said he wanted to win JG a super bowl and if they could do that, then jason would be signed long term.

 

[Stash]

I agree, you / we dont know what jones boys
are thinking, or what they will do, could be anything.
I will remind though that jerry also said he wanted to win JG a super bowl and if they could do that, then jason would be signed long term.

If Garrett can do that, why wouldn't he be signed long term? Even as a staunch critic, I couldn't legitimately take issue with the team giving a Super Bowl winning coach a long-term contract extension.

If someone hits the mark's and reaches the ultimate goal of their position, they've earned it.

 

[gimmesix]

I agree, you / we dont know what jones boys
are thinking, or what they will do, could be anything.
I will remind though that jerry also said he wanted to win JG a super bowl and if they could do that, then jason would be signed long term.

If Garrett wins a Super Bowl, he'll probably be signed for life.

 

[Diehardblues]

If Garrett wins a Super Bowl, he'll probably be signed for life.

Those are no brainer decisions. It’s like calling a QB elite cause he wins a SB. Any casual fan can make such a claim.

But it takes a keener eye to evaluate those who aren’t on championship caliber teams. It’s why we have individual awards for players and coaches to recognize those who have excelled despite the team’s success.

 

[Diehardblues]

If Garrett was to receive more credit than Jerry if they win a SB like Jimmy did it could get Garrett fired.

I can’t foresee Jason becoming a bigger ego like Jimmy but it’s the one factor that could definitely get him fired.

Jason so far has been the perfect puppet for Jerry but success could change that.

 

[Cowboysheelsreds053]

In the last year of the contract? No, that's probable. As probable as it gets. If Jones wanted an excuse to keep him around, the playoff appearance and win was it. He actively chose not to. Now, nothing short of a Championship Game appearance will sell. Jones intentionally put himself, his head coach, and his team in this position. Even his patience has run out.

This, no PO or do not advance far and as they say on Duck Dynasty "HE GONE".

 

[Stash]

This, no PO or do not advance far and as they say on Duck Dynasty "HE GONE".

Absolutely.

Jones said they needed to do better. And better means further in the playoffs, that's an easy thing to measure.

But there are some folks, who's sad numbers continue to dwindle, huddled in a corner because they "can't quit" Jason Garrett. At this point I'm just hopeful that they go when he does.

 

[gimmesix]

Those are no brainer decisions. It’s like calling a QB elite cause he wins a SB. Any casual fan can make such a claim.

But it takes a keener eye to evaluate those who aren’t on championship caliber teams. It’s why we have individual awards for players and coaches to recognize those who have excelled despite the team’s success.

Very true. With coaches, though, there has to be a point in evaluation where winning, or not winning, has to override anything else in the process. Their job is team success. There are few coaches like Garrett to get their team to a Super Bowl if they have not led them to one after the first few years. Now, there also are few coaches who get to stick with a team as long as Garrett has if they haven't won a Super Bowl or even gotten to an NFC Championship Game.

So while I am adamant about not judging quarterbacks (or other players) on the team's record, I think you ultimately have to do it with coaches, but only over a span of time, though, because they do have to build a team and there are mitigating factors.

 

[gimmesix]

Absolutely.

Jones said they needed to do better. And better means further in the playoffs, that's an easy thing to measure.

But there are some folks, who's sad numbers continue to dwindle, huddled in a corner because they "can't quit" Jason Garrett. At this point I'm just hopeful that they go when he does.

I think that's too simplified because there are factors that could effect the end result.

What if Dallas has another 13-3 season, but loses in the playoffs because of a play like the Dez "drop"? I can't see Jones firing Garrett, if that happened, just because the Cowboys didn't get "further in the playoffs."

If we have another playoff performance like the Rams game, where Garrett and his staff were clearly outcoached, then that makes the decision easier IMO.

If we lose a star player to injury, then the excuse is built in for Garrett no matter how we finish. For instance, do you think Garrett will be held to the same standard if he's having to play White or Rush instead of Prescott?

