The proof is in the pudding VT was better than Bledsoe

[CF74]

just another fishing thread in the big D

 

[Nors]

Bledsoe scored more points, won more games and played behind a worse Oline. I'd also bet run production was down.

Testaverde was upside down TD's Ints and Bledsoe positive.

You can have VT.

 

[superpunk]

That's what he posted, I thought it was pretty clear.

I didn't respond to that post, and completely missed it. If that's what he was referring to, my apologies to ABCOWBOY. I don't believe that you can read the post I responded to, and draw that conclusion, but my bad for missing the original.

 

[superpunk]

Bledsoe scored more points, won more games and played behind a worse Oline. I'd also bet run production was down.

Testaverde was upside down TD's Ints and Bledsoe positive.

You can have VT.

Run production, yes, I believe we averaged more ypc. But, overall, we gained more YPG.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

If Dallas goes 9-7 last season, then the opposing records would be 104-104. (Check my math, I could be wrong). That would mean that Dallas would have had an easier schedule.

Dallas played 6 games against playoff teams in 2004 and 7 in 2005. Slight edge to 2005 being the more difficult schedule.

I see where your going but I don't agree. It makes little difference in the end. 3 games difference on the scope of 208 games total is minor. If you add up all the games won and lost by everybody on the schedule, for each season respectively, you come up with 107 won vs 101 lost. This, to me, does not support the position that one was more difficult then the other.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

"The win loss is the same for both years but the overall talent level of the 04 Cowboys team is much worse then the 05 team."

That's what you said. Guess I should just be a mind reader, because your writing skills sure don't get your brain's point across.

If it makes you feel better to believe as such, then by all means, continue.

 

[joseephuss]

Perhaps but there is no credible proof that Parcells believes Vinnie was not as capable. The fact is that they played, statistically, very close to the same level. The difference between the two was not there individual play but the quality of the over all teams in respective years.

I said it earlier and I will re-state it here. If you ask me who is better, I would say Bledsoe but the margin of difference is neglitable IMO.

The problem here is that Bledsoe was supposed to be a substantial upgrade and I don't believe he's proven to be that. That was the whole reason for going with a Veteran QB as opposed to somebody younger. Last year I was asked who would have been better options out there. At the time, I said that I thought Kurt Warner, Rob Johnson and Brian Griese would all have been options for us. Nobody believed me then. I think that if you look at what each of those QBs were able to accomplish this year, you would have to say that all of those QBs have proven that they could still play at a relatively high level. The one thing that Bledsoe has on all of them is is durability. That, I think, must be said.

I would say the upgrade in Bledsoe over Vinny was more than negligable. I never thought it would be a huge upgrade, but he was better.

Did anyone ever sign Rob Johnson? He became a huge disappointment in Buffaloe. That place must be cursed. He and Warner would have been the same as Drew. They don't have pocket presence. Kurt had it at one time with the Rams, but you could see that disappear over the years. I do like all three of them better than Vinny, but they would have been about the same as Drew in Dallas.

Your point about durability is the most important part. Rob Johnson and Brian Griese would be injured behind this line in Dallas and I think Kurt Warner may have wound up dead.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Bledsoe scored more points, won more games and played behind a worse Oline. I'd also bet run production was down.

Testaverde was upside down TD's Ints and Bledsoe positive.

You can have VT.

How do you quantify your position on the OL?

 

[joseephuss]

I see where your going but I don't agree. It makes little difference in the end. 3 games difference on the scope of 208 games total is minor. If you add up all the games won and lost by everybody on the schedule, for each season respectively, you come up with 107 won vs 101 lost. This, to me, does not support the position that one was more difficult then the other.

And that was my point when I responded to Zaxor saying 2004 was clearly the harder schedule. There is nothing clear about this stuff.



Except for the fact that Vinny sucks.

 

[Kilyin]

Bill never said it was Bledsoe's fault - ever.

I believe it was in a PC, but he did imply that. All I could find about it now was:

September 21, 2005
Quarterback Drew Bledsoe has struggled taking the snap from centers Al Johnson and Andre Gurode. Bledsoe fumbled in the first quarter against San Diego and lost the ball twice against Washington. "We work on it every day," Parcells said. "I think it's carelessness." Parcells said Bledsoe and both centers have been at fault, but one of Bledsoe's fumbles occurred because the ball was snapped on the wrong count.

 

[aznhalf]

How do you quantify your position on the OL?

LT is by far the most important position on the line for a right handed QB.

