Vandy Should Be Blamed, But What About Romo & His 2 Red Zone INTs?!?

[joseephuss]

I guess its a matter of perspective. I doubt many fans in Denver or SF would agree that Elway and Montana were run first, pass second QBs. The fact that you call them scrambling QBs who just happened to be good passers is laughable. They are agile but I don't think if you look in the dictionary under scrambling/running QBs that Montana or Elway are going to be pictured.

Niether is McNabb. He is a pass first, run second guy.

 

[itoldyouSOE]

Niether is McNabb. He is a pass first, run second guy.

With a straight face, are you telling us that McNabb and Montana have similar styles of play. That when you think of McNabb, you think of Montana.

Sorry, but the closest comparison to Montana I can make is Tom Brady. Though I like McNabb (hate the Iggles), I can't seem to find it in myself to compare his style of play to that of Joe Cool.

 

[JackMagist]

Romo has a little Brett Favre in him. I think he relied more on ability than caution with his interception on the Crayton throw.

Romo is what he is. That "little Favre in him" or that "sandlot" player is just the way he does it and he does it better than anyone else except maybe Favre himself. It is what makes him a little special and if you take that away from him he will be no more just an average QB.

I disagree on the Crayton INT...Crayton should have been where the ball went. He ran a lazy route on that play and was not where his QB expected him to be; I'm sure he will hear about that this week. But I suppose ultimately an INT is an INT and it will always count against the QB's stats. I'm not saying that Romo did not make some mistakes; he most certainly did. But I do not hold him completely responsible for that one particular play.

 

[Rack]

With a straight face, are you telling us that McNabb and Montana have similar styles of play. That when you think of McNabb, you think of Montana.

Sorry, but the closest comparison to Montana I can make is Tom Brady. Though I like McNabb (hate the Iggles), I can't seem to find it in myself to compare his style of play to that of Joe Cool.

I'm not even in on the conversation and I can see the insane amount of spin doctoring going on in that post.



And Brady plays nothing like Montana played.

 

[tyke1doe]

I guess its a matter of perspective. I doubt many fans in Denver or SF would agree that Elway and Montana were run first, pass second QBs. The fact that you call them scrambling QBs who just happened to be good passers is laughable. They are agile but I don't think if you look in the dictionary under scrambling/running QBs that Montana or Elway are going to be pictured.

Well, I could also argue that McNabb isn't a run first pass second QB.

He runs because either his receivers aren't open or because the protection has broken down.

Look at who McNabb had to throw to and then look at who Montana (Rice, Taylor, Brent Jones), Elway (Rod Smith, Shannon Sharpe) and Staubach (Drew Pearson, Tony Hill, Bob Hayes, Billie Joe Dupree) had to throw to.

Secondly, Montana and Elway were very much considered scrambling quarterbacks, especially when they first got in the league. But as they had better teams built around them and as they aged, their need to scramble decreased.

Again, I really don't understand the argument about scrambling quarterbacks not being able to win because it doesn't consider the totality of the team. If you have a solid offense and defense around you, you (a QB) won't have to scramble as much and that increases your team's chances of winning - even in a Super Bowl.

 

[Cowchips]

Romo should be starting. He is a leader and has the backing of the team. He will only get better as he plays. drew is a nice QB, but a statue with an unimpressive OL is not a good way to go.

Has the backing of the team? Since when? Do you have a special in with T. Glenn and others that we don't know about? I tend to doubt they want Romo anymore than Buffalo's players wanted Losman.

If you want to know what would happen with Romo, take a look at what happened to JP Losman after he started playing against the 1st stringers.

Even Tom Brady was only effective because they dumbed down the offense the 1st year and had a great defense and special teams. Since the Cowboys have a marginal defense and suspect running game and special teams, Romo would be a huge mistake.

 

[joseephuss]

With a straight face, are you telling us that McNabb and Montana have similar styles of play. That when you think of McNabb, you think of Montana.

Sorry, but the closest comparison to Montana I can make is Tom Brady. Though I like McNabb (hate the Iggles), I can't seem to find it in myself to compare his style of play to that of Joe Cool.

I looked at my post again and still don't see where I mentioned Montana. Nope, nowhere is his name in my post. I said McNabb is a pass first, run second QB. Seems pretty straight forward. It doesn't even insinuate that McNabb is in Montana's class(he isn't by the way, but you seem easily confused).