I want Garrett gone, but I don't think it is cut and dried that he will be only because the team doesn't have greater playoff success. The reasons that happens will have to outweigh the excuses for it, and then Jerry has been so enamored with Garrett that even that might not end up being enough.

 

[DandyDon52]

If Garrett can do that, why wouldn't he be signed long term? Even as a staunch critic, I couldn't legitimately take issue with the team giving a Super Bowl winning coach a long-term contract extension.

If someone hits the mark's and reaches the ultimate goal of their position, they've earned it.

Well 1st they have to win a SB, but the key words were "WE want to win JG a SB"
Normally it is the coach that wins a SB for the owner.
I dont think they can win one with JG, and if it happened, do you really think JG could win more SB's??
I think if the players take it upon themselves to win one in spite of the coaches, it might be possible, that is what
happened with Barry Switzer.

 

[Stash]

I think that's too simplified because there are factors that could effect the end result.

What if Dallas has another 13-3 season, but loses in the playoffs because of a play like the Dez "drop"? I can't see Jones firing Garrett, if that happened, just because the Cowboys didn't get "further in the playoffs."

If we have another playoff performance like the Rams game, where Garrett and his staff were clearly outcoached, then that makes the decision easier IMO.

Best of luck waiting and hoping for that 'get out of jail free' situation to occur.

If we lose a star player to injury, then the excuse is built in for Garrett no matter how we finish. For instance, do you think Garrett will be held to the same standard if he's having to play White or Rush instead of Prescott?

I want Garrett gone, but I don't think it is cut and dried that he will be only because the team doesn't have greater playoff success. The reasons that happens will have to outweigh the excuses for it, and then Jerry has been so enamored with Garrett that even that might not end up being enough.

I'll agree to disagree. I think that barring a Super Bowl Championship, if one of the coaches on Jones shortlist is available - Payton or Riley - Garrett is gone.

That's just my opinion, but I saw enough smoke to feel that if either guy wanted the job this year, Garrett would be gone already.

 

[Stash]

Well 1st they have to win a SB, but the key words were "WE want to win JG a SB"
Normally it is the coach that wins a SB for the owner.
I dont think they can win one with JG, and if it happened, do you really think JG could win more SB's??
I think if the players take it upon themselves to win one in spite of the coaches, it might be possible, that is what
happened with Barry Switzer.

If he managed to win one, how could you not feel that he could win more?

 

[CouchCoach]

Unfortunately, I believe unless the Cowboys have a complete collapse- something below 6-10, I think Jerry keeps Garrett. Too few around here remember that Jerry doesn’t select HCs based on the question, “Who gives us the best chance to win a championship?” Jerry selects his HC based on two questions: 1. Who will allow me to be comfortable doing whatever I want with this team? 2. Who can work under these conditions and still help us possibly win?

In other words, Jerry Jones doesn’t think like any of us fans or as a typical NFL executive possessed with winning a championship. He definitely stays true to his own compass which is always pointing to himself and what he wants. He doesn’t want a coach that could possibly steal any of the “credit” and limelight he craves.

So, Garrett will be here next year. And as many years as Jerry wants this strange arrangement. Jerry is even willing to make excuses for his red headed step son’s failures. If the team falters this year, look for an assistant coach or coordinator to be the scapegoat. That’s the way Jerry uses accountability. It’s for mid level folks, not the people at the top.

Booger is going to do what's best for Booger and I have no problem with that.

Who in the hell are we to complain about how a man run's his business? You don't like the way the owner runs the cleaners, you find another. You don't like a restaurant, you find another.

For some odd reason, we think this team is held in the public trust and is not a private enterprise. That part of owning it comes accountability to the fans, it doesn't. He doesn't owe anyone anything.

He wants to run his business in a way that makes him comfortable and the only reason people hire others to run their business is because they don't want to or they have to and he qualifies as neither.

