The Upgrade Everyone Was Ranting About

[Doc50]

This is true.. but as bad as they suck, the coaching staff and owner sucks worse. 20 years worth of sucking.

Weren't they magicians last year?

 

[Zman5]

Yeah, that's fair.

Actually, most of it is inaccurate.

Weeden and Romo have almost exactly the same yardage per attempt this season, 7.0 yards and 7.2 yards respectively. The league average is 6.7 yards. Cassel has 4.0 yards.

When it comes to yards per catch Weeden has 10.4 yards, Romo 10.2 and Cassel 10.8. Glaring difference, right? All that "throwing down the field"?

Weeden was the starter for the Cleveland Browns Day #1 his rookie year in 2012. He was 5-15 as a starter. .The Browns were 4-8 the rest of the games those two seasons.

Troy Aikman was 3-17 in his first 20 starts. He had an 11 game losing streak.

Cassel didn't start a game until his 4th season and it was with a team that went undefeated during it's previous regular season. So yeah....real fair.

40 quarterbacks have thrown 50 or more passes this season. Tony Romo is ranked 20th in adjusted yards per catch. (pass yards + 20*(pass TD) - 45*(interceptions thrown))/(passing attempts). Weeden is ranked 21st. Cassel is dead last.

Weeden's QB rating is better than half the starters in this league, including Cam Newton, Andrew Luck, Sam Bradford, Joe Flaco, and Peyton Manning. Cassel is dead last.

Saying that "Weeden sucks" contributes absolutely nothing to this conversation because it is an opinion based on nothing measurable or relevant to the circumstances.

Weeden could produced the same results as Cassel with little to no assistance from his team and against teams where two of the three were undefeated at the time.

If Weeden started the last two games with all the additional help that Cassel received in the way of a running game, defense, and Dez Bryant on the field, the Cowboys would be sitting at 4-3.

And one more thing.....Starting Cassel had all the markings of a Jerry Jones decision. Jason Garrett would never imply this, he is a team player but I just can;'t see the former QB making that type of decision.

I guess what you are saying is JG is a total idiot for not seeing the obvious.

 

[Super_Kazuya]

FWIW, I caught Jaworski on Philly radio and he said that the Cowboys made a mistake benching Weeden for Cassel. But his stance wasn't based on the fact that Weeden is so much better but that Weeden has been in the system and it's tough to expect much from a QB who has only been around for 3-4 weeks.

It was not necessarily a mistake to bench Weeden; perhaps an overreaction to a bad performance against the Super Bowl champs after two solid if unspectacular games. Weeden is a backup; he has no ego to manage. He can be replaced or inserted on a whim. The problem is when you make a move like this and the guy you bring in is worse, which Cassel has been. It's a bad look for the coaches, but during this 0-5 run what else is new?

 

[jobberone]

Weeden would not throw the ball to intermediate or deep routes enough. When he did he was at risk for an INT way above avg and his completion rate was subpar. I don't know the targets by Cassel but by eyeball he is at least throwing the ball in a semblance of a NFL offense.

The completion rates and QBR are not helpful. A QB is going to have a high completion rate and rating throwing the ball to short routes. The further down the field the less the completion rates for most QBs most games. Therefore Weeden looks better just looking at those. That's not helpful in assessing who can drive the offense.

The SC% is important as you CAN dink and dunk down the field if the team is disciplined and can play ball. But it gets harder and harder as the game goes by as that shortens the field and becomes predictable. A more balanced offense is better.

To address the play action some have complained about, it was used. Perhaps it wasn't enough but you can't wear that play out either. You have to hand the ball off enough to keep them honest and not truly know if pass or run. And obviously you have to run effectively to make it work anyway.

Cassel gets the nod although he better pick up the pace these last few games.

Romo will come out throwing the ball well despite those who think he'll need a few games to get going. Maybe a quarter but he'll have practice time and he's needs little at this point in his career.

 

[Bleu Star]

Yes. Stats tell the whole story...

I'll say one thing... You guys are relentless. I guess we just want a QB carousel until Romo returns. Let's just chalk up 7 or 8 losses in a row why not?