A team will exploit a bad LT for all its worth. Teams loaded up on Tucker this year and it showed. We had to shift our entire blocking scheme based on this. You can't go through the line positions like they're weighted equally. Saying we had a worse Guard and Center in 04 isn't as bad as having a joke for a Left Tackle.

Getting a heavy blindside rush every play will shake anyones confidence. I think Bledose performed very well considering that.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I would say the upgrade in Bledsoe over Vinny was more than negligable. I never thought it would be a huge upgrade, but he was better.

Did anyone ever sign Rob Johnson? He became a huge disappointment in Buffaloe. That place must be cursed. He and Warner would have been the same as Drew. They don't have pocket presence. Kurt had it at one time with the Rams, but you could see that disappear over the years. I do like all three of them better than Vinny, but they would have been about the same as Drew in Dallas.

Your point about durability is the most important part. Rob Johnson and Brian Griese would be injured behind this line in Dallas and I think Kurt Warner may have wound up dead.

I don't agree but that is OK. My appoligies on the Johnson's. I meant to say Brad. If I said Rob, that was my mistake. Sorry. Brad Johnson had one heck of a season once he finally got an opportunity. He did it under much much worse conditions as well. As for Griese, while healthy, he was able to post a record of 5-1. As for being sacked, he played under much the same OL conditions as Drew. He averaged 2 sacks a game in Tampa Bay to start the season. Warner arguably played behind a worse OL in AZ. However, he had better production.

The point I'm trying to get across is that there were options out there. We simply elected to go in a different direction.

 

[Kilyin]

Vinny had a better OL, because Rob "Turnstile" Pettiti wasn't in it.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

LT is by far the most important position on the line for a right handed QB.

A team will exploit a bad LT for all its worth. Teams loaded up on Tucker this year and it showed. We had to shift our entire blocking scheme based on this. You can't go through the line positions like they're weighted equally. Saying we had a worse Guard and Center in 04 isn't as bad as having a joke for a Left Tackle.

Getting a heavy blindside rush every play will shake anyones confidence. I think Bledose performed very well considering that.

It's true that LT is the most important but that doesn't mean the OL play in 05 was worse then 04. To be honest, Adams didn't have a great season it 04. Allen didn't either. Johnson wasn't there, the Right Guard was no where as good as the one we had this year and Garcia isn't that good. RT was a joke last year. We were bringing guys in off the street to play RT. I just don't see how anybody can say the line play was superior in 04.

 

[Kilyin]

RT was a joke last year. We were bringing guys in off the street to play RT. I just don't see how anybody can say the line play was superior in 04..

It was a bigger joke this year by far. Guys off the street couldn't have done any worse than Pettiti. I don't care who's feelings get hurt, but this kid shouldn't be a starting Tackle on ANY team.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Vinny had a better OL, because Rob "Turnstile" Pettiti wasn't in it.

Kurt Vollers, Tucker and the two or three other yahoo's were that much better in 04?

 

[aznhalf]

It's true that LT is the most important but that doesn't mean the OL play in 05 was worse then 04. To be honest, Adams didn't have a great season it 04. Allen didn't either. Johnson wasn't there, the Right Guard was no where as good as the one we had this year and Garcia isn't that good. RT was a joke last year. We were bringing guys in off the street to play RT. I just don't see how anybody can say the line play was superior in 04.

RT is just as bad this year.

Adams had a good enough season that teams did not target him, or overload his side. Tucker had a bullseye on him. When you're tackles are bad you have keep more guys in to block(less options). When a guard or center is bad you can shift protection.

 

[speedkilz88]

Kurt Vollers, Tucker and the two or three other yahoo's were that much better in 04?

Kurt Vollers is by far the superior pass protector of the three. So I would have rather had him as Bledsoe's RT.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

RT is just as bad this year.

Adams had a good enough season that teams did not target him, or overload his side. Tucker had a bullseye on him. When you're tackles are bad you have keep more guys in to block(less options). When a guard or center is bad you can shift protection.

Why would you overload Adams when you can just as easily bring it from the other side? Bottom line, Pettite started all 16 games. While not great, he could not have been as bad as last year or we would have replaced him. All you have to do is look at what happened in 04 to confirm this. You don't sign guys one week and play them on Sunday unless your at your lowest point. I agree that RT was terrible this year but it was not as bad as last year.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Kurt Vollers is by far the superior pass protector of the three. So I would have rather had him as Bledsoe's RT.

Kurt Vollers is not even on the team this year. This would seem to suggest that the talent of Pettite is better then Vollers in BPs estimation.