Every person on here, it is their choice whether to financially support this business or just give it their time. I find it nuts that people complain and then talk about going to Booger's Big Top for a game. That's like saying I can't stand "The Titanic" but am going to see it again. And you go to James Cameron's house and pay to watch it.

Posters, Booger owes you nothing. Even if you are a season ticket holder, he didn't force you to do that. It is his business and I believe he does the best part-time GM job he can and I've accepted that and decided to remain a fan. I have never financially given him anything but I still consider myself a Cowboys fan.

Whether Garrett is a puppet or not doesn't matter but he's does a pretty decent job of influencing Booger to change his thinking. It is laughable that anyone here thinks Booger can be forced to let Garrett walk. He will let him walk if that inner circle can convince him he could be just as happy with another HC but there's no question now, if Garrett takes this team to the SB, Booger is getting the lion's share of credit for that. Another HC, like Payton, and that is not the case and in fact could reverse on him. Payton got him a ring is the way that could sell. You and I could care less, we don't care who gets credit but we are not driven by that goal either.

 

[DandyDon52]

If he managed to win one, how could you not feel that he could win more?

I will explain that when JG wins a SB.

 

[Number1]

"one player" can cause many issues

like no Frederick or not resigning Cooper or no D1 since Rod arrived
if any of those on the field ... a very different 2018 season

when it's high profile it just creates more chatter

I forgot to mention David Irving as one of the non-participants who might have changed the the Ram game

 

[DandyDon52]

if Garrett takes this team to the SB, Booger is getting the lion's share of credit for that

From who?? I dont think anyone would give him much credit, except that he stuck with JG for so long.
But I dont think that will happen so it is a non issue.
I think jerry would have to win like 2 to 3 in 5 year period to get any real credit.
I dont think it is about credit with him, he just likes doing what he does, he enjoys it, and that is why he does it, not for some "credit"
What he does is the cake, and winning SB or just getting there is just the icing on the cake.
Ans sure he wants some icing, but the cake is what he enjoys.

 

[Diehardblues]

From who?? I dont think anyone would give him much credit, except that he stuck with JG for so long.
But I dont think that will happen so it is a non issue.
I think jerry would have to win like 2 to 3 in 5 year period to get any real credit.
I dont think it is about credit with him, he just likes doing what he does, he enjoys it, and that is why he does it, not for some "credit"
What he does is the cake, and winning SB or just getting there is just the icing on the cake.
Ans sure he wants some icing, but the cake is what he enjoys.

Of course we’re giving Jerry credit.

Can’t blame him for the last 25 years and not give him credit.

I’m one of his biggest critics . Bash him at every turn but if he brings it home with Garrett he will get his due. It won’t dismiss the last two decades but it will be his.

 

[cern]

Great coaches get more out of lesser talent. Poor coaches get less out of great talent. In every game the opponent has 2-3 players that must be accounted for on both sides of the ball. Garrett coaches "system " football. He does not coach to neutralize weapons a la belichik. This is where he fails.

 

[Diehardblues]

I think that's too simplified because there are factors that could effect the end result.

What if Dallas has another 13-3 season, but loses in the playoffs because of a play like the Dez "drop"? I can't see Jones firing Garrett, if that happened, just because the Cowboys didn't get "further in the playoffs."

If we have another playoff performance like the Rams game, where Garrett and his staff were clearly outcoached, then that makes the decision easier IMO.

If we lose a star player to injury, then the excuse is built in for Garrett no matter how we finish. For instance, do you think Garrett will be held to the same standard if he's having to play White or Rush instead of Prescott?

I want Garrett gone, but I don't think it is cut and dried that he will be only because the team doesn't have greater playoff success. The reasons that happens will have to outweigh the excuses for it, and then Jerry has been so enamored with Garrett that even that might not end up being enough.

It’s not “ cut and dried” . He’s just spinning it to fit his narrative. That’s fine. It’s what he believes, I guess. If I believed it I’d probably spin it too.