Cassell barely knows the offense and will become comfortable enough running it to start winning some games. Stats aren't everything. They only tell half truths.

Give me a Brandon Weeden that has only been in our system for 4 weeks and I will show you and even bigger quarterbacking disaster than he has been.

I feel you man... I feel you.

 

[neosapien23]

The real question is why wasn't Kellen Moore given a chance? Both Matt Cassel and Brandon Weeden have enough game tape to know they suck. When Weeden was benched the coaching staff should have given Moore a shot. He probably would have still lost but at least he is not a proven loser. You got to give the unkown a chance vs going with methods that have already been proven to fail.

 

[LocimusPrime]

Yeah, that's fair.

Actually, most of it is inaccurate.

Weeden and Romo have almost exactly the same yardage per attempt this season, 7.0 yards and 7.2 yards respectively. The league average is 6.7 yards. Cassel has 4.0 yards.

When it comes to yards per catch Weeden has 10.4 yards, Romo 10.2 and Cassel 10.8. Glaring difference, right? All that "throwing down the field"?

Weeden was the starter for the Cleveland Browns Day #1 his rookie year in 2012. He was 5-15 as a starter. .The Browns were 4-8 the rest of the games those two seasons.

Troy Aikman was 3-17 in his first 20 starts. He had an 11 game losing streak.

Cassel didn't start a game until his 4th season and it was with a team that went undefeated during it's previous regular season. So yeah....real fair.

40 quarterbacks have thrown 50 or more passes this season. Tony Romo is ranked 20th in adjusted yards per catch. (pass yards + 20*(pass TD) - 45*(interceptions thrown))/(passing attempts). Weeden is ranked 21st. Cassel is dead last.

Weeden's QB rating is better than half the starters in this league, including Cam Newton, Andrew Luck, Sam Bradford, Joe Flaco, and Peyton Manning. Cassel is dead last.

Saying that "Weeden sucks" contributes absolutely nothing to this conversation because it is an opinion based on nothing measurable or relevant to the circumstances.

Weeden could produced the same results as Cassel with little to no assistance from his team and against teams where two of the three were undefeated at the time.

If Weeden started the last two games with all the additional help that Cassel received in the way of a running game, defense, and Dez Bryant on the field, the Cowboys would be sitting at 4-3.

And one more thing.....Starting Cassel had all the markings of a Jerry Jones decision. Jason Garrett would never imply this, he is a team player but I just can;'t see the former QB making that type of decision.

One stat everyone is forgetting. Weeden is a loser. Some guys have that "it factor" call it presence/ command of game/ luck whatever you prefer. They just win. Oh and please dont mention Troy and Weeden in the same sentence, paragraph, or post.

 

[hornitosmonster]

Weeden would have helped the Cowboys to win that game. It may not have been big plays, but it would have been efficient and effective.

Nope. Seattle would have feasted on Weeden inability to move or find WR's. Outcome would have been the same or worse.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

After Weeden showed all he could and would do is checkdown, despite having been in the system for two full years, you had to try something different. The WR's were simply excluded from the offense and defense's were feasting on that.

Trying Cassel is something 100% of the teams in the NFL would have done in the same situation. Many would be trying Moore at this point. Someone that you can get a little something different out of. Maybe Moore's ability to read the defense quickly ( a trait he shares with Romo) would make up for the fact that he has a weenie arm. It couldn't really hurt at this point.

 

[Sasquatch]

It was not necessarily a mistake to bench Weeden; perhaps an overreaction to a bad performance against the Super Bowl champs after two solid if unspectacular games. Weeden is a backup; he has no ego to manage. He can be replaced or inserted on a whim. The problem is when you make a move like this and the guy you bring in is worse, which Cassel has been. It's a bad look for the coaches, but during this 0-5 run what else is new?

Panic in the face of adversity and ill-advised in retrospect, if for no other reason than we gave up a 5th round draft pick for more ineptitude.

 

[RS12]

The Upgrade Everyone Was Ranting About

Never ranted or thought it was an upgrade. Went from blue Geo Metro to red Geo Metro.