 

[tyke1doe]

I disagree on the Crayton INT...Crayton should have been where the ball went. He ran a lazy route on that play and was not where his QB expected him to be; I'm sure he will hear about that this week. But I suppose ultimately an INT is an INT and it will always count against the QB's stats. I'm not saying that Romo did not make some mistakes; he most certainly did. But I do not hold him completely responsible for that one particular play.

Actually, I agree with you. I must not have stated it as clearly in my initial post. The INT was Crayton's fault.

 

[itoldyouSOE]

I'm not even in on the conversation and I can see the insane amount of spin doctoring going on in that post.



And Brady plays nothing like Montana played.

Well, I watched both of 'em play, and I'd have to say I disagree with you.

Even Jimmy thinks so:

“Whatever ‘it’ is, Tom Brady has it,” former Dallas Cowboys coach and Fox analyst Jimmy Johnson said. “Joe Montana didn’t have the great arm like a Dan Marino or a John Elway, or the great speed, but he made the clutch plays. Tom Brady makes the clutch plays.”

I could pull up about 5,000 other links to support my "spin", but I think you've gotten the point.

 

[Cowchips]

And Romo is someone who seems to have great pocket awareness, good field vision and very good accuracy. If he's more than that we don't know yet, because we haven't had a chance to find out.

This isn't a zero sum game - its okay to be happy that we potentially have two good QBs on this team.

And has only played against 2nd and 3rd stringers. Anyone sold on Romo taking over for Bledsoe needs some serious help.

 

[Doomsday101]

And has only played against 2nd and 3rd stringers. Anyone sold on Romo taking over for Bledsoe needs some serious help.

Bledsoe is the starter I think Romo can come in if need be and run this team. Romo like other backups has seen action aginst mainly 2nd string however he has seen action aginst 1st string defense as well this pre-season and has done as well as any backup out there and better than most.

 

[tyke1doe]

Steve Young even more so.

Good addition. Major oversight on my part.

Steve Young illustrates even more this point.

Young was definitely a scrambling quarterback. However, he became less of a scrambling QB as he begin to have confidence in his teammates. And he had some great players surrounding him.

I guess one could also argue that as he became more competent at the QB position and reading defenses, he became a better QB and didn't have to scramble as much.

I guess one can make the argument that McNabb still has to achieve this. But McNabb's supporting cast wasn't and isn't nearly as good as the cast Young, Elway, Staubach and Montana had surrounding them.

 

[Cowchips]

Well, I watched both of 'em play, and I'd have to say I disagree with you.

Even Jimmy thinks so:

“Whatever ‘it’ is, Tom Brady has it,” former Dallas Cowboys coach and Fox analyst Jimmy Johnson said. “Joe Montana didn’t have the great arm like a Dan Marino or a John Elway, or the great speed, but he made the clutch plays. Tom Brady makes the clutch plays.”

I could pull up about 5,000 other links to support my "spin", but I think you've gotten the point.

I am 100% sold that Brady is the best QB in the league since Montana and maybe John Elway. But those guys are few and far between. Romo needs to show a lot more before he should be compared to Brady, just because Brady beat out Bledsoe.

Keep in mind that New England in their glory years had great defense, great running game and great special teams. The Cowboys aren't even close to being able to win if they can't get something more than average production from the offense, which is what they got from Brady for his 1st 2 years as a starter.

 

[itoldyouSOE]

I looked at my post again and still don't see where I mentioned Montana. Nope, nowhere is his name in my post. I said McNabb is a pass first, run second QB. Seems pretty straight forward. It doesn't even insinuate that McNabb is in Montana's class(he isn't by the way, but you seem easily confused).

Look at your post again. I said Montana and Elway were not considered run first, pass second QBs, (as claimed by another poster) and you said "neither is McNabb." Thus, like it or not, you were making a comparison to McNabb and Montana (and Elway). When I embarass you for this, you act all coy like you made no such comparison.

I'll say it again, McNabb and Montana do not have a similar style of play.

 

[tyke1doe]

Well, I watched both of 'em play, and I'd have to say I disagree with you.

Even Jimmy thinks so:

“Whatever ‘it’ is, Tom Brady has it,” former Dallas Cowboys coach and Fox analyst Jimmy Johnson said. “Joe Montana didn’t have the great arm like a Dan Marino or a John Elway, or the great speed, but he made the clutch plays. Tom Brady makes the clutch plays.”

I could pull up about 5,000 other links to support my "spin", but I think you've gotten the point.