 

[CyberB0b]

You see all of those plays where Cassel had enough sense to run for first downs? Okay those are all either sacks or incomplete passes. If you watch the games you can atleast tell Cassel has confidence. In reality he's not much better than Weeden if it at all but atleast he believes he can win. Weeden doesn't have any confidence himself.

Did you see the last drive of the game?

That doesn't look like confidence to me. It looks like a lost puppy dog.

 

[65fastback2plus2]

The stats show an interesting picture, but there are other factors that should be considered. Weeden had a long time, including two off-seasons and a massive amount of first team reps due to Romo's back situation to work with the first team offense. Through all of that, he could only show that he is a bad QB that cannot process beyond his second read. Other teams watch game film, so they know that.

shhhhh....please, no more facts!

 

[percyhoward]

This is why stats tell you almost nothing. The stats say Weedman is the same as Romo..

No, this is why sample size is important.

Last 3 games
Carr 114.9
Winston 110.5
Ryan 95.4
Rodgers 88.1

If you compare a legit sample size, Weeden is (of course) nowhere near the same as Romo.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

The only game in which the Cowboys looked like they were running an "NFL-style" offense, since Romo was injured, was game 6.

You run that offense with a couple less picks, and you've got an offense that is good enough to win in the short-term.

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

To bad we cannot go through 20 QBs of the caliber of Weeden and Cassel to finally realize that the fault might lie within the COACHING, ITS VANILLA GAME PLAN AND A HC who the players consider to be one of them and not a figure to fear if and when their production fail.

In the final urinalysis, when we run out of things to point at, it might strike us that a HC change might be what jump-starts this team.

 

[Craig]

People are kind of avoiding the point of this thread for some reason.

The point of the thread is that weeden would have won a game that cassel didnt? I dont think so. They both suck.

 

[PA Cowboy Fan]

Did you see the last drive of the game?

That doesn't look like confidence to me. It looks like a lost puppy dog.

I was standing right by my TV yelling: Don't take a sack. Throw it away if you have to. And that fool took a sack. Dez's monkey could have done better.

 

[Craig]

Yeah, that's fair.

Actually, most of it is inaccurate.

Weeden and Romo have almost exactly the same yardage per attempt this season, 7.0 yards and 7.2 yards respectively. The league average is 6.7 yards. Cassel has 4.0 yards.

When it comes to yards per catch Weeden has 10.4 yards, Romo 10.2 and Cassel 10.8. Glaring difference, right? All that "throwing down the field"?

Weeden was the starter for the Cleveland Browns Day #1 his rookie year in 2012. He was 5-15 as a starter. .The Browns were 4-8 the rest of the games those two seasons.

Troy Aikman was 3-17 in his first 20 starts. He had an 11 game losing streak.

Cassel didn't start a game until his 4th season and it was with a team that went undefeated during it's previous regular season. So yeah....real fair.

40 quarterbacks have thrown 50 or more passes this season. Tony Romo is ranked 20th in adjusted yards per catch. (pass yards + 20*(pass TD) - 45*(interceptions thrown))/(passing attempts). Weeden is ranked 21st. Cassel is dead last.

Weeden's QB rating is better than half the starters in this league, including Cam Newton, Andrew Luck, Sam Bradford, Joe Flaco, and Peyton Manning. Cassel is dead last.

Saying that "Weeden sucks" contributes absolutely nothing to this conversation because it is an opinion based on nothing measurable or relevant to the circumstances.

Weeden could produced the same results as Cassel with little to no assistance from his team and against teams where two of the three were undefeated at the time.

If Weeden started the last two games with all the additional help that Cassel received in the way of a running game, defense, and Dez Bryant on the field, the Cowboys would be sitting at 4-3.

And one more thing.....Starting Cassel had all the markings of a Jerry Jones decision. Jason Garrett would never imply this, he is a team player but I just can;'t see the former QB making that type of decision.

This is a lot of i formation but youre looking at it in a vacuum. The running game improved at least in part because there was a threat of the ball being thrown past the line of scrimmage. Cassel has been bad but weeden's "high" rating is worthless when he has a drive in which hes 3/3 for 7 yards and they go 3 and out.

 

[DandyDon1722]

It's like picking your favorite two of Curly, Larry & Moe.