With all due respect, the issue here (if I'm interpreting it correctly) is not that Brady is like Montana as a clutch player but whether Brady is like Montana with respect to scrambling ability.

Brady = Montana in ability to make clutch plays.

Brady - Montana in their ability to scramble.

Brady moves in the pocket. He's not a scrambler in the sense that Montana was.

And within the context, the issue here is about the ability of scrambling quarterbacks to win Super Bowls. So the clutch play factor isn't an issue in as much as the scrambling ability of both quarterbacks is.

 

[JackMagist]

I guess its a matter of perspective. I doubt many fans in Denver or SF would agree that Elway and Montana were run first, pass second QBs. The fact that you call them scrambling QBs who just happened to be good passers is laughable. They are agile but I don't think if you look in the dictionary under scrambling/running QBs that Montana or Elway are going to be pictured.

I don't think there has ever been a QB that didn't play in a wishbone offense that was run first pass second (except maybe Vick...but that is another story). That is a ridiculous concept at the pro level and yes Staubach, Elway, Montana and Young all had the reputation as scrambling QB. Denying it won't change it.

But how is this germane to a discussion of Romo? Romo moves in the pocket to avoid the rush and try to find a receiver. He is in no way a "run first" QB though you seem to hold it against him that he has that ability in greater abundance than Bledsoe.

 

[itoldyouSOE]

I am 100% sold that Brady is the best QB in the league since Montana and maybe John Elway. But those guys are few and far between. Romo needs to show a lot more before he should be compared to Brady, just because Brady beat out Bledsoe.

Keep in mind that New England in their glory years had great defense, great running game and great special teams. The Cowboys aren't even close to being able to win if they can't get something more than average production from the offense.

In no way was I comparing Romo to Brady. Romo has proven he can win some preseason games. He has shown us nothing in a real game. Brady has proven that, with a great D, good running game, and clutch FG kicker, that he can help his team win a champsionship. I think Montana was more critical to his team than Brady, but I do not deny Brady's greatness, nor the fact that he plays cool like Montana and is not renowned for having a gun of an arm, also like Montana.

 

[Doomsday101]

I don't think there has ever been a QB that didn't play in a wishbone offense that was run first pass second (except maybe Vick...but that is another story). That is a ridiculous concept at the pro level and yes Staubach, Elway, Montana and Young all had the reputation as scrambling QB. Denying it won't change it.

But how is this germane to a discussion of Romo? Romo moves in the pocket to avoid the rush and try to find a receiver. He is in no way a "run first" QB though you seem to hold it against him that he has that ability in greater abundance than Bledsoe.

I agree if Romo was looking to run 1st he would not have thrown the TD with 17 seconds left to play. Romo was moving but was constantly looking in the endzone for someone to get open he found his man and was able to get the ball to him. I saw many other occations where Romo moved only to buy some time not to just take off and run.

 

[joseephuss]

Look at your post again. I said Montana and Elway were not considered run first, pass second QBs, (as claimed by another poster) and you said "neither is McNabb." Thus, like it or not, you were making a comparison to McNabb and Montana (and Elway). When I embarass you for this, you act all coy like you made no such comparison.

I'll say it again, McNabb and Montana do not have a similar style of play.

I am embarassed. I am now giving myself 50 lashes in shame.

So, do you think McNabb is a run first, pass second QB?

Do you think Bledsoe and Montana have similar styles? Bledsoe passes first and runs second(if at all). No, they have two very distinct styles.

 

[Zaxor]

Whocares about blame? It's the preseason. Here's what bothers me.

Other than the Saints game this offense moved the bal but didn't put points ont he board. Unacceptable. Vandy had 2 misses? Big deal. 6 points cannot replace 14 anyway.

I love it that we are throwing the football. I believe the offense will get it together. No critical injuries last night though some bumps and bruises to key players is concerning. Lucky there's a long week to Sunday. They'll be ready. We're moving the ball but not scoring. That has to change.

Let Commanders and Eagles fans play the blame game. In football there are basic irrefutable facts. It takes an entire team to win...and lose. We didn't play well enough to win. Bottom line.

Hopefully that and some anger by Parcells wakes some people up for Jacksonville.

Screw the "he's my favorite QB" agendas and finger pointing at individuals. As a team we need to score more. When the defense is giving us 10 point efforts we can't squander that away. That is what is unacceptable.

boy and howdy...you hit that one out of the park <---ref. to your sig